Horizons Unlimited - The HUBB

Horizons Unlimited - The HUBB (https://www.horizonsunlimited.com/hubb/)
-   Navigation - Maps, Compass, GPS (https://www.horizonsunlimited.com/hubb/navigation-maps-compass-gps/)
-   -   Overlanding GPS ??? (https://www.horizonsunlimited.com/hubb/navigation-maps-compass-gps/overlanding-gps-38395)

leevtr 14 Oct 2008 19:12

Overlanding GPS ???
 
Hello all,
Sorry if this is an old question, but what GPS systems are there that will basically get you from anywhere to anyhere, wether there are roads or not. I think i'm right in saying some will have an ' as the crow flies ' option. I currently have a Tom Tom rider V2, which is superb for the ' civilised ' world with roads, but would be as useful as a fork in a bowl of soup of the beat and track in Aisa or Africa.
Thanks for any help, ride safe!!

Iain 14 Oct 2008 19:35

I'd contact Smellybiker's Wanderlust Worldmap • Index page he's on this hub, is a biker, I met him in Colombia and he creates the maps no one else does for GPS. Email him and he'll give you the low down. He pretty much fills in all the gaps and is not a big corporation.

Iain.

Frank Warner 14 Oct 2008 22:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iain (Post 210996)
I'd contact Smellybiker's Wanderlust Worldmap • Index page he's on this hub, is a biker, I met him in Colombia and he creates the maps no one else does for GPS.

There are 3 (at least) 'world maps' for gpses -
Magellan has one
Garmin has another
And Smelly biker does another for Garmin GPSes ..

The detail/accuracy varies depending on where you want to go ... they can be very poor - showing only the major highways .. and errors of over a 1 mile (Africa is one place that springs to mind) .. and they can be very accurate with lots of detail - gas stations, hotels, sights to see .. Smelly bikers one probaly has the best detail in some parts of the world .. where he or other people have contributed data to the map.

Think you can 'see' garmins world map on their web site - so you can get the idea of the detail avalible. Smelly biker has a sample download avalible on his web site .. presently version 1.6 .. version 2 comming ..

Toyark 16 Oct 2008 08:51

Garmin 278C or 60CSX :thumbup1:

leevtr 3 Nov 2008 17:59

60csx
 
I dont understand the way these things are supposed to work. No maps for africa/middle east, yet you can program waypoints from a paper map. Someome enlighten me. I know garmin/mapsource do a ' worldmap ', and supposedly its basic, yet i was told certain areas are not available, so what is it.
Help!!!!!!!!

JMo (& piglet) 3 Nov 2008 21:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by leevtr (Post 213714)
I dont understand the way these things are supposed to work. No maps for africa/middle east, yet you can program waypoints from a paper map. Someome enlighten me. I know garmin/mapsource do a ' worldmap ', and supposedly its basic, yet i was told certain areas are not available, so what is it.
Help!!!!!!!!

Basically the GPS unit knows where it is around the globe using long and lat, or whichever 'local' scale/grid you might be using as an alternative.

The mapping data is essentially an overlay (or technically an underlay) that the GPS uses to relate the actual pin point position to something you can relate to on the ground - be it a road, city, contour line etc.

More advanced GPS units (and the type you use in cars for example) can then interact the GPS point with the map to guide/route you in a certain direction (ie typically along a road) other than a straight line.

The 'problem' comes when the mapping data in the GPS doesn't accurately coincide with what is actually on the ground. Don't worry, the GPS always knows where it is in relation to long and lat, it's just the display screen might suggest you are in a slightly different position to what is on the ground, as the map data maybe slightly skewed at that particular point.

Hope that makes sense?

xxx

Frank Warner 3 Nov 2008 21:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by leevtr (Post 213714)
I know garmin/mapsource do a ' worldmap ', and supposedly its basic, yet i was told certain areas are not available,


In some parts of the world roads of any description do not exist! In those situations a GPS can be a real help in giving direction to a town/well etc.


