Why not a Mercedes G Wagen?
 

Why do they receive such good reviews and recommendations and yet only me and Russ have one:taz:

I suspect there is another G Wagen owner lurking ( might be viewing on his toughbook)

So tell us why they're good then...

Challenge accepted, though you will have to wait 'till tomorrow for a decent answer - Bottle of wine clouding vision at the moment (though not my belief that you could do a lot worse that buy an old G wagen).

but for a start :-
a rock solid chassis even on a 30 year old model
Probably the most reliable diesel engines ever made though slightly under powered. Well known to do 500,000 miles - there is a taxi driving around Athens with 5 million miles on without a rebuild.
Mechanical diff locs on both axels
Parts available virtually anywhere ( everything available through any Main dealer anywhere)
Everyone turns their heads because they are so pretty

After a little research, 15 mpg might have something to do with it lol

Whats the MPG on your G wagen? - Page 3 - Benzworld.org - Mercedes-Benz Discussion Forum

:innocent:

Well you should have done a little more research because you chose to look at a G500 - a V8 5litre which will give a Porsche a decent race.(still better consumption than the petrol Range rovers and land cruisers)
I am talking about the diesels which will give you 25 - 30 mpg.
Even the petrol 230 should give 26mpg.
My old 240 gives me 32mpg and will run on anything that will burn - no electronics, no fancy metering systems - doesn't even need a battery once it is running.
Right up to the early nineteen nineties you get basic mechanical injection and simple low maintenance engines.
These things are so over engineered once you have been through the basic service and mechanicals then you can expect a fairly trouble free life.

That would still bankrup me in a week. If I'm not getting 50mpg, I'm not playing :scooter:

Looks like that rules out quite a few bikes as well, even our 86 Teneres only manage 46

http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=309049

Sure does... Have you not seen the pump prices ??

If you're going to do serious mileages, then it HAS to be a major consideration.

Unless, you're minted ...

But, horses for courses and all that but -
2 people, 2 bikes is the same mpg as
2 people, one G wagen and a lot more kit ( different kind of fun mind)

You've got a good point there...

Same reason I'm ditching my bike for a Combi Van for my next trip..

Although, that still does 50mpg. I guess that's equivalent of 100mpg per person ??

:innocent:

have you considered doing this:-
Doesn't affect mileage too much and quick and easy

I hadn't......

But now I am bier

Thats a bit neat Silver G! Do you take the chain off or leave it attached?

I've done both. We use it around North Africa just for covering long/boring distances keeping the chain on.
If traveling on the motorway for long distances I take the chain off.
I suppose it depends on your engine - probably not good to pump cold oil around a cold engine for extended periods. Anyway a split link makes a quick job of removing the chain.

I hope he takes the chain off. Otherwise, that's a lot of miles to put his gearbox bearings for no reason.

Just been looking at the G wagon's on ebay. Wow the purchase cost would put me off straight away. I do like the fact that its fairly simple though.

What is the purchase cost of a decent reliable well looked after G wagon? I must admit, I do like them.

Always a smile when one passes.

G

I admit they are a bit high priced at the moment but it does go up and down and if we are talking about an expedition vehicle then cosmetics might not be over important. I would think that £3k would be a starting point for something from the late eighties. Beyond 1990 then you are into the 463 series and arguably the best to buy but you will need £6 or £7k.
An ex military one with low mileage can be had for around £3K at the moment and will have the full winterisation kit - webasto and block heater
And don't forget you are buying something with 100k miles on it where as similar spec Land Cruisers might have 200.000 and be in need of some serious chassis work.
Buying a g wagen should also be though of as a long term proposition as once you have it as you want then you should easilly get 10 years from it. Don't forget that what you buy in the uk is the sae as what is issued to most military markets throughout europe with the addition of carpets and comfortable seats

Just as a point of reference I have 2.
A 240GD Diesel softtop which cost me less than a thousand 4 years ago, approx 100,000 on the clock.
A 230GE petrol that I have had for 7 years - paid £2k with 106,000m on it.
This has taken me all over North Africa.

