Mongolia: from Border to UB: which route you recommend?
 

Hi guys,

We will get to Mongolia via the M52 highway in Russia, some time in July.

Then, undecided which road to take: northern or southern/central?

I met yesterday with a colleague of my husband who did the Mongol Rally in 2008. It took them 4 weeks driving in shifts…. Anyway, he said the southern was best as the northern had an impassable river….. really? Also they were on a car, so it’s a different perspective.


I may crisscross a bit to visit some lakes etc… but I was thinking the northern route ( via Ulangom, Murum, …) would be more beautiful and less busy with trucks? We will be on little bikes (a couple of Honda XR125) if this matters…

Any thoughts or advice about which route to pick and level of difficulty? Ideally I would like to spend 3 or 4 weeks before we get to UB, so plenty of time to explore a bit.
Cheers,

Maria,

We went last year and we wanted to do the northern one, which was "closed" due to high rainfall and thus the river being impassable. Yes it happens. This was the part from Tsagaannuur to North side.

So we had to take the southern one, until Khovd it was ok, and then you could either go North again to go to the northern route (we had no info if we could pass or not) or Eastward staying on the southern one which is uttermost CRAP with 400km of washboard and no view and boring. Until the point where we seriously thought what the hell we were doing there after the Russian Altay and Kazakhstan that were both +++ for us.

Anyway in Altai city go North to take the middle route which was great and have a rest in Tsetserleg in the Fairfield guesthouse that is a lot better than oasis in UB in our opinion.

Check everyday all the nuts and bolts on the bikes and you'll be fine, but be sure to be able to do 300km range with your fuel.

All the trucks????? Where did you read/see this?
Maybe we were lucky but we only saw like ten or so in the 3 weeks we were there... ?!

A few 100kliks out of UB the tarmac starts...

Thanks Seb, that's the sort of specific info I was after! I took some notes and will check and mark my maps.

I read your website few months ago in preparation for my trip. Awesome trip and nice report! I will check it again, now that we are closer to departure.
I wanted to go via Ukraine like you, but it seems less and less likely.....

I Also did it lat year, and on the route seb recommended.

Down throu the Republic of Altai ( very beautiful) and in Mongolia to Altai city and north to the Center route.

He said everything you need......

Yeah, UA is a bit dodgy nowadays, just for the UA-RUS border, depending on how the situation will 'evolve'...
One of the many reasons we decided to change our plans for our next big trip that will start in 3 months... ;-)

If you need anything specific, don't hesitate to mail me, en français tout comme en anglais, c'est bon, pero en español es un poquito dificil... :helpsmilie:

I've driven most of the Northern, Central and Southern routes, though none of them in its entirety. Each has its perks.

The Northern Route takes in nice scenery in Uvs Province, but the highlight is probably Khuvsgul Lake. If you've spent a lot of time in Siberia / Baikal, it might not be that special, but I still liked it (camped on the eastern shore). The track conditions are 'OK' After Bulgan there is asphalt to UB, passing Amabarsagalant Monastery, and some pleasant, if not spectacular scenery.

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-t...vsgol-Nuur.jpg

The Central Route starts off really beautiful, as it leaves Khovd Province and enters Zavkhan Province, which I thought was the most beautiful in the country. If I had my time again, I would drive down to Khovd, then just head east through flat plains with some sand dunes (no ergs, you can drive round them!!) following tracks to Khar Nuur (Black Lake), which is one of the most beautiful places I have seen in the country, dividing the dunes and the green steppe.

https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-n...Nuur-Dunes.jpg

After Uliastai the road goes through rolling grassy plains with wildflowers, then at Tosontsengel there are some lovely hills. After this, the central route becomes a little 'touristy', passing White Lake and Tsetserleg. Somewhere around here the asphalt starts, and the scenery after is pretty boring. Erdene Monastery is worth seeing though.

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-p...-Monastery.jpg

The Southern Route is the most boring, and least adventurous. In some ways it is the 'best' road, as it is difficult to lose the track, which is always an annoyance in Mongolia, though rarely a problem. Yes, there is washboard, but if you are scared of bad roads, don't come to Mongolia. Seriously. However, if you have the time and the interest, the Southern Route is the one to choose to go off and explore the Gobi. There are some amazing things to be found...

https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-3...l-Petrogly.jpg

You could also head to the far south, and see some picture-postcard desert at Khongoryn Els, then continue east to Dalandzadgad and reach UB on decent roads, which are paved once you get to Choir or nearby.

https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-V...ngorin-Els.jpg

So if you want to see greenery, hills and lakes, I would go down to Khovd, head east off-piste to Khar Nuur, then Uliastai, then join the northern route and see Khuvsgul Lake.