Over on UKGSer* ::::* For BMW GS Enthusiasts they have a tutorital on garmins mapsource. Some time spent there might help?

A waypoint is simply a loctaion .. there might be somethign there you'll want to go to .. like a fuel station. Or a bank. Most GPSes can have waypoints.

If you want to 'look 'at garmins 'world map' you can view it over the web on garamins web site .. go there and look for your self? That will tell you far more than words typed here.

leevtr 4 Nov 2008 00:12

Garmin Worldmap
 
Funny you should say that, because I already did just that. However, when i try to zoom in on a certain area, the map keeps going black and i cant get back in, so i gave up. Seems like the Garmin 60CSX may go on my shopping list though!!
Cheers for the help anyhow.

leevtr 4 Nov 2008 00:16

Is this a stupid question, but...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Frank Warner (Post 213739)
In some parts of the world roads of any description do not exist! In those situations a GPS can be a real help in giving direction to a town/well etc.


Over on UKGSer* ::::* For BMW GS Enthusiasts they have a tutorital on garmins mapsource. Some time spent there might help?

A waypoint is simply a loctaion .. there might be somethign there you'll want to go to .. like a fuel station. Or a bank. Most GPSes can have waypoints.

If you want to 'look 'at garmins 'world map' you can view it over the web on garamins web site .. go there and look for your self? That will tell you far more than words typed here.

Surely a waypoint is part of a map. Or, can the GPS know towns and cities, but not know roads?

Frank Warner 4 Nov 2008 00:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by leevtr (Post 213751)
Surely a waypoint is part of a map. Or, can the GPS know towns and cities, but not know roads?

Base GPS .. will tell you the lat and long of where you are .. and nothing else.

then you add 'features' ... time of day , sun set, sun rise .., towns, cities, even roads

Waypoint/s is/are not part of a map. They can be entred manually (using the GPS buittons) or via a computer.

Points of Intrest (POI) may be part of a map, or seperate from a map .. but cannot be put into the gps using its buttoons ..

Fully featured GPSes have lots of things .. some gpses don't have 'roads' but do have towns/cities ..

Plaese read the guide over on ukgser .. saves retypeing it here?

------------------ Garmins world map should be viewable ... link speeds ? wait a while ?

Cactus Central 4 Nov 2008 09:59

Check out Maps4Africa (MAPS 4 AFRICA - the world at your fingertips...). It is compatible with Garmin units and covers the unpaved roads throughout Africa. You can take a look at the routes on Google Earth (they must have some kind of partnership) via one of the options on the bottom left (don't remember the the name, but it's one of the boxes you can check to highlight places of interest etc). Here in South Africa, the software costs about $65 US / R650. Never used it, but have looked at it on Google Earth... apparently it is constantly updated / confirmed by overland travellers who submit data.

noel di pietro 4 Nov 2008 22:20

maps of Africa
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by leevtr (Post 213714)
I don't understand the way these things are supposed to work. No maps for Africa/middle east, yet you can program waypoints from a paper map. Someone enlighten me. I know garmin/mapsource do a ' worldmap ', and supposedly its basic, yet i was told certain areas are not available, so what is it.
Help!!!!!!!!

I can't believe nobody has pointed you out to Track4Africa (T4A) yet. You can buy a very accurate and nowadays even routable (like the TomTom navigation system) T4A map set which you upload into your 60Csx via your laptop. You need to have Mapsource installed for that which you will procure together with the GPS in the form of probably Garmin Waypoint manager. With T4A installed you can see yourself driving on the screen of the GPS exactly where you are in relation to your surroundings. Price for T4A is not bad, I believe about Euro 60,- via Internet [http://www.tracks4africa.com/] Worth every penny.
The Garmin Worldmap is utterly useless by the way. With that map you will find yourself driving miles next to the road shown on the map. Its just too inaccurate.
Cheers,
Noel
exploreafrica.web-log.nl

Frank Warner 5 Nov 2008 00:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by noel di pietro (Post 213866)
I can't believe nobody has pointed you out to Track4Africa (T4A) yet.

