http://www.horizonsunlimited.com/tstories/hutchinson

A good little read:thumbup1:
What i noticed was the amount of punctures, 7 in all:helpsmilie:
I haven't had 7 punctures in over 30 years of biking, seriously:clap:
This has got to be due to riding in the gutter, where all the debris collects, you don't see road sweepers sweeping the middle of the road:cool4:
But to ride further out towards the middle of your lane on a small cc bike would be potentially dangerous.:scooter:
I think you need to be able to keep up with the flow of traffic, even if you stick to minor roads:mchappy:
Just my observations:thumbup1:


Trophymick

Small cc bikes can certainly be easily picked up, sip instead of guzzle fuel, have (generally) cheap spares, but if you plan to cover large distances at any sort of of speed, your mind will aways be on whether you are pushing it too hard, esp when it starts to wheeze up slopes and into headwinds.

The handling and braking (with luggage) at speed will not be anywhere that of a bigger machine, and it depends on how much distance you are planning to ride on broken tracks, as compared to roads. Having heavy vehicles whoosh past with a speed differential of 50 kph is not fun, if you do not have what it takes to travel with the flow.

Arterial routes are boring no doubt, but they are sometimes the best means to spend an extra day or two at interesting destinations.

Two views
 

I have two views on this, depending on which day of the week it is.

1. Yes, true and so a bike around the 600-700cc mark is the optimum for travelling.

2. Nope, there are no interesting destinations anyway and it is the journey that matters.
(Isn't that why some riders go long distances almost entirely off-road?)

travelling light
 

I actually have a an old x reg honda 90 in the front garden.......its only done 3500 miles since new.although looking tatty. I would lay a bet it would start if i put in a new battery and cleaned the fuel lines.Its even got its original tyres on!
i did once travel from London to Dover on it..but my rear was so sore by the end of the journey
i think it wont do more than 55mph and as its only a 6 volt battery i would be worried about lousy lighting!.......mind you it always was relaible before it got neglected in the front garden.
your comments are really great .thank you all!

I can remember reading in MCN that Chinese bikes were rated as being the highest theft risk by British insurance companies. The theory that MCN put forward was that people buy them cheap, find that they are unreliable within 6 months but not covered under warranty so set fire to them and claim them as being stolen. I'd rather take my chances with the Honda you've got in your front garden.

Alternatively, try the Autotrader website for a Yamaha Diversion or similar. A half decent used one will be less than a Chinese 250.

Reliability
 

Im sure not long from now the Chineese will resolve these issues but for the moment alot of these bikes are not built to the same standards of the Japanese Bikes. So you are probably better off going for something more reliable. I have toured Europe on a Yamaha TTR 250 and it was a great bike. Ok I could not match the speed of bigger bikes but I just stayed away from the major roads and got to see alot more of the country side and small towns that the new routes have bypassed. A lot of UK based companies have gone bust because of the poor quality of the machines they offer.

Whatever you decide enjoy the ride.:mchappy:

changing my mind
 

i think i am in the process of changing my mind as to which bike...the 90 isa rear ens night mare .more than 20 mile and your shifting a lot in the saddle.so i would have to buy one of the single broader saddles i think if i was to use it
I have started to cast about for other bikes and so thanks for the suggestions.
with my weight the 90 would probabaly only chug along at about 40-45 anyway!

Do Not
 

I'm all for distance touring on small bikes. I'm to 21,000 miles this year on my XT350, and I live where it snows half the year (MN/WI). However, I cannot recommend the trip you have in mind.

I lived in Ecuador last year with several friends. We all bought Chinese 200's to commute to work and ride on the weekends. My buddy had his SWING ARM BOLT FAIL, literally while he was just riding down the road. Not off a jump, not from anything abusive, just as he was puttering along. Good thing he was slowing down when it happened. The head just popped off leaving the wheel assembly to kick over about twenty degrees and lock up the brake and bind against the subframe.

Anyway, if six weeks with an open, gangrenous wound in South America sounds fun, go for it. And maybe you like battery boxes regularly breaking and falling off, piston slap at 5,000km, non-functional blinkers, throttle cables, and master cylinders, rims that bend when you look at them funny, plastic that shatters when you breathe on it... I could go on.

These things are total garbage.

Most seem in favour of a small cc bike for touring and I'm all for it (I want to get a 400cc 1 cylinder bike for South America), just not in Europe. If you want to travel in Western/Southern/Northern Europe, a road bike with at least two cylinders is a much better option in my opinion. You are not likely to encounter much gravel, sand and mud, you'll probably spend 99% of the time on good roads. I think you'd miss the comfort and power of a bigger bike.
I own a 200cc and a 600cc 4 cylinder bike and I use the small one only in town, I don't enjoy riding it in the countryside. I always take the bigger one, it's so much more fun, especially with a pillion or luggage. You can pick up a 500 or 600cc bike here for small money. Suzuki Bandits for instance are cheap, comfortable, reliable, reasonably powerful and the naked version looks great. The Suzuki SV650 is fun, there are lots of good and cheap options.

I would happily ride any bike for which i could easily obtain spares. I think people are mixing up cc's with power. and for touring the power you want is torque, not hp.
true little bikes are light, and lightness is a very good thing. But having a low centre of gravity Ie around or below the wheel axles is good also. It also helps if you can easily hold the bike up when stopping on an adverse camber, for this you need a low seat height. Lastly mpg equals range. I would say your bike ought to be able to run (touring) for at least 3 hours continuously with no more than 20 litres of fuel. Why carry heavy weight of fuel high up?

I had a guest this week for three days. He was English and traveling from Nepal-India-Pakistan-Iran-Turkey to Greece-Italy-Germany-Belgium-France and England. He has a small 135cc Yamaha and small lauage which he get the bike from Nepal. He was quite happy with and easy to ride/maintaince/fix.

So, any bike would make the dream real. Just go for it!!

I may not be an expert, but does the engine capacity not determine torque? Apart from the engine design, as a basic principle? So if you want lots of torque for touring, you should look for a large engine capacity, I can't see a mix up there.

Sort of but no, not really.
A high capacity revvy four cylinder bike will have a good torque figure but it will be towards the higher end of its rev range and will have very little at low revs so not particularly usable grunty torque.
A big capacity single cylinder meanwhile should have lots more usable low revs torque.

Not so, but it isn't really simple. Stroke and valve timing greatly affect the amount of torque, but do not forget flywheel size (often related to stroke) Changing the conrod length also makes quite a difference. Is why later 1979 on (or therabouts) Triumphs had more torque due to shorter conrods. Sadly it also reduced its ability to rev, so the earlier say 1970 650's and before bikes rev much higher. An Enfield 500cc single has more torque at 2,000 revs than a 1000cc BMW r100 (I think 1150 gs also ). A soft tuned bike such as an Enfield or old 650 Triumph thunderbird makes pottering about much easier than something that needs lots of revs because you can just ride with the clutch released. Not so with some 600cc four cylinder engines. Not as high an ultimate top speed, but much easier touring.

But you have to have All the features I mentioned for the best ride.

I seem to remember you were planning a trip to Austria but had limited time to complete it. If so, you will need to use the autobahns and unless you really want to be a liability to yourself, you need a bike that will comfortably maintain at least 70-80mph.

I spoke to a German woman and her friend at Cochem on the Mosel, on their way back from Eastern Europe. She had a Kawasaki ER5 which in my opinion would be ideal for this guy's needs. I've ridden one and although they're nothing special, they're cheap, reliable and more than fast enough for touring at a sedate pace.