If you want to see the desert, follow the southern route to Bayankhongor, then head south along any track and make a desert crossing. You could even go down to the far south-west, to Bulgan... but I would not want to take a bike on that route!!!

Oh, and don't forget to explore Bayan Olgi Province, it also has some of the best scenery in the country.

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-D...urgan-Nuur.jpg

The east of the country is nice too!

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-r...gd-Sunrise.jpg

Many more pics in the Picasa link below...

Good luck

Daniel

Huge amounts has already been written on this topic. You won't need telling how to find these other threads.

If you're on little light bikes, I'd stear clear of the South route: Many bikers have described it as boring, corrugated and full of construction and freight traffic. I strongly suggest to go central and north. Me and a mate did on big sheds like Transalps in 9 days at a very leasurely pace.

Pics and videos linked in my signature.

It is possible to avoid the big river mentioned by riding Tsagaannuur to Olgi and the heading north east skirting the eastern shore of Achit Nuur lake and then turning east again.

Northern route was not impassible last summer. I found it very dry and dusty. I did both northern and southern route on a KTM 690. Southern route is boring with lots of construction. Soon it will be paved 100%. Perfect for those with overloaded "adventure" barges.

There is an un-crossable river north of Achit lake on the northern route. If you ride south of this lake, the rest of the rivers are cake. You don't have to go all the way south to Kvold. you can go east from Oilgii.

I was going to try a "very southern" route along the chines border. From Kvold to Altai city I had 3 flat tires and no more spare tubes/running out of patches. I decided to stay on the main "southern route" and not get stranded in the Gobi. It was a very boring ride back to UB.

Recommendation: Stay north or bounce around in the middle. There are not only 2 routes and in Mongolia its easy to make your own. A little preplanning will help you find fuel stations. The last 2 or 300 km into UB will suck no matter what direction you come in. Pavement and traffic.

As others have suggested the central/north would be preferred. We went south in our 4x4 last year and dropped off main south route into the Gobi around Altay (?) With another truck. we went for 2 weeks off route, picking up dry river beds as we went. I wouldn't recommend it on a bike though as we both had 1200km fuel and 70L of water each! which was stretched. we ended up coming into the National Park from the west to the sand dunes before heading north to UB.

Seb, does this route you recommend go via Uliastai and around the Tarvagatai Nuruu NP?

You could (but probably shouldn't) make your own route from any place to any other place. We did this after Tsetserleg but it's definitely not faster! We drove purely on coordinates but it took us the whole day to cover 80km of pure offroading. It would have been faster to take the normal "road". And you would probably don't get bogged on the normal "road"... ;-)

If you are in a hurry, then you should just stay on the southern route. If not:

Yes we did the 'loop': Altai - Uliastai - Tosontsengel - Tsetserleg
I can recommend it as a few highlights are on the way there.
The route we took is not even in google maps, if you are interested, send me a mail and I'll send you the GPX file of that part.
This part of Mongolia was for us the most interesting as the scenery is beautiful and most 'tourist' stay either on the southern or northern route... ;-)

OK thanks. Indeed not really planning on cross country, subject to conditions but might be interesting to do here and there. Bike is maybe a bit heavy for that (AT) Yes, im interested in the GPX file. You could attach it to your next post or mail it via my PM email address! Thanks in advance.

Yeah this uncrossable river

Totally crossable :thumbup1: went through it with a KTM990 and Tenere Xt660Z

Was a swine to find the route which meant zig zagging over various little islands and we were shown the way by the locals of whom a couple lent a hand

http://i678.photobucket.com/albums/v...P1020350-1.jpg
helpers

http://i678.photobucket.com/albums/v...2/P1020349.jpg
Gaz jeep marks the far shore

But we didn't think it was crossable, we would have found the way eventually by ourselves if we had gone knowing that it was, if coming in from the Altai, walk across if you get really stuck and then go find a local to show you the way.

http://i678.photobucket.com/albums/v...P1020354-1.jpg Post crossing shot

Loved the stretch between that river and Ulangom in particular, though there was nothing technically difficult in any of the riding along tracks and we actually took to heading off piste to amp things up a little