As the poster does (did?) not understand what a waypoint is .. adding T4A into the mix is just complicating things ..

Get the basics on the GPS right first.. ?

Then look at (possibly more detailed) map/s for where they are going? At teh planing stage possibly all they need is a general overview - a 'world' map will give them that.

-----------------------
On GPS Maps then -
Some maps have more detail on them than others. Some parts of the world have very little detail, but most (all - unless you are going to the poles - north or south) areas have something .. maybe not entirly accurate nor uptodate as you'd like but something at least.

Typically 'world' maps don't have as much as more localised maps ... there are a number of maps avalible .. free ones and ones that cost. The ones that cost have the installation performed for you , some of the free ones need you to do some work to install them ...

There has that complicated things enough?
leevtr - you may not have followed all the above .. if it confuses you .. just ignore it!

mcagol 5 Nov 2008 12:55

GPS unit
 
Most post on this web site mention either one of these garmin units:
Garmin 278C
Garmin 60cs

Could someone tell me the advantagesdisadvantages of these over a unit like:
nüvi® 265WT

Many thanks

leevtr 5 Nov 2008 16:26

Waypoints!!
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Frank Warner (Post 213877)
As the poster does (did?) not understand what a waypoint is .. adding T4A into the mix is just complicating things ..

Get the basics on the GPS right first.. ?

Then look at (possibly more detailed) map/s for where they are going? At teh planing stage possibly all they need is a general overview - a 'world' map will give them that.

-----------------------
On GPS Maps then -
Some maps have more detail on them than others. Some parts of the world have very little detail, but most (all - unless you are going to the poles - north or south) areas have something .. maybe not entirly accurate nor uptodate as you'd like but something at least.



Typically 'world' maps don't have as much as more localised maps ... there are a number of maps avalible .. free ones and ones that cost. The ones that cost have the installation performed for you , some of the free ones need you to do some work to install them ...

There has that complicated things enough?
leevtr - you may not have followed all the above .. if it confuses you .. just ignore it!

I have obviously come accross as a complete idiot.
I DO know what a waypoint is. BUT..... if i have a paper map, of say Iran, and theres a small village in the direction which i want to be heading, which is on or off the main highway/road, surely I cannot use it as a waypoint if there is no map for the country, as the GPS wont even know it exists.
I always use waypoints on my Rider in Europe, basically to stay off the motorways, but the Rider knows they are there.

Does anyone know what i'm getting at now???????

Alternatively, if the maps for some countries are basic, but do include MAJOR CITIES, can i ride X-country, with an arrow pointing in the direction i need to be going, with maybe a distance countdown. That would suffice.

I would ask a dealer about this, but i suspect some would tell me what i want to hear and take my cash.

Frank Warner 5 Nov 2008 21:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by leevtr (Post 213935)
I have obviously come accross as a complete idiot.

No. Someone who does not know the subject. Lack of knowledge does not equal idiot.

On most GPSes you can create a waypoint.. I'd say all but there might be a very basic one that won't do anything other than tell you where you are!

I forget what the arrow thingy function is called .. but teh ones with more features do that .. they even do more than that .. arow to where you want to go to , or arrow to the route you should be using .. depends on teh model and possiblty maps and or route ..

But I think anything you think of has already been done on these things - they pack a lot in a tiny box. The difficulty is finding out how to use them.

Go to a store and play with one .. you need some hands on time ..

----------------------------
I have a Gramin 60Cx ... it is small - waterproof, rugged, batteries last all day (for walking etc) runs maping with autorouting, has a microSD card for the maps and track logs.

