Complete Newbie Planning London -> Melbourne - Please Help!
 

Hi there,

I'm Brad, 33-ish and had enough of my life in London and need to do something before I go mental. I've wanted to do a big trip since I read Jupiter's Travels about five years ago, and been inspired by c90adventures and the like. I've got some friends in Melbourne so am thinking to go visit them. Starting in late July this year, hopefully.

The most adventurey trip I've taken is across the US coast to coast in two weeks on a knackered Kawa 550 LTD that topped out at 68. I'm mostly an inline 4 sport-ish type rider.

Since before I can even choose a bike I need to know the vague route I'll take due to cc restrictions and the like, so my first question is this:

What kind of route to Asia from Europe is considered passable nowadays? I see three choices.

1. "North", through Russia and down through China (I think that limits me to 250cc)
2. "Central", entering Russia and trying to get through the -stans
3. "South", through Turkey, Iran, Pakistan, India, Burma

All routes go through Thailand and Island hop / ferry through to Papua New Guinea

Has anyone any experience of this kind of trip in the last couple of years? Politically it changes so quick I can't keep up.

I think route 1 is tough, especially when you ride through mongolia and then entering china

Route option 2 will be my primary choice

Route 3 is interesting, but I heard these days it will be difficult or risky to ride through Burma and Myanmar.

Thailand all the way to Indonesia are good, but don't enter Singapore. Jump to Indonesia from Port Klang in Malaysia, to the city of Medan, and ride on all the way to Bali, Flores, Timor and finally Australia.

Safe trip breadlord, enjoy!


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Hi there!

I think the real choke-point with option 2 is that when coming down into India I'd have to go through Kashmir or Afghanistan; neither of which I'm massively comfortable with. I think I'd be happier going through Iran. Not sure the state of the Turkish border at the moment.

British Foreign Office are saying that Burma is pretty much OK as far a security is concerned. Is the problem coming in with a Bike?

Overland it's a choice between Burma and China to Thailand, I think. China's meant to be impossible, so I don't think that's an option.

The other option is to cut out northern India and try to get to Thailand by boat - Or ship the bike and fly from south India.

My thread 'Sep 2017 UK-Bangkok.....anyone?' Has the southern route to Thailand which we'll be doing......in September!!!!

Chris


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Possible route 4 - through Russia .. some 'stands' return to Russia and out to the east coast .. ferry to South Korea and ship to OZ from there. This gives you only one shipment .. other than the ferries. Each time you ship = costs.

All three routes are possible, no.2 would require you to cross a small part of China into Pakistan but as with route 1 you might team up with others to share a guide.
Pakistan visa can be a bit of a problem for Brits but still seems possible and Iran currently requires Brits to have a guide but again you can team up with others. There is no 250cc limit that I know of on any of those routes but both Myanmar and Thailand now require guides.
As to which bike you can do this on anything but a medium sized single or twin cylinder bike is popular and some say best, avoid anything with too much sophistocated electronics.
I would recommend you go the the HU meeting in June and speak to others that are planning or have done this trip, all your questions can be answered there.

Hey Chris,

I'm very very interested in your trip. My flat lease is actually up in September, so I have been thinking that perhaps I will cut it off short. I can spend a month in Europe and meet you before Turkey or something.

I don't think the corridor to Thailand is going to be passable as a single rider, so if you can stand a couple of months with an idiot...

Can you PM or email me (I don't have permissions to PM yet and I'm leery of creating another couple of posts just to get DM rights)

Cheers,
Brad.

Don't be. Most people do it to begin with bier

Plural idiots usually :thumbup1:

There is no need to ride the entire route together ... you will probably have different interests .. not that indulging each others interests is a bad thing .. but it can get boring at some time. Don't let that fester - simply say so. Agree on some meeting point further along the route and do that. Provide more than one contact channel to allow for things that happen. Be prepared to ride back and help if needed. Establish some basic 'rules' (guides) at the start and you'll all enjoy it.

Hey Brad

I'm planning the exact same trip under similar circumstances. I live in Leyton, East London and have wanted to do a big trip for some time. At 35, I decided to finally bite the bullet and hand in my career-break notice for Summer 2017.

I have relatives in Melbourne so this felt like a natural destination.

Bikes in the garage and I'm slowly accumulating gear... but route / visa/ carnet planning is really daunting single handed so would be great to team up with someone else or a group.

Initially thought about route 3 but because of the required guide through Iran, I've mentally settled on route 2. But basically up for anything as long as I get to Oz.

As for Burma, sure I read that boarders are a lot easier to pass these days but the second you need to take your own vehicle in, things get pretty complicated. I think you can take a bike in via the india border but you have to exit the country through the same border. Happy to stand corrected on this one. For this reason, I thought about shipping my bike from India to Thailand.