These are a couple of reviews of the new PUR 30 which is essentially the same car as my 1979 240 though with a lot more power and engine managment crap. They share the same springs, body panels, bumper panels, prop shafts and lots lots more.
RPM TV - Episode 159 - Mercedes-Benz G300 Professional Station wagon - YouTube

Mercedes G - YouTube

For those who might be up for doing engine transplants then there are some interesting options too.
3 litre 603 diesel from a 124 saloon
3 litre 606 turbo diesel fro a 124 saloon
2.9 litre turbo diesel from a sprinter van


From Mercedes you get a choice of 6 or 7 spring setups (all coil btw) for different load and ride height combinations.
5 different diff ratios
At least 5 gearbox options - a box from a 1979 will bolt right up to a current sprinter engine.
A mechanical diff loc on front and rear axles ( automatic center loc on the transfer box when you select 4wd) - a center diff loc after 1991
And an independent transfer box with syncro on change from 2wd to 4wd and high to low - after 91 you get permanent 4wd

Why?
 

Wow Chris what were you thinking posting that here??:rofl:

You’ve pretty much covered what they can have going for them. Mines the 463 series so a few more creature comforts but not as honest as my old 460 with it’s rubber mats, plastic seats, part time 4wd and zero electronics:innocent:
The 463 is still pretty basic though, the same straight six non turbo diesel found in just about every MB taxi for the past 20 years and the only electronic being the ABS. Can do 28mpg+ probably 22ish with normal everyday use.

I think people are wary of the unknown (of course the blinged up rapper spec. ones don’t help the cause) but in reality the right ones are wonderfully engineered vehicles. Put together from a parts bin of W123/4 series saloons (the W124 / 300 series allegedly the last properly engineered MB) and 300 series vans. No bad thing when you want spares.

Everyone to their own though. Ours suits our lifestyle, budget (ignoring the fuel incredibly cheap to run) and everyday usage. It gives the impression that it'll run for ever, with basic maintenance age doesn't seem to bother it. Its now 20 yrs old.
Oh and even though it's perminant 4wd it still has syncro on the transfer box. Nice and easy to move between hi and lo range on the move.

Russ

was an accident but seems to have gone unseen :smiliex:

The G spot!?!
 

Chris & Russ et al,

where would one find a 463 - I think, 300GD??,

I really like the G wagen, but would want a 3.0 TD engine - are thesr available and wjhere from, how much??
Or would it be better to buy a reasonable/decent G Wagen and have an engine transplant done?
Ideas on the above??

Ta
Chris

You are right - the 463 300 in it's basic early form like the one Russ has is probably the ideal but no turbo.And it depends on your budget and mechanical ability. If you can swap an engine then all you need do is find a good car, late 460 or early 463 and mate it with an engine from a 124 series turbodiesel then you are home and dry. A2.9turbo from a sprinter is another good choice with masses of torque at 1500rpm though the conversion is a little more complicated with the managed injection pump. Swap it with the pump from the ssanyong which is mechanical.
My ideal would probably be a late 460
606 turbodiesel (non electronic version)
5 speed granny gearbox from a merc T1 van
though auto would be many peoples choice.

All G wagens have a separate (detatched) transfer box so there are many options for gearboxes.
If you are serious then just have a drive in one or two and see what you think - It all depends what you have been used to.
Send me a pm if you want me to put you in touch with someone local to you.


NB. all G wagens come with a very good heating system

My main point here was really to say that for an expedition vehicle project where you might be spending £5k on your platform then the once overpriced G wagen is a serious contender particularly based on it's durability and readness in standard form.

Yes and that’s the bit that I really like, mine is very much mechanically standard and copes wonderfully with overland trips even though it’s the underpowered non turbo 603 engine. 113bhp when it was new so at 230k miles I’m probably lucky to see 3 figure bhp:(

I’m not in to dune bashing so can’t comment on how it would deal with that but soft sand tracks are fine.

I would not recommend any G with a retro fit turbo (I guess that goes for any engine actually). Transplanting a W124 turbo engine seems relatively common but has some clearance issues in RHD vehicles due to the proximity of the turbo/manifold and steering column.