The 60CS is no longer made - does not have a memory card .. nor the latest receiver .. I think the 276 is also no longer made .. but you can google them and get lots of things .. Best to compare current items on garmins web site ..

The nüvi I don't know .. happy with my 60Cx so not looking at anything else.

Vaufi 6 Nov 2008 22:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by leevtr (Post 213935)
..... if i have a paper map, of say Iran, and theres a small village in the direction which i want to be heading, which is on or off the main highway/road, surely I cannot use it as a waypoint if there is no map for the country, as the GPS wont even know it exists.
...

Does anyone know what i'm getting at now???????

Alternatively, if the maps for some countries are basic, but do include MAJOR CITIES, can i ride X-country, with an arrow pointing in the direction i need to be going, with maybe a distance countdown. That would suffice.
...

The older GPS's didn't offer the function "autorouting", so you had to watch the cursor or arrow whether you were moving in the direction you had intended. If the base map on the system was detailed enough, it even showed roads and towns/villages.

I cannot comment Smelly Biker's worldmap, because I don't know the detail quality. At least Garmin's worldmap isn't the best. Neither do I know the T4A details, but I'm pretty sure they do not cover the complete road net of Africa, as mentioned by Cactus.

So, to come back to your question: A good (=detailed) worldmap or detailed local maps loaded onto your GPS will help you to recognise your current position. And when movong, the cursor/arrow will show you the direction in which you are moving, thus showing whether you are moving towards your destination or away from it - no matter whether the road on which you are traveling is shown on the GPS map or not. Forget the autorouting function. The above mentioned maps won't support this function.

What is important is that the map shows "north up" on your GPS. This makes it easier for you to get your bearings, since this is the way you would look at a paper roadmap as well.

I don't believe the Nüvi is suitable for this kind of navigation. Rather go for the Garmin 60-series or maybe he 276/278 series (very expensive :-( Even the Zumo would be suitable, but I reckon the 60 series is more rugged and subsequently more reliable. These systems also offer a compass function as additional support to get your bearings. Finally: Nothing is as useful as a good old-fashioned roadmap, no matter how enhanced your GPS system is :thumbup1:

noel di pietro 16 Nov 2008 09:33

GPS maps and paper maps
 
I think I understand what your Q is now. I think it is as follows; If you'r looking at a paper map and you see a spot you might want to go and you don't have a detailed electronic map in the GPS showing that place, how do you translate that place on the paper map into a GPS waypoint !

There are basically 3 methods to do so;
1; take topographical paper maps with grid reference (military?). You can learn to calculate coordinates of such a map. This is not feasible though because these maps are small scale (1:20.000 or 50.000) so you would need to many maps.

2; Take a laptop with navigation software (Oziexplorer, Touratech Quovadis, Fugawi) which work with open source maps, i.e. png, jpeg etc type file. You can scan the original paper maps yourself (or have it done), load them in the program, calibrate them and then you can take a waypoint of the digitalized paper map. I do this in Oziexplorer (user friendly) which works very well. (Quovadis drives me crazy and Fugawi I'v never tried) Calibrating the electronic maps is nowadays very easy with Google Earth. You take 3 reference coordinate points from Google Earth, find the matching spots in scanned map on the laptop and enter the actual coordinates. Obviously it takes some time to master this but its not difficult. If you have properly calibrated maps on the laptop, you can create waypoints, tracks, routes etc in the program and upload these to your GPS unit. This is basically the same as using Mapsource but as noted, Mapsource is not open source and if Worldmap is useless. On the other hand, if you do have good Mapsource maps (e.g. T4A) which can be loaded into your GPS unit than its the perfect solution. There are plenty of Mapsource maps available but very expensive.