I work in Holborn and always in East London if you wanted to meet.

Cheers

Chris

Chris46 - you can take your own vehicle in and through Myanmar - as enter from India and exit into Thailand (or opposite) But it requires permits, mandatory guides, approved itinerary, approved accomodation etc. And in addition permits, guides, itineraries are mandatory for Thailand also nowadays. So both of these countries require a bit of planning a good bit of time in advance before you plan to enter. And cost-wise its probably best to arrange a group of travellers to cross together to keep the cost level down. Those guides, permits etc are not cheap!

But it is doable....

All the routes you mention are doable. The 3 biggest headaches nowadays overlanding this route is China, Myanmar and Thailand. All of these countries now requires mandatory guides, permits and lots of red tape. It is however doable but can be very expensive, especially China permits, guides etc are expensive. And it requires a good bit of planning a good bit ahead of when youre planning to enter these countries.

One option to avoid these countries is to ride as far as India or Nepal and fly the bike to Kuala Lumpur - Malaysia. It will of course cost a bit of money to fly the bike this stretch but it still be worth considering.

There will also be two more shippings along the way to reach Australia, namely Malaysia to Indonesia - which is quite straightforward eiter with Mr Lims socalled Onionboats from Penang to Belawan. No big deal as hundreds of overlanders have done this before or another option is a passenger ferry from Port Klang to near Dumai. Several travellers have done this trip lately.
Or even another more adventorous option is to try to get your bike shipped from mainland Malaysia to Borneo and then from Indonesian Borneo (Kalimantan) take a ferry to Java or Sulawesi and continue south from there. Totally doable if you just get your bike from mainland Malaysia to Borneo.

Then the last shipping will be from Dili - East Timor to Darwin Australia. Totally doable but it takes some time and money. You will not be the first person to sweat on your knees in the front yard of Dili Backpackers meticulously cleaning your bike to get it through the very strict australian quarantine inspection.
Alternatively to that last leg is to fly your bike from Jakarta or Bali. Singapore is to be avoided visiting with your own vehicle. Find a place to park it in Malaysia if you wanna go there. Very expensive and very bureucratic!

You mention Papua - but that must be a mistake. There hardly any connection from there to Australia afaik....

And try to get the seasons right too. Riding in torrential rain for weeks aint much fun. Leaving Europe late summer is good. You will avoid the worst heat in southern Europe or central Asia and if you spend some time on the way you will be in southeast Asia in their winter (dry season) nov-april approx. Indonesia is better from april to october. North Australia gets hot and wet in nov-dec usually.

Bikewise - if I was to do such a trip again I would strongly consider a 250 cc. And by all means not bigger than 650 cc.
The lighter the better! And out of Europe something bigger than a 250 would be overkill anyway. Just my 5 cents though.

Good luck with your trip! :thumbup1:

Hey all!

Good news, I've connected up with Chris.W and his group who are going as far as Thailand! I *think* this is up to and including all the "difficult" border crossings and should be able to move on without guides and the like from that point.

I'm still planning on keeping on going to Oz, though. The hard work planning starts this weekend. My nominated specialist subject for the short term is... Pakistan!

Hey Breadlord, I've also sent a message to Chris W and would keen to tie up with your group what's the best way to get in touch?

I'm also working with a few guys doing UK to Bangkok / UK to OZ and New-Zealand, in 2017. We go through Ukraine, Russia, Kazakhstan, Kyrgyzstan, China, Laos, Thailand. It's a good route - in that you can ride those central Asia regions on your own, or as a small group, it's a cheap region to travel through, good roads nowadays, (mainly!) I organise the MotoExplorers trips through China, but also happy to help guys with advice on the Stans, Europe-Russia stages etc. I'd occasionally get a few guys wanting to just hook up to do the 'get through China stage' 27 days, from Torugart/Kashgar to Laos. Unfortunately you also need guides/permits for Laos & Thailand as well now, so guys are tending to try linking up for those as well, we'd plan 12 days Laos to Bangkok. Anyway - happy to hear from anyone if you'd like a bit of advice on The Stans, can pm me, or for an idea of the whole trip I organise, motoexplorer.uk (it's shown as a full 70 day trip, but happy to look at assisting riders on just the China stages / Laos-Thailand)
Dates, we'd cross Europe-Kazakhstan August, China in Sept, enter Laos - Thailand, early October.

