What's my best option, Montana, 590 or 700i
 

I'm intending to set off for Africa in spring 2023, in the past I've used paper maps, which I love but are heavy because of the number needed for this trip. I have an old Garmin 590, a Montana 6 series and an iReach. I know that it's all old school, but they still work. The alternative is to buy 700i, but apart from having a more compact set up, I don't know if there is any real advantage. Probably gathered that on this type of tech' I'm a bit of a numpty. Also can any of these be loaded with such as OSM?

OK, I'll bite! it is the season of goodwill ! My 2 pence
If you already own an InReach device, you don't need the 700i.
If you have. Montana 600, you'll be fine so no need to spend unless you want to.
Some of the avantages of the 700 include:
16GB of internal memory and up to 15000 map segments.
10000 user waypoints
TRACKS 250
NAVIGATION TRACK LOG 20000 points, 250 saved gpx tracks.
NAVIGATION ROUTES 250, 250 points per route; 50 points auto routing
Rinex logging
GPS, Glonass and Galileo
Meets MIL-STD 810 for thermal, shock, water and vibration.
And as far as power, 18hours in GPS mode or 330! in Expedition mode.
And more!

So IMHO, without any doubt the '700' is a better and faster unit than the 600; the question has to be : will you actually make use of those extra facilities?
Only you knows that answer.
:Beach:

Too much: Too big, too heavy, too flashy, too expensive
 

I bought a 750i recently and sold it within 2 weeks. Reasons in the title of my reply. Traveling with a device worth 2-3 times what people earn in a year in the countries you contemplate crossing, well it's calling for trouble.

I hear you thanks, however, my experience has been that those are the people least likely to be a problem. In truth it's more likely to be a problem in London (ask me how I know?). Whatever I use would cost more than the average guy will earn in a month down there.

What the hell did you say?
Those are all features, but I really have no idea what their benefits are. What I really want to do is look at a map and plan a route. In cities turn by turn navigation will be great for finding accommodation, but other than that I like to plan my own routes. If you can advise me on that I will be grateful

:confused:
From your reply, it is clear that you have answered your own question.
Your 600 will do a great deal more than you seem you be using it for and will be more than fine.

Thanks, but I still have the issue of not been able to look at a full map. What's the "best" way other than carrying paper ones, to achieve that? The 600 screen is too small for that.

Humm.now I'm a bit confused at what you mean by 'Looking at the full map'.
You zoom out you'll see the entire country but zero detail!; for a bigger screen, you'd use a 10 or 12" tablet but on a moto...
If you'd like to p.m a telephone # maybe I can be of more help.
ATB
Titbit:
It may be worth mentioning that the Garmin Montana 750i and 700i have GPS and Galileo, while the 700 (non-InReach) also has GLONASS which, if you are planning eastward trips from the EU may be more useful. Choices/decisions decisions...

On a long trip I can certainly see the advantage of compactness and combining functions of devices, though it's a double edged sword - if one fails you've lost both your satnav and your PLB. Also, if you have an accident and you're separated from the bike you're also separated from your combined satnav/PLB.

On balance however, I recently bought a 700i and I'm very pleased with it. The display is better than my 610 and potentially it means I could avoid carrying my InReach as well. There are pros and cons but my thinking ATM is to take just the 700i. I have a couple of mobile phones so at least I won't be stuck for satnav (which has happened to me before).

The 700 series is a HUUUUUGGGGGEEEE improvement over the 600 series but if you've already got the 600 stay with it. Ive recently done my first 16k km with the new 700i and it is fantastic.

On a bike you want your inreach on your person not on the bike in case you take a tumble and cant reach it. So that would rule out the 700i

How do you plan your own routes? With a separate computer or on the GPS itself? IMO, the route planner on the Montana 700i is much easier to use than the one on the Montana 600.

The 700 is also bigger, heavier, has a voltage converter box in the power cable, and the #1 complaint seems to be the dim display in some light. (I can see the display just fine.)

Note that the satellite communication functions of the 700i work from your phone if you have them paired before you crash.

There's no way for other people to tell what will work for you. The 600 and the 700 both work for me but I always take the 700i instead.

When I bought the 700i it included lifetime City Navigator. That's not worldwide, but useful where I ride most.

I really have to say a very public thank you to Toyark. Not only did he call to give me advice, but when he clearly realised I'm a total numbskull, he met me and gave me a full day of his valuable time. Added to this he has continued to prepare and advise me on software. Mate thank you very much, you've truly been a godsend.