3; Google Earth, you can prepare your routes in advance in GE. Select points along the route you want to take, write down the coordinates and built up a small database in this way. You enter them in the GPS as needed. This can also be done electronically. There are some programs which can read routes in GE and convert then into electronic waypoints for the GPS and vise versa

WikiWaypoints

GPS Visualizer

quikmaps.com :: maps for the masses

Cheers,

Noel
exploreafrica.web-log.nl

Frank Warner 16 Nov 2008 21:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by leevtr (Post 213935)
if i have a paper map, of say Iran, and theres a small village in the direction which i want to be heading, which is on or off the main highway/road, surely I cannot use it as a waypoint if there is no map for the country, as the GPS wont even know it exists.

From the paper map you have you should be able to work out a lat/long for the location you want to get to.

If the paper maps has lat/lon reference lines then your ok.

If the paper map has no lat/lon marks then you're going to have to do some work.
First you know where you are on the paper map. And the GPS will goive you the lat/lon for that point. Now find a place that is no both your GPS and papre map - teh GPS will give you teh lat/lon fopr that point. Now find a third point on both .. now you have 3 points on teh paer map that have Lat/lon .. scale the lat/lon of the place you want to get too .. and enter that lat/lon into the GPS. For accuracy it will help if the 3 points equally soround the point you want to get to. This is fairly simple stuff. You will need a basic map on the GPS - one of the world maps will do that. Pencil, rule and rubber.

You need to think the problem through .. sit and think. Don't Panic. If you panic - take time out for a cup of tea/beer, walk around the block .. what ever calms you . Then think the problem through.. (very hard to do .. panic/stress is hard to get rid of. I find siting and calming myself is good, yoga may help too .. don't know .. find out what works for you and do that). Good Luck.

Bundubasher 31 Jan 2009 21:48

I've used an old Garmin IIIplus for years in Africa, so loooked at the Garmin V or the 276c as an upgrade however if you are strapped for cash the 60 might be good although I've never used that particular unit.

The IIIplus and the V are primarily vehicle units and allow tracking and setting of waypoints etc however they have a limited memory compared to units such as the 276c.

Look here as well:

GPS Satellite Receivers, Electronic Maps and Navigation !

Toyark 3 Feb 2009 16:55

http://www.horizonsunlimited.com/hub...AAAElFTkSuQmCC


Suggestion: the 276C does NOT have the ability to receive Custom POi's but the next model up, the 278C does.

Why custom POI's?
because you can create them on your pc and upload them to your unit leaving your unit's POI memory free.

The 278C can hold up to 3000 POI's but that will include POI's created when making up routes and therein was a problem for me as routes ate up a huge proportion of them- leaving very little available for 'on-the-road' use unless you were willing to delete routes.

Having worked a wee project I set myself, and using POI loader, I've been able to create a rather extensive library of POI's and upload 326 thousand POI's in my custom POi files- I wanted to see where the limits of my unit were. I can't be dead precise but my gps turned it self off when I tried to upload 328421 poi's I think it was. So I know it can handle 325,000 'safely' which is rather a lot!!

I use both Garmin units, the 278C and the 60 csX (don't get the cs model - the csX has an internal micro sd card that can handle up to 2GB and that unit can also have it's tracks saved directly to the data card thereby also saving unit memory.)
I have not tested uploads on other gps's.

Bundubasher 3 Feb 2009 17:07

However this "functionality" does come at a cost: 450 pounds plus for the 278 isn't it?

Toyark 3 Feb 2009 18:53

http://www.horizonsunlimited.com/hub...AAAElFTkSuQmCC


Quote:

Originally Posted by Bundubasher (Post 226687)
However this "functionality" does come at a cost: 450 pounds plus for the 278 isn't it?


sorry, I don't know the latest price.
The 60CSX is cheaper and will do the same albeit with a smaller screen etc.

The 278 also has its own large enough memory for the whole of the latest Garmin City-Nav Europe to be loaded into- thereby freeing the bespoke Garmin memory card slot for other maps too.
The 276 cannot do this- max map size there is on a 512mb card ad no map internal memory


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 03:10.


vB.Sponsors