Given the choice I would go for an auto, very basic and robust, but this is very much a personal thing.

If you really want a 300TD factory 463 mobile.de is the place to look, plenty of choice and you’ll soon get a feel for prices. LHD and auto only of course. Importing seems to be relatively painless.
Problem with RHD 463 diesels is simply a lack of supply, very rare maybe 2 or 3 a year appear for sale in the UK. Petrol’s seem far more common.
So your best option may be to go for a good 460 and do an engine transplant.
You are welcome to have a drive of mine anytime if you are around Shropshire.
Russ

Which mercedes G
 

I recently started looking into this subject, especially because of this video
:funmeteryes:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JrxqtwRZ654

I have done some trips with my transalp 650 witch is great but with the girlfriend on the back and with full luggage its not as fun.. especially off road.

So now I'm considering one of these, the later ones seem more logical to me mainly because of the price, as my budget is max €15k and it would be nice to get a low milage one.

Im a bit confused still with the engines, I think id rather go for the diesel for the torque and milage
"I drove the military version PUCH 2.3 (i think) petrol, (sloooooooow) and thirsty beer here in the swiss army..

can you guys recommend with model or model years to go for?
im also interested in weaknesses? rust or the such?

would be great to hear some stories!

I'm a dyed in the wool "land rover" man, but have just bought a 1989 SWB 460 G wagen.

It's my next project vehicle... I've pulled the engine out (280GE) and will be installing an OM606 and 722.6 gearbox.

I recognise some of the usernames on here from GWOA and CGW.... hi all! :D

What you planing on doing with the G wagen?
an overland project?

they seem to come with the old landrover level of horsepower , a 5 door would be a bit slow i would think ?

I would get an older one rather than a newer one and spend the budget doing it up to your required standard. mercedes are very good at supporting their older vehicles. I believe every part for every merc ever built is still available!

Unlike Toyota who are shite at this and would rather scrap old parts than store them!

Old mercs are renowned for theirth durability, i was wondering if there is a series with was overdeveloped like the w123.. or are they pretty much the same? how about the engines?

like all euro cars they did become increasingly electronic to deal with emissions regs, which is why I would go for an earlier one. Tom Shepherd did have a lot of trouble with his, can't remember the details and my books are all packed for a house move so I can't check:oops2:!

G engine conversion
 

Hi Jim - A build thread and results against a LR would be useful.
I'd love to know what you think of the vehicle after the conversion,
especially given your experience with landrovers.

I've driven lots of G's over the years and my favourite was a petrol auto
but found them all slow and not very agile you could feel the mass of the vehicle in soft ground, however i was tooling around in a V8 90 at the time
so not a fair comparison.

All the nice trucks I would want to own were out of my meagre budget and everything else looked like it spent its life in a salt pan.

I do like the Large G's drove a few of those and loved them but never seen one in the uk except at castlemartin.

regards all
Gren

yummee, thats a bit tasty!

g-wagon
 

if you break down in northern zambia.

in a toyota people come running to you with parts.

in a g-wagen it goes on a trailer,to somewhere expensive
and often far away
jm2c
kp

I believe they eventually tracked it down to a damaged wiring loom where it had been incorrectly fitted from new.
His was the 5 cylinder, fully electronic injection version. Pretty much the same as the newer Sprinter engines.

The only electronics in mine is the ABS, basic 6 cylinder non turbo diesel. It's a 606 engine around 140bhp which is adequate.

Up to around 1993 they were all electronic free and share loads of parts with W124 cars, and 300 series vans. Even in the UK people are scared of them but once you delve underneath they are pretty basic and anyone who has worked on MB cars or commercials will feel at home. If you're stuck (for a price) MB have a brilliant parts back up.
Would I take the 4 litre V8 diesel or a new 350 Bluetec further than Tesco’s? Umm nope:innocent:

must be because no one can think of a good reason to choose a landrover over a G wagon as the original poster asked:tt2:

[QUOTE=*Touring Ted*;353138]I'm ditching my bike for a Combi Van for my next trip../QUOTE]

Crikey Ted, what's next, cheese cloth flares, long hair and jesus beads? :eek3:

For something that is supposed to be engineered so much better than a landy , you dont see many even in the lower end of the 4x4 travel market .
It cant be cost , as you just buy to your budget , and cut your cloth ?

i seem to remember a somewhat eventful publicity trip in Australia ? :thumbdown:

The plan with my one is to make a tidy road going vehicle, with the occasional off road trip.. the 110 is my main laning toy.