Would have struggled to cross there on some bikes with a low intake maybe and you do need to walk it first and carry your luggage across separately

enjoy

I'll return just for that most beautiful corner of Mongolia

Of course it's totally crossable, it all depends on when you are there and if it has rained a lot just before or not.
What is one day may not be the other.
If the local 6x6 doesn't run across the river anymore because the water is too high, then I suggest you don't go in with the bike.
If the water is "only" kneedeep, then of course there's absolutely no problem.
You can't say yes or no before you are actually there.
All the riders that were there when we were turned around as it was not doable that week when we were there. And I ride a 140kg bike, so if that is a no go, anything bigger is in my opinion certainly a no go... :nono:
I'm talking about the route from Tsagaannuur to Ulaangom. There are a few rivercrossings (not on google maps) and those can be a problem as said if it rained a lot the days/weeks before you arrive.
Plan both ways, try the N route, if you are in bad luck (like we were) then you'll have to divert to the S one... if not then go for it!

Hi Seb, I'm planning to be in Mongolia next august.
Do you think starting on the southern route and then switching to the central route as you did and you are referring here, is easily doable two up on a Dominator or there are any particularly technical parts or some deep sand?
Thanks

I'm not Seb...

But.. The southern route can be done on almost any bike. Last summer, south of Olgii there was quite a bit of construction. Heading East out of Olgii or north will be more enjoyable I think. You can go anywhere in Mongolia with a dominator. Like many have said before, the southern route gets most of the traffic. I found in Mongolia, the worst roads were the ones with lots of traffic. The barely used 2 tracks in B.F.M. are relatively smooth and fast because they are not beat to crap. But, no matter where you go, it will be awesome. Because its Mongolia. I had about a month in Mongolia and Altai and I wish I had more. Its a beautiful country with beautiful people.

Thank you Noah,
I read many times about the southern route being full of traffic and with many roadworks, that's why I would like to take the central at least after Altai City, maybe before.

cristiano

What he said... :scooter:

The great thing about Mongolia is there are not 2 routes. There are infinite routes defined by fuel stations and distance between them. You can play "connect the dots" with towns/cities and make your own route. Even when I was trying to take the "southern route" and for about a day and a half I was 50 km north on some nice tracks. I took a wrong turn and didn't realize it. The main thing is, get the "central asia GPS points" in your GPS, go where you want, and have a good time. You will be able to find fuel with just a tiny bit of looking ahead.

Agreed.

It is not that there are just the main routes, then pristine, trackless steppe.

Whilst it is (in the south and east) often possible to just drive in a given direction, it is better to just follow a general direction on the endless number of small tracks. When one set of tracks changes direction for no apparent reason, just connect to another. You'll meet Mongolians in isolated gers, who will look at you as if you have just ridden a giant ostrich from Jupiter, but they are friendly and helpful.

In areas where there are no tracks, it may indicate that you are heading for a boggy area, a deep river, or a steep hill. By driving in such areas you are also further scarring the landscape.

Ohh! I almost forgot. I was riding one track to try and get to a lake. But it hit dunes instead. I rode along a dry river for a while and the track kindoff went away. About 1 km from where I was, there were gers so I headed for them. I had to go through some of the bumpiest clumps of grass/sinking in a bog/thought I would loose the bike. I finally came to one ger and a old lady looked at me. I tried to ask where the road was and she was nothing but blank stare. I followed the track and finally found a road again.

But what he said, there are some places you don't want to go through... some places don't have tracks for a reason. But tracks are just about everywhere you need to be.

I was also surprised how good the OSM maps were. They had quite a few of the little 2 tracks on them. They were not quite caught up to the new construction.. but they were good. Better then the paper map I had.

+1 for comment about the osm gps map and also Walter's waypoint list. Much better than the fiction that are the available paper maps.

Going the northern route is much better scenery wise. Olgii - Ulaangom - Murun or Olgii - Ulaangom - Tsetserleg. If you go middle route through Tsetserleg, it's paved road now all the way to UB for 460 km, which means a lot of traffic. The river north of Achit Lake is called Yamaatiin River. It depends on how much rain the area had a few days prior to your arrival. We don't get weeks of rain in Mongolia. It also depends on how hot the weather has been as the river is fed by glaciers from Mount Kharkhiraa & Mount Turgen. If you need up to date info on the conditions, you can contact me on info@adventuresmongolia.mn From time time I'm on trips in the countryside, but I'll be able to help most of the times. Goodluck & Cheers. Gana

300Km? Is that for most of Mongolia or just in specific areas?

Thanks

300km, yes, thats a good guide for most of Mongolia. I wouldn't advise going there with less.

Take a look at the waypoints file. Work out where you want to go based on infrastructure. Will there be fuel, for example.