Thank you for your kind comments Davey. Have a fabulous trip! but I do have to disagree about your being a numbskull! you picked up way faster than many. Showing 'how to' is so much easier in person so I do appreciate your committing some of your time. I enjoyed meeting you.
The use of sat navs and each units own quirks have tortured me over many years, despite my hoping that Garmin would finally makes things easier but alas... My 'struggle' began in 1997 with my first unit, the GPS II Plus and it is not over yet:(
but like old wine, I'm getting better at it with age!:Beach:

Since writing that I have become aware of the Garmin Explore app, which pairs your mobile phone with the 700i. So if you need to send a message/SOS and you can't reach your bike, you can do it from your phone. I suppose there are limits, like if the bike goes over a cliff, but for most foreseeable events it's a winner for me.

I also found the 700i has enough internal memory to just drag and drop an OSM into the phone's "Garmin" folder as "gmapsupp" and it picks up and uses the map without having to load it on an SD card.

Free OSM now available from below link, with the ability to select rectangles or specific areas. https://garmin3.bbbike.org/

The 700 doesn't have enough internal memory for the preloaded maps.When I first got mine City Navigator had to be moved to a SD card so it could be updated to the latest version (and now it won't update at all, but that's another issue!)

As slight aside but Garmin's Explore is a completely horrible user experience, I'm just glad the 700 isnt as reliant on it as the Overlander units are!

Wee tip for the week/end
 

There are plenty of files you can take off your garmins (read delete or simply copy to a safe medium if you are unsure) to free up space.
But on the other hand, why not simply use up to 32GB micro sd cards?
That's quite a lot of mapping.
If you brick your unit, you're on your own! Usual caveats apply.

Thats what I did, but given how cheap memory is now Garmin could have installed enough to take the pre loaded maps.

Now its been moved on the SD card, garmin express wont update it. Always greatfun trying to deal with garmins little issues with software

@ Thewarden
I am a bit confused as I have just checked my 700- see pic below- Windows reports a total capacity of 14.3 GB

I have Garmins' City Navigator installed on its internal memory as well as other maps too and huge numbers of extra files (POI's, images , fGles etc) and still have over 5GB free (although I do not recommend maxing out internal memory)
but I did remove the garmin open topo map the unit came with the unit as useless. I have better ones.

If you are talking about City Nav, it is now split into two map sets since it is too large- One part is 2.567 GB and the other is 2.408GB ( rounded up)
My 700 did not come with CN included and I had to purchase it so my version cannot be updated. (if I want a new version I have to buy yet another one; it has been a long while since you could buy a lifetime update of the product map subscription separately doh )
If your unit came with CN pre-installed as a package deal, my understanding is that you should be able to update it.
May do a '700 tidy-up'? :smartass:

Suggestion but working on the assumption that you may also have Garmin open topo as well as C.N in your internal memory:
Save a copy of the Garmin Topo active map elsewhere ( micro sd if you still want to use it) and remove it from the internal memory
Take out your micro sd card.
PLug your 700 into your PC
Clean up not needed files
Start Garmin Express and chose the option to reinstall the map which I have to assume came with the unit.
Job's a good one

Yes I agree- a faster processor and larger memory would have been nice considering their costs. but hey...

we're going off topic a bit but still useful

My 700i has the same memory. Preinstalled maps are CN Europe, Topo Active Europe, Timezone Map and the Worldwide DEM.

First time I plugged it in it needed a firmware and map update. TopoActive is now 3 parts of around 2.5GB each. CN is 2 parts are 5.75GB. After moving CN from the internal memory as there wasn't enough space for the update, there is 4.5GB free. The 2 CN sections are 2.8 and 3.2GB.

IMHO Garmin should have given us a bigger internal memory on the unit.

Now my CN is in the sd card, its due an update, but Garmin Express crashes when you try to view the sd card or install the update. This seems to be a common issue with Express. I suspect if I remove my osm maps from the sd card the install will work, just haven't tried it yet

head scratching moments....
Garmin express will install new maps on the micro sd when it 'sees' that the internal memory is full.
Map updates are controlled by the serial number of your unit so it knows if you're allowed one so to speak.

One option may and I do say may, be to copy of the entire 700 internal memory and keep that safe somewhere
Then
delete the CN maps and open topo maps ONLY

Then Fill the memory with large videos so you only have say 3GB left or less.

Then put a new max 32GB micro sd card in and try for a map update.

In theory, Express will see that it cannot proceed installing to the internal memory and ask to install on the micro sd instead.

If successful, [ it *should* work ] post up but DO copy the entire internal memory of the 700 FIRST so that you may go back where you started from.
Usual caveats when dealing with 'not necessarily procedural' solutions!

p.s
I just spotted that a software update is available for the 700
Version 15.20
I do not know about other variants i.e 700i etc

just compared internal memory spec on 700 and 700i ==> same 16GB
Map segments 15000 - same on both
My initial thought is that you have extra data in the units memory which I cannot fathom (possibly tons of satellite imagery? / IQ apps? )

or that your 700i has over indulged at Xmas and is a fat ba*tard:chef:

I have a Montana 600.

