Bamboo - the new 15mm copper.
 

I just came across this adventurer's blog, Lusaka to London on a bamboo bicycle. He arrived for the opening of the Paralympics.

The bike is from Zambikes.

There's a picture of the front rack here.

http://i1263.photobucket.com/albums/...a/p1010773.jpg


The joints, as on the bike itself, are made from hemp soaked in epoxy resin, wound tightly round the components as appropriate, lacquered and polished.
FAQ’s | Zamboo Bikes - Bamboo Road Bikes

The bikes are now obtainable in London.
Mmmmmm

If you are riding solo, I have always thought it a good idea to just rest the frame assembly on the rear seat. The cushioning will act as suspension and reduce shock loads from your bags.

When I first started this thread I was a hard pannier fan, but like a lot of people I've changed my position and am now thinking soft-luggage is the way forward. If nothing else it'll be easier to store note I've moved from a French house with garage to a London flat with tiny shed.

But I'm not yet convinced by any of the soft luggage available, it's either too small, the wrong shape, or most importantly the wrong price.

So I'm contemplating a semi-rigid system, the plan is to ditch a full rack in preference for something which simply keeps the luggage off my high exhaust. That way it won't need to be as sturdy, nor as complicated to fabricate given I only have a shed. I know Chris and I have discussed the merits of a rack (on his site) in providing addition triangulation, so the plan is to run a single tube from the pillion pegs up over the exhaust to the rear rack attachment points.

Now attaching the luggage. Again Chris on his site has brought up one of the problems of throwover luggage, the fact that it's hard to consistently put the luggage in the right place especially when tired or rushed. So rather than straps going from one bag to the other I'm thinking of a harness which straps firmly over and under the seat, staying in place and onto which attach the bags, probably with large side-release clips.

http://www.pennineoutdoor.co.uk/imag...LL-500x500.jpg

This hopefully solves the problem of consistent attachment points.

And now the semi-rigid luggage itself. The plan here is to separate the functions, support, crash-resistance, water-proofing. What I have in mind is a U-shaped piece of flexible plastic (an old water drum) which hangs from the harness. Each side will have eyelets punched through, and through these a web of paracord so that the the luggage can be compressed to suit the contents. Something like this:

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-x...520-%25201.jpg

The idea then is to put waterproof stuff sacks inside, as many or as few as required, tighten the paracord, then fold the to over and secure with buckles. It means for instance that you can have a stuff sack full off all your heavy items at the bottom, with another on top for lighter stuff. Also I can quickly shed my waterproofs and just stuff them into the paracord web.

Hopefully this long waffling ramble makes some sense, and if anyone's got thoughts, comments, or wants to shout "No!" feel free.

Now I was going to say that great minds think alike, but you'd probably (and rightly so) feel insulted :rofl:.

This however is as far as I've got along similar lines albiet with an existing rack in place:

https://sites.google.com/site/poorat...i/platey-thing

The "Green Range" is of course the old National service type army pack with a lot of the straps cut off and replaces with plastic clips. The "Platey thing" though allows said clips to be secured in multiple directions under the bag so the strap takes the weight of the load rather than just having the structure of the bag (particularly the stitching) in shear.

I get my soft bags on in 2 minutes (there is some strap tensioning) and off in 30 seconds, so on that score at least as good as plastic boxes.

I love your string bag idea though :thumbup1: and now propose to plagerise it mercilessly (sorry :innocent: ).

Andy

And also with the bike on a side-stand makes it a big faff as well.

I used Ortlieb Cycle panniers bought second hand. They just clip on.

I knew that the clips wouldn't stand up to rattling around trail-riding so used a couple of cam-straps to cinch everything up tight.

The whole setup worked really well. While camped for the night, I left the straps looped slack on the rack. In the morning, load panniers, clip on, tighten straps, ride off.
They are perhaps a little small for some but that was deliberate; stopped me carrying too much crap.

Under the seat is actually a good idea for any throwover, I realised. Makes them mildly less nickable, and will say put when empty.

It looks a bit 'pikey' to me (insert 'pot call kettle black' emoticon here ;-) but the great thing is it costs next to nothing to try it out, plus you can easily repair or replace on the road. I think I'd get a general purpose [dry] bag the right shape and bung all your stuff in that and then in your harness. And I'd rivet on a PVC 'bellows' front and back and use short cam straps instead of the laces to do the tension. A bit more protection.
Look forward to seeing a finished version. You could chop of out of one of these (as BoB Andy used in a cradle on his CCM) though that would be box shape not curve. if you want the more common squarer shape 30L ones, I found car washes have them going spare (ex soap), but they get a bit wide unless you can heat and reform.