Some major points to remember when entering Australia. We have very strict quarantine rules here. When the bike enters Australia (Loose, not crated) it will need to be spotlessly clean and by that I mean as if the bike were brand new off the shop floor, not a speck of dirt anywhere. Quarantine inspectors are from Home Home, they are SS Nazi's when it comes to inspections. If you have the bike crated, the timber must be ISPM15 compliant. The timber will have a stamp on it. Google ISPM15. This stamp indicates that the timber has been treated for any nasty critters that may be in the wood. If you can get hold of a metal crate, do it that way. If you come via East Timor the only way to get to Darwin is through Toll in Dili and they will more than likely place the bike in a sea container uncrated. If the inspectors in Australia find any dirt on the bike you can be sure it will add delays and a major cost to your trip. They will not release the bike until it is cleaned and they will appoint someone to do it for you. If the timber is not ISPM15 compliant they will charge you to have it burnt / destroyed. You have no choice in the matter. If you land the bike in Darwin, the delay could be up to a week and the cost of cleaning your bike will knock you over. Stay Safe and hope this info is of some assistance.

Hi Brad
Are you still all sorted and going as part of larger group as you mentioned earlier ?
I only just found this thread and am flexible to do the full trip Uk to Aus.
Probably a bit late now I guess.
Happy hols


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London to Aussie
 

Hi
I did a similar trip in reverse last year from Singapore to Europe
Check out my website
Cooks Endeavour :: Home
These are countries I crossed in my Toyota Landcruiser

Safe travels

Ray

New Zealand - Singapore – Malaysia – Thailand – Cambodia - Vietnam – Laos - Myanmar – China – Mongolia – Russia – Latvia - Lithuania – Poland - Czech Republic - Hungary – Slovakia – Austria – Sloveni

hi
I'm coming from australia to the TT in june and have bought a one way ticket as i plan to ride back i am thinking the 3rd route but not set in concrete. how is that Pakistan visa looking? i have australian and British passports to travel on as i moved to aus as teenager. i am 35 and have been to the horizons unlimited conference when they came here 2 years ago and been thinking about this trip since everyone was great and i would like to check out the one in june england are you going?, also read jupiters travels for inspiration and have bit the bullet and decided now is the time. would like to link up for part or the whole trip and cut costs with guides and what not. im pretty laid back i have just rode thialand have contacts there and would be keen to do it again. i know all the good spots and my bro lives in melbourne and has a good spot we can crash at,i would be happy to show you around there for a bit. contact me if your keen

Hi all, Maurizio here from Italy.

I'm 57 now and been planning my "RTW" ride since... 17...:frown:
So yes I'm desperate and do envy you guys who can take sabbaticals like that...
On the other hand I've had the opportunity to read, and read, and read...

My comments:
- READ ! There are wonderful trip reports, often in the guise of e-Books you can download on your smartphone with the portable Kindle App.
"The road gets better from here" by Adrian Scott; "The India Ride" by brothers Pyle; "The Wakhan Corridor" by Lawrence Bransby...etc...
- Two experts on Russia and the Himalaya are Italians Marcello Anglana, who has now clocked over one million Km (!) riding back and forth from Italy to Seul, Tokyo etc., and Donato Nicoletti, who has toured the Himalayas and all the 'stans on his old battered 1340cc Harley Low Rider.

Your best possible options to make your way to Australia are:

1. The TranSiberian: London-Moscow-Omsk-Vladivostok (and a lot of other places in between)
https://www.google.it/maps/dir/Londr...43.1198091!3e0

From Vladivostok there's a ferry to Busan, S.Korea, and from there you can ship/sail to Australia.

http://media.indiatimes.in/media/con...23_725x725.jpg

PROS: Once you learn some Russian, it's the only language you'll ever need; Rubles are the only currency you'll ever need; one Russian Visa is the only visa you'll ever need; roads all paved, no mud, no surprises; altitude all between 0 and 1000m on sea level means no need to rejet your bike for high-altitude riding. Siberian Russians are known for exquisite hospitality (really!)
CONS: Once beyond Ekateringburg and the Urals, it's all forest, forest, speeding lorries... oh and did I mention forest...?

2. Silk Road - the Northern Route (as used by Rus amber merchants, but avoiding the war zones in the Ukraine)
This is London-Moscow-Bukhara-Samarqand-Dushanbé-Chinese border

https://www.google.it/maps/dir/Londr...39.6783413!3e0

Then the Chinese stretch all the way to ShangHai where you can crate and ship your bike to Australia

https://www.google.it/maps/dir/Irkes...d31.230416!3e0

https://i.ytimg.com/vi/6dti2Nw8RUs/maxresdefault.jpg

PROS: You see the 'stans without the hassle of going through Iran and Turkmenistan; you visit the Aral Sea (or what's left of it before it evaporates completely)
CONS: Kazakhstan is the meanest ugliest place you'll never want to be as you ride along 2000+Km of solitary, windy, dusty, often unpaved road.