As far as the sometimes uncrossable river between Tsagaannuur and Ulaangom, there is a simple fix. Go via Olgiy. The track from Olgiy to Ulaangom, the Khotgor Track, can be funky in places but has many beautiful scenic spots along the way. So for anyone planning the Northern Route, plan via Olgiy and you avoid the biggest potential problem.

Hi Seb,
In May, we will be in Mongolia and we are looking for the best route. We are interested about your loop Altai - Uliastai - Tosontsengel - Tsetserleg. This route seem very nice. A track to follow on our GPS will be really helpful to drive over there. Can you send us your GPX file ?
Thank you for that and thanks for all informations on the Hubb.

Get in touch through > info -at- wanderingsouls -dot- be < and I'll see if I can find the tracks again "somewhere" on one of the hard disks.... ;-)

And you are most welcome about the info, we try to share what we can.

I can also recommend this route like Seb did.

In my opinion much nicer from the landscape than the northern route via Ulangom.

Did it also in 2013 and liked it a lot :mchappy:

I recommend the northern route, I did it solo back in 2012 on an XT600E (No offroad experience). As has been said the first river before Ulaangom can be tricky if it has rained recently. I just about managed after beaching myself on the mud on the otherside, there are local shepherds around to help you out.

And then after the rivers it's nice off-piste riding to the lake and onwards to Ulaangom.
http://i.imgur.com/1bvBeOs.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/uiF2bFl.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/rfMgcdk.jpg

I have done the route like Seb did ( Southern, then from Altai north and then Centerroute ) in 2013 and I did the northern route in 2015.

And that is the reason, why I would personally prefer the route south and Center
In my opinion much nicer landscape and view.

But that is just my opinion

Hi,

Still a nice thread and a nice website! I'm interested as well in riding the Altai - Uliastai - Tosontsengel - Tsetserleg route, and I was wondering how many river crossings you had? Were there a few each day or were there many more?

And have you found your track-files? If it is possible, I'm interested in them as well!

As I remember, there is just one real Watercrossing, and you don't have to do that, because there is a bridge 2km North. Just many people don't know:rofl:
The tracks are on my homepage ion the download area

Okay thanks!

Sounds good. I will take a look at your homepage.

Planning the northern route for this summer..any other major watercrossings to be avoided on this route? (As far as anyone remember) lets say from Murun ..
Cheers !:thumbup1: great info mate

After Ulaangom there is no major watercrossing anymore ( only smaller ones ) .
At least as long you stay close to the main route.

And from Moron on you have asphalt ( the Route Moron - Darkhan - UB )

If you go Moron - Burenkhhangai - UB, it is Gravelroad.
I do not know if there are major watercrossings.

But always think, it can be very different if it rains before or you ha snowmelting period.

2015 I crossed a river which was possible but deep, 2 days earlier a friend had no problem and almost no water on the same crossing.

Thanks Klaus! Yes i was in the east side for a big loop 2800kms,in 2015.mostly off road but took a part of the tarmac to UB.this summer going from Vladivostock to EU, passing Mongolia ,most probably that way in june/july..cheers

Southern road
 

Hello everyone,

Has anyone done the southern road recently? I know it is mostly paved, but are the non-paved parts doable with a small 2WD car? And can you get lost without a GPS or is there enough traffic to ask around? I understand that this site is mostly for bikes, but it seems to have a lot of helpful information about the state of the roads.

It is possible.

Many people did it with 2wd

Also possible without GPS

You are doing the Mongol Rallye ?

When we were crossing Mongolia during the 2015 Mongol Rally, we noticed something strange. No matter how remote you thought to were, either somebody lived, worked or passed by quite close.

Southern route with properly getting lost (taking the wrong track that leads you to the big river, but you are right between the road with the bridge and the tractor's crossing road) and offroading in riverbeds, up the steep banks, sandy bits - all doable.

Also a friend's team drove through the southern route on coilovers without any issues, so ...

Thank you. No, we are not doing the Mongol Rally. We plan to travel from Europe through Russia, Kazakhstan and to Mongolia in the summer and then all the way back. We have done Europe-Vladivostok, through Caucasus and the Stans in 2014 with no problems, and this year we plan to enter Mongolia.

Thanks. Sounds good.

Hi Chris this is a very good point .is there a way to point it on a map? or your GPX file to follow?I ve been reading of this river crossing several times and could be very important to avoid
bier

Hi Klaus! do u have a waypoint of this big watercrossing. or could point it on google maps just to get an idea /how to avoid it.cheers
bier

The rivercrossing is on the way from Tashanta after the border to Ulangom.