I know the problem of not having the luxury of anywhere to work other than a landing or kitchen, with limits what can actually be made but encourages lateral thinking. Where I'm staying now I'm renting a farmer's workshop which helps a lot.

I've also coming round to a plate. That pipe clamp idea was a wild goose chase - see green edit on earlier post.

The way I see it a plate replicates the rigidity of a welded 18mm rectangle which most OTS racks are based on, but can be cut from a slab of ally, plastic or wood and if thick enough, bolted straight to a bike subframe, eliminating an OTS rack.
You can then trim, drill holes or slots or screw/bolt on fittings as you like. Much more versatile than a rectangle of tube.

I happened to find a broken slab of chopping board-like nylon on a beach. A bit warped but at 10mm thick ought to be stiff enough to do the job combined with my half-finished metal frame.

Ortlieb Cycle pannier system brilliant - I can testify to that - but for me way too small for moto overlanding and as BYT says, probably not tough enough for moto forces without loop strap support. It's telling their QL2 moto version only clips to 16mm tube max - as if to discourage use with most OTS 18mm racks.


Ch

Pikey? Pikey? Yes I know what you mean, I'm working on that. Drifting towards the idea of the plastic being shaped more like an unfolded envelope (if that makes sense?) which would give a bit more protection at the sides and somewhere to attach external pockets. I tend to thrash out every possible permutation in my head before making so it could be a while, and I'm still not certain this is any better than tweaked fabric panniers anyway, maybe just use the plastic inside a fabric pannier, after all? I'm definitely going to work on the under/over seat attachment thingy though, although it occurred to me that even easier might be to attach short pieces of webbing directly to the bike's frame with clips/buckles on the other end to attach the panniers to.

I know in my mind I'm always partly thinking "how would I put this into production so that it works on a range of bikes?" in which case it needs to be adjustable and my idea of it going over and under the seat is simpler, but for a one off then attaching directly to the bike's frame is probably better.

Mind you it's all got to be better than this, cargo nets and hotel laundry bags.

http://sphotos-c.ak.fbcdn.net/hphoto...47519248_n.jpg

But in the meantime I stumbled across this video of a rack for fabric panniers, professionally made, and thought I'd post it up in case it gave anyone any ideas.



Chris I'm hoping the machined aluminium clamps I posted might be helpful, I've just ordered a few to see what quality/strength is like, when they turn up I'll let you know.

I like that low-profile platform rack, looks properly made too.
Who makes that? I'd go as far as buying and adapting that if the price was normal and dims and attachment points were in the ball park.

One idea I've had, based on how I interpreted the vaguely similar 'Angolan' rack, was adding a same ø bar above the bottom main tube (welded), or behind and above it, as pictured below (easily clamped).

That way, for less rigid soft bags you can slot in (or hinge down) a board which will be cantilevered off the added back bar and platform edge, giving you width support when needed. Should you fall or need slimness (to get through a hotel door), the board will either slot out, flip up or just come away, and should it break is the sort of thing that's not hard to replace on the road. Plus its use is optional anyway. The Angolan rack works in a similar way, but uses fixed tubing - bend prone maybe but also less likely to come away and get caught in the spokes as a loose board may do.
Tubed rectangle or wooden board, I like the idea of a cantilevered, hinge-out platform.

I know what you mean about thinking a lot before taking action, especially when resources or a location to take action are limited. You want to get it right first time. I like the idea of clips permanently attached to the pillion peg area and rear of a frame to fix the bottom of the pans and stop them swinging. One less thing to fiddle with and those clips are light to carry as spares, and easy to replace, even with a knot if you can't sew at the time.

I'm not sure how I could use those ally clamps which seem to be hose guides rather than weight bearing. Anyway, as mentioned I've ditched the clamp assembly idea and have nearly finished my slackrack which has been fun to figure out but could get thrown in a skip if something better comes along (or if it falls apart on the first speed bump...). All would be so much simpler if a proper luggage rack was available for my bike that wasn't set too far back.

That's a modified Hepco & Becker rack, the platform loop being one of the tweaks, the other being all the attachment points to fix it to a Derbi Terra Adventure. It was made in Singapore where I get the feeling there are still little welding shops down back streets who'll do stuff like this unlike the UK where you have to traipse around industrial estates.

I've tweaked my Pikey Bag idea a bit (it will forever be known as this) but am keeping the general idea of laced sides. This is mainly to suit my bike which has a high exhaust, the thought being that if my rack keeps the bags off the silencer then the bag can expand below it (think BMW Ali boxes) while still being rigid enough too not swing into the wheel.

