Winches:- Hydraulic vs. Electric
 

Having stumbled across and read through the www.4x4winches.com site, Í'm left wondering if hydraulic winches have any down sides, except perhaps lack of speed, because most people seem to have gone electric. Am I missing somthing here, or is it just that Warn etc have better publicity departments?

[This message has been edited by Baldrick (edited 03 September 2002).]

There is a winch thread at http://www.horizonsunlimited.com/ubb...ML/000237.html in which I lament the fact that my vehicle came with an electric winch. I've since had the winch serviced (hah! the only original parts left are the drum, the cable and the remote, they even changed the id plate!) and it works better; it hardly notices pulling little cars (TLC,LR etc.;-) but still puts a hell of a load on the battery when I self recover. For the weight, go hydraulic, the only advantage of electric that I can see is that you can cut the power cables to length yourself; where the hydraulic lines have to be prepared by someone with a big crimping thing (any tractor and farm machinery supplier anywhere)AFAIK.
There's also a link to a travelogue diary page describing the recovery of a Mog by a 101 using... you guessed it, a Mile Marker
Happy reading, hope it helps
Luke

Although the facts in that article are correct, they kind of emphasized some facts over others to justify their hydraulic winch preference.

Aside from mounting the winch itself, which is the same for both types, installing hydros is a bit more involved. Modifying all those power high pressure steering fluid hoses isn’t for the faint of heart and better left for a professional with the right tools. Electrics are a snap to install, 2 wires to the two battery terminals.

Another important point is that power steering pump will work extra hard during winching. Manufacturers install just adequate steering pumps to save money. Any extra work will eventually take its toll. That’s not an issue with big or heavy-duty 4x4 however. That’s why it’s always recommended to install a hydro fluid cooler with hydro winches. In fact if the vehicles sees a lot of off-road a hydro cooler is a good idea even without a hydro which.

Just for that fact alone I recommend hydro winches only for big or heavy-duty vehicles. For my Jeep Wrangler, I opted to get an electric.

Electrics are great but they are for intermittent use as mentioned in the article. But I seldom find this to be a problem, since in real life I rarely continuously operate the winch. There’s a lot of time to cool down during setup, re rigging and repositioning the vehicle. And I’ve been using it in the Sahara.

For electrical winches to work efficiently you better get a new high capacity deep cycle battery. Better yet, get two and a battery manager. It will make your life much easier and recovery faster.

A deep cycle batter withstands deep battery discharge and recharge better than regular battery and will live longer. However make sure that it’s for automotive or marine use otherwise they won’t have enough cold cranking amps to start the vehicle.

Hope this helps.

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A.B.

OasisPhoto.com – Images from the Magical Sahara.
ShortWheelbase.com – Jeep preparations.

Hydraulic is the way to go, completely. The only disadvantage (in theory) is that the engine has to be running - but, try running your electric winch without the engine running, you've got seconds at most.

Yes installation is a little more complicated, but can be done professionally without being too expensive.

Also, unless you are winching hugely (which is rare) the extra strain on the steering pump is negligible over it's whole working life.

Sam.

Just to add my 1.3p worth...

My wife and I did a 9-month expedition across Africa a few years back, and are planning a RTW trip departing in April. Based on my experience, a winch is (only just) worth taking. But if you REALLY need it (i.e. not a simple tug to save a bit of work), then a hydraulic (or mechanical) winch is a must.

I have a Milemarker fitted to our 6x6 Land Rover conversion, with a dedicated pump driven by the 300Tdi engine. (Actually, the standard power steering pump is ok, but it's a bit slower than is ideal for the MM, and the extra pump kit was pretty cheap and easy to fit.)

You're not going to screw up your pump unless you use the winch commercially, day in and day out. Your power steering works pretty much ALL the time you are driving (not a maximum pressure, of course), and usually outlasts the other components of your vehicle. When powering a winch, the pump will still only provide its rated pressure, so you can't "overload" it. And your winch will be used for, say, 30 hours in 5 years? (30 hours of actual winching is a LOT, unless you use it commercially!)

Basically, a failed pump is hypothetical, and is almost unheard of in the case of winches used only for vehicle recovery.

When I have been stuck and needed a winch rather than some digging and a come-along, (or seen other in that situation), it has taken half a day to do the extraction, most of it being repeated rigging and preparation, interspersed with some long, serious winch pulls, which would have flattened (and possibly ruined) several batteries, and very likely burned out a motor or two, unless several more hours were added for cooling.

The hydraulic is quiet, efficient, and powerful, with a pretty much continuous speed regardless of load. And it runs cool, so I can use Amsteel Blue rope instead of steel cable, which is a REAL pleasure!

I'm not saying electric winches aren't useful - they are great when you have several vehicles on a day outing, and some tricky spots to winch 'em through. They save time, they are versatile (can be run for a minute or two under load without the engine running if the battery is good), and they are very convenient because they spool in and out fast.

Regarding ease of installation, I only have experience with a 300Tdi Defender. I'd say it's much of a muchness. In both cases, there is a right way and a wrong way to do it, and in the case of electrics, it's probably more tempting to take short-cuts. But at the end of the day, it will depend on the kit that's supplied. The LR installation took a day, and no special tools or skills other than general mechanical ability.

Having said all of that, spend money on good tyres before a winch! http://www.horizonsunlimited.com/ubb/smile.gif

Have fun, all...

Michael...

Well put, Michael. BTW, have you got a website where we can follow your preparations and progress for the rtw?
Cheers,
Luke

Hi Luke,

No website yet, but we are working on it - one of the many things on our To Do list!

Regards,

Michael...

Ditto, only I've got a bit more time; departure planned for Autumn 2003. One day I'll get the hang of this HTML wizardry http://www.horizonsunlimited.com/ubb/smile.gif
Good luck
Luke

Luke, still no website, but I do have some pics of the vehicle development and a pilot run to Morocco.

http://www.expeditionoverland.com

How's yours coming along?

Regards,

Michael...