If you take the route from Olgii to Ulangom, you have only smaller ones ( if it does not rain or you have a lot of melting snow )
I think we had around 30 crossings from small to 60cm deep

still a quiet wide area.can u attempt to pin point it on google maps or?
cheers

See below photo of my map ( if attachment works!) I think this is what Chris was talking about. We took this trail 2 years ago to avoid the large river that was totally impassable, even to trucks. We were there early in the season.

The road crosses few rivers and streams but nothing challenging. You can see pictures on my blog or trip report ( see link below).

It is a stunning area so well worth choosing this road.

The main river in on the main highway the A16. It can become impassable occasionally.

ok thanks Maria .I ve got the same map! ;) I did find it on OSM and on a GPStopo map I have.is the big crossing this one ? : https://goo.gl/maps/cPtCpT49ueJ2

from google earth seems to have a bridge now(?)

yes I will be there early ,like June so could be some water to deal with in it

Just had a look for, and found, my 2012 Mongolia tracklogs. Send me a PM with your email address and I'll send them to you. Looking at Maria's paper map, I think my tracks matched her's.

Here's a link to a ride report I did covering that trip: Adventures between a Cliff and a Wet Place. Brighty in Central Asia and Mongolia | Adventure Rider

No, the big river everyone talks about is not showing in google map. Try Yandex, plane views. It is better for that region. ( Russian App, like Google).

The river is about 20 or 30 miles east of Tsagaanur, where the road makes a big V, I think. I did not take that road, we went to Olgii for a rest.

The road we took, pencilled in my photo, was superb and well worth it. Some tricky sections of sand but you will get plenty of it if you go by the north. I would not fancy it on a heavy bike though.

Don't sweat too much about rivers. Just try to find tracks where the locals on bike go. Usually not where the cars go ( much deeper sometimes!).
You will be fine. Enjoy Mongolia.


This is section of my trip report that covers this region:

http://advrider.com/index.php?thread...1098228/page-4

yes I crosses countless rivers when I was there for a 2800kms ride.in 2014..
the sandy areas could be a problem,since I 'll be on a Africa Twin 1000cc this time,which will weight around 350kgs (?) ,me+gear included!.big difference from the lightweight
doh
thanks ! still hope someone can pinpoint this crossing if possible

I did the same route as Maria in 2015.

As she says, no watercrossing which is impossible. Sometimes a little bit deeper when there is rain, but doable.

Some tricks sections with sand, but doable.
I did it with a Transalp.

The bridge Forestwitz means ist after Ulangom on a new road....

personally I think that the route from Olgii - Khovd - Altai . Uliastay ( and from here the Centerroute ) is more scenic than the northern route.

I did both and definitely liked the mix of Southern and Centerroute better.
There is just one a little bit boring part between Khovd and Altai, but you see the stone gobi, it just gets boring after a while but then you turn north to Altai anyway.
And you have the higher mountains and mountain passes here.

well, lets be more realistic..some of the rivers are impassable,depending on rain/snow and the spot etc. this is a pic of the only one I didnt manage to go across last time.I was going to Tsenker hotsprings(?) and stopped to camp on the side of this river at night because simply did not convince me..and did not want to risk going across, being solo/evening.this guy with the car was a local the morning after... his wife and probably grandma were still in there ,did not want to get out.not best day for them,I have to say. he managed to get there while I was scouting a shallow area to cross,but without luck ,so I backtracked. did not want to leave the bike or else there in the river :nono:

so this is more or less ur favourite route I guess? :thumbup1:
https://goo.gl/maps/s4cJAEh8aGr

Hi Forestwiz
Sent you my 2012 Mongolian tracklogs in .gdb format via email. When I tried to convert them to .gpx in Garmin Mapsource I got an error message.

I Googled "convert gdb to gpx" and there seem to be various other software available to do this. Unfortunately I don't have the time at the moment to download one and do it. I'm sure you're able to do this, if need be.

got it cheers! bier

Forestwitz:

Almost the route, I just went over Kharkorin

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800...0/703/k7xp.png

Customs Deposit?
 

on a slightly different topic..how did u guys managed Custom's deposits? in Russia, Mongolia?

EDIT: the shipping company just let me know there is a 15.5% of the bike's value charged as deposit ,which will be
refunded to bank account after leaving Mongolia?! anyone has done that?

Does anyone know the road from Bayankhongor to Tsetserleg?