But you and I are diverging at this point because my soft-rack if really only to prevent the bags swinging about I plan on supporting the load more like throw-over panniers, although quick release, it may even be that all I need is something like the SW-Motech system I posted on your blog ages ago which cantilevers solely off the foot pegs.

Just spotted a nice hinged platform rack - though perhaps a bit wide for non-vineyard applications. More pics here.

Ch

http://www.borile.it/imgs/newmultiuso/bis/SAG_0156.jpg

http://www.borile.it/imgs/newmultiuso/bis/SAG_0145.jpg

I dunno, 12 bottles a side if you turn the cases round, lash the bivvy bag, french stick and kilo of pate on the pillion seat and I'd be OK for a nights summer camping :innocent:

Andy

Wine rack
 

You'll need berets too.

The more I look at it the more I like it - in a narrowed form. It's like the Angolan rack mentioned earlier and reminds me it's what I need on the non-pipe side of my GS-R but haven't got round to yet.

Wine rack one side, pipe rack the other. Need somewhere for the Comte.

Materials
 

Some ideas on the materials

The nylon chopping board. As purchased from super markets. I found it good at the start but deteriorates in the OZie sun after a few years making it brittle. I used it as a mounting system tongue on the bike interfaced with two aluminium bars on the pannier.

Wood. If you are going to use wood – use marine grade stuff – it should put up with water better! Particularly important if you go for plywood.

Tubing. The bicycle stuff looks to be moving to stainless steel- this is not painted, so as the panniers abrade the surface it does not eventually rust. Seams like another good idea. Tubus make the best (well one of the best) bicycle racks and have a few stainless models. Old Man Mountain looks to be offering a stainless shim to go over some of the ware points on their aluminium tubed bicycle racks. Might be a better idea - get some stainless shim, cut it and for it up then clip over your steel and painted rack to make a hard wearing rustles surface.

Tubing supplies (possibly other stuff) Like 4130 tubing, seat foam,
they have been mentioned here before (where I got it from). Pilot Supplies and Aircraft Parts from Aircraft Spruce


PS Chris that 'seat' looks too narrow for more than a 2 hour ride. :rofl:

Made these racks recently for a Honda CRF230F in readiness for a six day trailride through northern Portugal.

I'd already extended the CRF subframe so that a toolkit could be safely carried (15mm tube bent, shoved in to the end of the stock subframe and then welded in place). On to the subframe extension I welded some 25mm x 6mm steel brackets in addition to a bracket on the stock subframe near the swing arm pivot. The racks themselves are an old pair of airhead rackets with ll of the brackets removed, I made my own to suit, welded them on, had the racks powdercoated and they worked well, strong enough to survive several falls.

http://possu.smugmug.com/Motorcycles...00763_01-M.jpg

http://possu.smugmug.com/Motorcycles...00664_01-M.jpg

http://possu.smugmug.com/Motorcycles...00678_01-M.jpg

http://possu.smugmug.com/Motorcycles...P1000671-M.jpg

http://possu.smugmug.com/Motorcycles...00676_01-M.jpg

http://possu.smugmug.com/Travel/2014...10002_01-M.jpg

Instead of full size panniers, we used Wolfman tank panniers as they're narrower but still large enough for the trip. I'm thinking of adding a Tooltube mount later in the year.

It's my partners bike, I was not responsible for the above crash, I slipped on loose rocks trying to recover the bike. :oops2:

640 frames
 

http://www.dualsportbc.com/photogall...0/IMG_2412.JPG
A piece of drywall to shield the plastics from sparks
http://www.dualsportbc.com/photogall...0/IMG_2416.JPG
Back bracket welded in place
left side rack
http://www.dualsportbc.com/photogall...0/IMG_2420.JPG
Started on the left side, had to extend it farther out to clear the muffler and sidepanel
http://www.dualsportbc.com/photogall...0/IMG_2422.JPG
Rear mounting point
http://www.dualsportbc.com/photogall...0/IMG_2428.JPG
Welded and in place, I decided to put an additional triangle brace to the frame hoop for extra strength..
http://www.dualsportbc.com/photogall...0/IMG_2426.JPG
Added the same brace to the right side as well...


http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/n...ps9f3c89b4.jpg
fabricated parts painted..
http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/n...psabd93676.jpg
painted racks in place

http://www.dualsportbc.com/photogall...0/IMG_2893.JPG
The mounting plates fit perfect on my home made racks
http://www.dualsportbc.com/photogall...0/IMG_2898.JPG
Back end view

My idea of an ideal rack is that no one section would cause the deformation of another or the subframe,so using flat strap mounted vertically of enough length to allow some horizonal flex and easily straightened if need be. no part stronger or more ridgid than the subframe. so firmly tying them together side to side would not follow those guidelines . I would rather repair the bag frame than the bike frame.my .01,.02 would just be inflation.

Not using the cross brace at the back of the panniers to tie them together will put more stress on the subframe, not less... This brace allows one side to support the other instead of having it torque and twist inward on the frame mounting points... When you ride over very rough ground without the brace the twisting action from the weighted frames work the bolt mounting points and may eventually cause them to snap... Also a strongly built system will actually make the entire sub frame area more rigid and less likely to bend in a crash.. The toughest frames available for my bike are the ones made by H.B. , I had them on the previous bike and they made the whole back end very strong... The only beef I had with the design is that they hung out too far and with the bags in place made the bike ridiculously wide, the ideal setup is to have the width of the tail load no wider than the handle bars...

I like this rack built by Ron Seida (soft luggage with removable Pelican) quite a nifty idea, so i bookmarked this years ago.

http://i214.photobucket.com/albums/c...n/_MG_9099.jpg

Mezo.

Having recently bought a Triumph Thunderbird (2003 triple) I will soon be making a set of luggage racks for it. Gone mad and decided to use 12mm marine grade (en316) stainless steel bars. Hope to be complete before the end of March 2015 ready for the touring season.

I am just about to purchase some mild steel tube so I can make myself a luggage rack. I've done some searching but can't find a definitive answer...

What is the most appropriate thickness of round tube to use, as in wall thickness and outside diameter? Some posts have suggested 1mm wall thickness and some 2mm? What thickness are manufactured racks usually?

I know it will be a trade off between weight and strength but what's my best bet? I read one post that suggested 1mm wall thickness would get a bit thin on the outside of a curve due to the stretch.

My plan is to use a plumbers spring inside the tube and bend it using oxy acetaline. Will this be ok? I haven't got a pipe bender....

i would recommend 2mm, personaly i think 1mm is too thin!
several months ago i made racks for my C B500x, i used 2.2mm, to bend it i modified my normal pipe bender.

made these using 45 year old plus rods, so welds really ugly :(

all EN 316 stainless steel. I don't do flimsy. Rack and throw over guards.

http://www.triumphrat.net/attachment...t-p1020789.jpg

couldn't post two urls ???

http://www.triumphrat.net/attachment...y-p1020791.jpg

I came up with this simple C-rack or 'Ear Rack' idea to help support some throwovers on my Himalayan.
Made from one-inch and only 2-point mounting (actually 2 bolts up top) so may fold in a heavy crash, but I prefer the minimum needed to get the job done. Worked fine out in Morocco with a set of Kriega OS22s.

22mm actually Chris ;-)
Glad they worked out.

just had a read though the thread to get some ideas for a lightweight rear rack and frames for my little super sherpa 250 :thumbup1:

I've made racks for my TTR250, first from 10mm steel bar, and Mk2 from 12mm diameter 2mm wall steel tube. The bar bends quite easily around a former (eg some sawn-off scaffold tube) Tube ideally needs a pipe bender for tight curves but larger radii are possible without. Use 25mm x 3mm flat to make mounting points wherever is convenient on the bike (passenger footpeg brackets, exhaust bolt mounts etc) and find your local friendly agricultural engineer to weld it all together!


My Mk1 on the ttr forum:
https://ttr250.activeboard.com/t60980288/load-carrying/


Mk2 on the left in this pic:

014.jpg


I use Andystrapz throwovers. (Poor man's Magadans but I'm very happy with them!)

I've just finished making a rack + pannier mounts for an old classic bike I'm going travelling on in the summer. Bending tube without some kind of former to stop it collapsing (so DIY level) is almost impossible (in my experience anyway). I made the system in the picture below using a lucky find of an old rack in a junk shop. It didn't fit (not surprisingly), but I cut the bends out and used them with some straight tube to make a rack that did.

The other bends were done by 'cut and shut' - cut a V section (or a number of them) out of the tube, close the gaps up until the bend is correct and weld up the cuts. Crude but effective. It is a lot easier to make stuff for these old bikes as there's plenty of available mounting points, so no having to cut plastic away or anything.

I looked at various tube diameters and wall thicknesses and went for 16mm with 1.5mm wall thickness. 1.00mm wall thickness wasn't really strong enough + it was easy to blow holes in when welding it, whereas 2.00mm seemed like overkill for the amount of luggage I'd be carrying and was very heavy. I used 25 x 4mm flat to make the mounting brackets.

https://i.postimg.cc/PJG0VcWK/DS6-Mar22.jpg