Even though it does the job, it's incredibly slow. It is seriously showing it's age.

Scrolling though the map is tedious and frustrating. You won't be doing it "on the fly" unless you stop and take your time.

However, it's absolutely perfect for navigating to pre-set way points or following pre-planned routes.

And you can't deny that it's rugged, waterproof and has it's own battery. You can also use it for hiking. My Montana saved me when I joined a few people to go Mushroom picking in the Yukon (Morrell not magic). We went with a guide who turned out to be an idiot.

We walked for a hours into the bush and when it came to returning home, we were totally lost in the thick woodland and rugged landscape. The guide didn't have a clue.

Luckily, I took my Montana with me and I set a waypoint to where we parked. If I didn't have that with me, I'm pretty sure we'd be still rotting in the bush. A distant memory of a Grisley Bear's picnic.


However.. There is a reason that the majority of people just use smart phones to navigate. They are leagues ahead in usability and performance.

There are even plenty of large waterproof smart phones that are dash mountable and maps that work 100% offline. Which Google maps does not even if it says it does.

I will continue to use my Montana. However if it were lost or broken, I would not miss it and certaintly not replace it.

Ted :offtopic:
Here are the corrections Garmin made in the latest 15.20 update.

How-to link here
Note the manage maps option

So @Thewarden- don't keep us in suspense!do tell how you are getting on with the fix.
Have you run an update on your 700i?

In simple terms yes

But it wasnt simple!
700i and Garmin Express were both up to date. But when I tried to update the maps GE gave an error. If I tried to enter Manage Maps it shut down and restarted.

I had worked out things ran ok if I removed the SD card. So the problem lies there. I tried removing all my OSM maps but no success with that. Then removed CN and made a bit of progress.

But it would give a message saying I needed more spare memory on the internal memory to install onto the SD card even though I have about 4.5GB. If I ignored that then it would stop around 25% complete. I found if I restarted it again then the progress would go a bit further until eventually it says I'm all up to date.

Just copying my OSM maps back onto the SD card and then I will see if the install worked.

humm- scratching of head continues!
I still cannot work out what is taking up all your units' internal memory. Bizarre

Maybe using a new, higher class micro sd may work better if you think the fault lies there.:online2long:

:offtopic:

:thumbdown:


Oh the irony.... :cool4:

The OP was Davey Bee re- satnav problems which I solved -
Then followed by some which Thewarden is currently experiencing and where I am also trying to help solve.

So yes Ted, I am very comfortable with what you call 'irony' doh - :innocent:
Perhaps you'd like to chime in with satnav specific information to help?
No? didn't think so you luddite:laugh:

All updated and working. The issues with Garmin EXpress are widely reported with no real solution from Garmin. It would be nice if the software worked as designed.

My internal memory is just the standard files, preoaded maps (less CN) which account for 8.8GB. My gpx files are only 50mb

Good. Happy for you.
The only issue I'v experience with Garmin Express is when someone at Garmin placed a software update belonging to a different sat nav causing...a brick.
That was over a year ago. Not seen any issues with Express since.

I'll say no more 'cuz Ted's lurking...:Beach:

Talking about bricks, presumably there must be some way to get the firmware reinstalled in the event of a glitch?

Yes sir there is, via windows explorer if it's not totally dead-

the problems I have had have been discussed reasonably regularly on the Garmin forums

I have the 590lm with a sd card and I traveled with it in Europe, Canada, Alaska USA and Latin Amerika.
Didn´t had any issues, when you just swap cards for the big countries. As I guess you can download pretty much all African countries you travel as there a not so many roads anyway.

I wouldn´t get the 700i as it costs a lot of money and basically does the same as the old once. All the gimmicky features you won´t/can´t use in Africa anyway.

GPS Garmin 700i
 

Hello, I hope you have an AMAZING TRIP.
I am preparing for my first Leg of my RTW trip, and am considering USED older vs. 700i Montana.

One Note to consider.. I have found online true LOCKING brackets.. so Its vertualy impossible to steal off the bike, without the special, tool, and or they steal the entire bike,., But very easily removed if shopping, or Overnight.. etc. :funmeterno:

Is it a download from Garmin, or do you have to copy your uncorrupted drive contents to your PC as a precaution/backup then copy them back in if it bricks?

The 700 series is a HUUUUUGGGGGEEEE improvement over the 600 series but if you've already got the 600 stay with it. Ive recently done my first 16k km with the new 700i and it is fantastic.

I bought the 700i and I agree it's much better than my old 610. Screen is significantly bigger and it's nice to build the InReach functionality into the GPS. You can pair with your phone by Bluetooth so even if you can't physically reach the unit in event of an accident you can still send a signal.

I did have some software problems on the 700i initially but they changed it under warranty and the replacement is mint :)

I've kept the 610 as it's not worth much now, and I'll probably put that on my runaround bike.