I'd like to build a G along the lines of a professional or a pur edition, but I'll start with a LWB not a SWB as mine is.

Indeed I'll be doing a build thread somewhere on the web. Will link to it here.

yupbier

actually, I have owned 2 series 3s, a 110, a 90, a 130 and even a 101
but now, I own three toyotas and lust after a fourth (a 40 series). The only landrover I really lust after now would be a pre 1950 series 1.

It's interesting to note that those who own Toyotas (for what might be termed 'proper' reasons, i.e. to go off road), and many other non British off roaders, have owned landrovers in the past. The same is not so true the other way round.

The one thing I am jealous about though, is the price of parts. Toyota are eyewateringly expensive, and massively more than Landrover (but then, I guess they have to manufacture spares in greater numbers:rofl:)

"It's interesting to note that those who own Toyotas (for what might be termed 'proper' reasons, i.e. to go off road), and many other non British off roaders, have owned landrovers in the past. The same is not so true the other way round."

I found several toyota owners who migrated to Defender after riding in mine , it was also interesting that it was the women who mentioned how good the ride was going cross country , whereas the men didnt comment at all at the time .

Do have to concur re parts prices , but that tends to be a norm with Japanese vehicles, although European vehicles seem to be catching up in that area !:(

I was carrying my wife , and three couples in the 110 , going cross country to some caves, and thru a creek bed, It was at this time that the women were discussing how soft the ride was. It was about the time that toyota modded the landcruiser suspension , by lowering it , as they were having a problem with them falling over IIRC

BTw im 5'11" and about 14 1/2 stone i find them very comfortable , JMHO :thumbup1:

not saying it never happens, just that it tends to be the exception.

Ermm what about the G..
 

:) I don't what to spoil a good conversation but it seems like the las 10ish comments didn't even mention the G model.. why are they so unpopular o unused? is it because they are expensive or because trying something new is always a bit of a gamble.

I mean they have been produced since the 70s, the army buys them in many different parts of the world, there are enough spares around to build a mercedes G aircraft carrier..

I know quite a few people use them for off road but for overland they don't seem to be too popular apart from the people mentioned.

By the way i love landies and the cruisers.. but a bit of change once in a while is healthy!! ;)

My take:

Expence. Buying a good one in the first place (as with most vehicles there are some complete shed's out there and you need to find a good one or have deep pockets) and then the preceved cost of keeping one. This is an incorrect perception by the way.

The not "normal" / unknown.

Just joined the forum :smiliex:
It seems that not many are traveling by means of the G series. It's a shame, as it really is well suited for that.
I have the GD290 LWB in a basic W461 configuration.
Much like the original purpose of the 4x4 vehicles - it's here to do a certain job with as little fuss about it as possible.

If you are looking at the Gwagen as a adventure vehicle, take your time looking for the right one. As there are many not-very-good speciments out there.
They will cost a bit more than the rest - but what you will pay initially, you will save tenfold on repairs.

The trouble is, that a G will drive for a long time on a severly worn part, rather than falling to bits right away. If it just stopped dead in it's tracks, then you would be forced to repair right away - rather than trying to squeaze another 50.000 km out of it.

W461 up to 2002 are very similar to the W460 series, with the 461 becomming the more refined version of the basic build concept.

Early W463 series are brilliant as basis of modifying into overland vehicles. Less vibrations, less noise, permanent 4wd and on most vehicles ABS brakes.

Later W463 vehicles turned more into status symbols, that lost a lot of interiour space and gained electronics everywhere. To each, their own.

It's a great adventure vehicle, you just won't find 10 of the same kind to rob of parts- if you crash it in the middle of nowhere.