3. Silk Road, the South Route as traditionally seen by Europeans
London-Venice-Istanbul-Tabriz-Teheran-Boukhara-Samarqand-Dushanbé-Chinese border
https://www.google.it/maps/dir/Londr...39.6783413!3e0

The chinese stretch is the same as above.

PROS: You do the REAL SILK ROUTE and SEE ALL THE SIGHTS; Iran is much better than anticipated and NO you do not need a guide, just a Carnet; you can go see the Derweze Burning Crater.

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2013/...54_634x317.jpg

CONS: Waaay too many Visas, Carnets de passage, currency conversions; Chinese Guide is mandatory (Guide+Driver in 4-wheeled vehicle); Turkmenistan is an absolute nightmare.

4. The "Beluchistan Route": so called because it goes across Iranian and Pakistani Beluchistan; it is the route allegedly followed by Alexander the Great on his way back after his defeats along the Indus River

From London to Quetta in Pakistan

https://www.google.it/maps/dir/Londr...31.5546061!3e0

http://i.telegraph.co.uk/multimedia/...g_1683393c.jpg

Then from Amritsar in India to Dakha in Bangladesh you choose your own route; ship the bike from Daka or Calcutta (or Chennai, why not?)

PROS: You visit a lot more of the Iranian sights and soak in all the history and culture, you visit India.
CONS: Beluchistan route uncomfortably near the Afghan border (you may need a military escort or wait for a convoy to shape up); only ONE open border crossing from Pakistan into India - open only a few hours/day! (but the opening/closing cerimonies are worth the visit itself, see youtube videos!)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ATKc65y70hQ

OVERALL... WHICH ? It also depends on the month of the year - you want to STAY AWAY FROM THE RAINY SEASON !

https://usercontent2.hubstatic.com/13033755_f520.jpg

:rain::oops2::rain:

Hi,

If you ride East it would be a shame to miss some amazing places.

Riding only across Russia, especially if you stick to the federal highway, would be similar to go round the M25 for 3 weeks. Round and round! Not much fun and not enjoyable meetings with locals, by the road side, other than local workers who are NOT interested in engaging with you.
Russia is great but you have to get off the main highway to meet great people.

I would recommend to ride the silk road as you will see wonders. There are many variations. In 2014 I picked the less “hassle” (I did not want to deal with Carnet , guides etc… for example) .

Last summer I chose to explore further some very nice parts of Russia and Central Asia.

Countries not to miss / nice to cross:
Turkey (if you follow by the south route)
Georgia. (Armenia looks awesome too).
West Kazakhstan is not very interesting but the East side can take you to very beautiful places in the mountains, if you get a bit off the main highway.
Uzbekistan is fantastic (not to miss Khiva, Bukhara and Samarkand).
Tajikistan and the famous Pamir highway (failed 3 times in last 3 years to get there – was not meant to be!)
Kyrgyzstan (one of my favourite countries!). Stunning roads to explore, amazing mountains passes, lakes, scenic views and challenging tracks if you like that sort of thing….
Russian Altai region, again magnificent to explore.
Mongolia is well worth it too.

As said by others, the easiest way is then to get to Vladivostok and take a ferry to south Korea.
I cannot comment on China and crossing into Pakistan to ride the Karakorum. I have a friend you did and it did look amazing.

You can see pictures and my trips reports from 2014, 2015 and 2016 in my website (link below in my signature I think). Follow the links to my ride reports.
If you come to the HU meeting in Wales I will be doing a presentation on Logistic for Russia and some of the Stans.

Cheers,

Singapore-Europe
 

Hi I recently drove my Toyota Landcruiser from

Singapore – Malaysia – Thailand – Cambodia - Vietnam – Laos - Myanmar – China – Mongolia – Russia – Latvia - Lithuania – Poland - Czech Republic - Hungary – Slovakia – Austria – Slovenia

I had no issues with this route

Safe Travels

[QUOTE=mpescatori;559067]PROS: You do the REAL SILK ROUTE and SEE ALL THE SIGHTS; Iran is much better than anticipated and NO you do not need a guide, just a Carnet; you can go see the Derweze Burning Crater.

[QUOTE]

I'm afraid UK and US passport holders do need a guide for Iran :( Surprisingly, it was something to do with our Governments imposing sanctions doh

We are currently on an around-the-world trip and wanted to go to Iran, but we've decided against it, and are now going North over the Caspian Sea, and then into the 'Stans, Russia and Mongolia. There are no carnets needed, and a lot of the visas are easy to apply for (lots of them are e-visas), save for the Russian visa, which was a bit of a headache. Good luck with the trip, whichever way you go! :thumbup1: