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Shipping 4x4 to Tanzania
Hi. This must be a fairly common situation, but I haven't been able to find an answer on the Hubb. I need to ship my 4x4 to Tanzania in August to begin a 5 month tour of southern africa (I'll be shipping back from SA). I have sorted out the shipping and carnet side of things from the UK, but just received this email from a Tanzanian shipping agent about clearing it in Tanzania: "Dear John, All vehicles imported to be used here for sometimes must be registered. We can not register the car/vehicle without import duties. Thus duties and taxes applies in the same case . Please be advised ASAP. With Best Regards!"
If this is the case, what is the carnet for?! Surely this can't be right? The car is a 1990 landcruiser. It will only be in Tanzania for about a month before driving on to Uganda... Thanks in advance, John |
Thanks Thepinproject. Exactly - it was never my intention to register it Tanzania for a month, so I don't know why they are talking about that (unless, of course, it is to make more money!) Any further info about your charges would be appreciated.
And if anyone else has any Tanzania specific information, that would be great. Surely it shouldn't be that hard??! |
Hi John,
You should expect to pay port fees and various taxes and these can certainly mount up but no you would not be logically paying import duties and registering a vehicle unless you were importing it permanently. It may be a misunderstanding about the fact you're only temporarily importing or it may be a confusion about terminology or even just a straightforward attempt to get you to pay more. I'm afraid shipping into Dar has not got a good reputation. Our agents in the UK said they had had so many issues (theft, corruption and so on) they just wouldn't ship vehicles there anymore. If this aspect is still under consideration then consider Walvis Bay - very efficient with no hint of corruption. Of course you'd have to travel in a loop but that's no real hardship in that area of the world. If Dar is set in stone I suggest you contact these guys - they have shipped into Dar. Home - Drive UK (Tetbury) to SA (Port Elizabeth) |
I'd 2nd Walvis Bay - a much less stressful start to your trip shipping in there and recovering from the flight etc etc.
I spent 3 months in Dar and about 4-5 people shipped in and out, usual hassle and rubbish. Tanzania is a very corrupt country. Just say to the agent they have misunderstood, you are a tourist, the vehicle will be on a Carnet (though you don't need one in Tanzania), and will be removed after x number of weeks from Tanzania. If they don't understand that, or they don't want to, then find another agent as they won't be any good for you or your wallet in the port getting your vehicle out! You will need to pay road tax of about $20 per month when there. And remember the pirates used to roam the seas to steal from innocents who sailed by, now they just sit behind desks in ports. I would imagine it will cost at least $500++ to get your car out of Dar port unless you have paid all costs beforehand with your agent, though don't be surprised if 'all costs' has some more to come ;-p Others survived doing it, don't be rushed, stand your ground, call their bluff and don't pay when you feel under pressure to do so. "Surely it shouldn't be that hard??!" Not if you just pay everything that is asked ;-p If in doubt go and find the head honcho and often they will help a tourist etc |
I would certainly ship into Walvis Bay. Contact me if you want any help there.
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Hi. Thanks to you all for your replies. I'm keen to ship to the East coast as I'm a) planning a separate trip to Ethiopia before meeting the car in Tanzania, and b) worried about the weather in Tanzania/Kenya/Malawi not being good by the time I arrive there (November?) if I set off from Walvis Bay in late August.
Would it be any better (than Dar) to ship to Mombassa? If I did decide to ship to Namibia, do you know what is the position with regard to re-entry into countries? I was thinking one possibility would just be to drive as quickly as possible from Walvis Bay to Tanzania so as to start in Tanzania around my target date, but then that would mean re-entering at least Zambia and Namibia on the return journey (I will be shipping home from Namibia or SA). Is re-entry a problem vis a vis the carnet or visa? Can a new visa just be bought each time, or is it more difficult if you are returning for a second time? And would the carnet just get another page stamped? Finally, do you think it would be cheaper to clear customs in Walvis Bay than Dar? It sounds like there should at least be fewer bribes to pay... I'm not sure how the actual shipping costs compare as between Dar (I've been quoted about £1400 for a container) and Walvis Bay, but I'll check. Thanks again, John |
Hello John,
i dont think there is any problem to re-entry.In Walivs Bay you dont pay bribes.Go to TransWorldCargo.I was very happy with them. Regards Mike |
You can come and go as you like, no worries, did some countries 3 times etc. If they ask, just say you loved it so much and the people were so friendly, your favourite country etc. No problem at all.
Dar - very humid and hot, dangerous (muggings etc), corrupt and unorganised - no huge worries, but a confusing place to get off a plane and try and get a vehicle out of a port thats all. Walvis Bay - thought I was back in NZ, very 'civilised', high quality accommodation and food (or cheap camping), nice climate in August in all of Namibia, dry season perfect for game parks in Namibia, Botswana and they are 20% of the price of those in Tanzania (north) and Kenya and much nicer experience. Professional port, will also be expensive (all ports are) but no back handers needed in the chain of payments (probably). Crime is very bad in Windhoek, and you need to be careful on the coast here as well. Best time of the year to be in Namibia, Botswana and SA for animals is July to October as it gets really dry and you see hundreds of animals around the desert water holes etc. Personally I'm not fussed if I ever go back to Tanzania or Kenya, but definitely plan to spend more months in Namibia and Botswana. Anyway, either option will work, probably, we are just sharing our experiences and trying to give you a better, or cheaper or more enjoyable option. I'd ship to Walvis or Cape Town as its an easy and fun start to any trip. From Walvis to Dar would be 6-9 days of driving at 8 hours a day, all on sealed roads, but with radar gun police, potholes, trucks, animals and a few borders etc. |
I don't know anyone who's shipped to Mombasa. However, I suspect it won't be any better than Dar. By no means impossible to navigate but essentially more of a third world experience.
As Roaming Yak says no problems re-entering countries multiple times. You won't need a visa for SA/Nam/Bots (or Malawi) anyway and as it is a single customs union you only need get the carnet stamped when you enter the union and when you leave it. You are allowed up to 90 days in each of SA, Nam and Bots in any one year. If you were to stay in SA for, say, 30 days and then returned they may only give you a visa for 60 (rather than 90 again) but more often than not they don't really care. I have friends who have stayed out there for years. It is peak time for the parks in the area which is good but does mean they'll be busy so if you do decide to do it this way round look into that asap. I'd contact this lady tara@ngami. net She runs a travel company (Botswana Footprints) but for the moment will arrange bookings for campsites in Bots for free which could save you a LOT of of time and trouble (dealing with the multiple operators and DNPW is a real pain). As regards the weather further north you can pretty much bet on the rains arriving in Malawi (and Zambia) in mid November. Once you get into east Africa it is a different weather system. Strictly speaking the short rains are due in November/December but they may well come to nothing or very little. Actually like RY I preferred the game viewing in southern Africa. The camping experience is much nicer (ie you can camp in the bush rather than in a campsite full of rowdy tourists) and you can afford to stay a little longer which in my view makes all the difference as you get the lie of the land and your sightings improve immeasurably. |
Mombasa is Kenya, so you need a Carnet. If you had one, I'd chose Kenya over Tanzania regarding a port: better English, more 'educated' people, probably more organised and professional - but also more sophisticated corruption if any ;-)
This is based on my time in the countries, talking to people who live and work there and from my time in hospitals in both Dar and Nairobi. Somebody I know is shipping to Mombasa in 6 weeks time - people do it and its fine ;-) I spent 3 months in Dar and people managed in and out with vehicles usually taking about 3-5 days. I wouldn't book anything in any of the parks, adds too much stress. Turn up when your ready. Plenty of good camping right outside the parks for a much cheaper price (campsites in Nam/Bots have all be privatised, expect to pay 40 euros per night for 2 people - 10 outside the Park). If you want some 'camping with the animals action' camp to the west of Etosha (Lions around my landy every night) and in any of the 'cut lines' in Botswana. Though have a plan to be able to piss in a bottle if your surrounded by elephants or buffalo in the morning! I spent 6 months in Nam/Bots/Kruger over the apparent peak period, and during the soccer world cup in South Africa and didn't notice any problems at all apart from Southern Kruger where campsites were sometimes 'full' but space was always found when I explained I was from NZ on a long trip etc Namibia is also very beautiful - I found Tanzania and Kenya to be fairly ordinary scenery wise and the national parks a huge rip off except southern Tanzania where there are very few tourists compared to the rugby scum up north. |
Thanks everyone. It sounds like there's a good case for shipping to Namibia!
The UK shipping agent I've been talking to is First Base Freight. Does anyone have any experience of them? Mike, I will get in touch with Trans World Cargo in Namibia too. I haven't totally ruled out Dar, but Namibia is sounding like the smarter choice. The fewer headaches at the start the better! John |
We use John Good Shipping as agents and MACS as carrier. Used them for all 4 return journeys and can't fault either.
Margaret |
I had a similar experience in 2009 when I enquired about the possibility to send my Landy to Dar: the clearing agent requested US$700++ just for the customs clearance and US$2500 for duty, they had no idea about the CdP... The whole thing convinced me to pass...
I do not have experience on Mombasa but I suppose it may be better, hard to find a place worse than TZ... Cheers |
Thanks. Yes, I've decided to stay away from Dar, particularly as the only agent there who got back to me has now sent me a second email saying that I need to pay 100% of the vehicle value in import duty!!
I do have a query regarding the Carnet though - I'm confused about which countries need it and which don't. The HU info (Carnet de Passages en Douanes - List of countries where it is Required | Horizons Unlimited) says that it's basically needed for all of southern Africa (TZ, Namibia etc etc), but is this info out of date?? I'd be prepared not to enter Kenya if that meant I could do away with the Carnet... John |
Hi John,
I have just recently shipped a 4x4 into WB, and I have some contacts there, let me know if I can help? Cheers, Ib. |
Sorry but, yes, you do need a CdP.
Cheers |
Thanks, I thought as much.
Viking, did you ship from the UK? If so, who did you use for the shipping? And who was your clearing agent in WB? Did you use RoRo or container? John |
Hi John,
No, I shipped out of Lisbon in Portugal, in a 20 foot container with a company called Macs. They are well known, and also ship out of the UK. Foleys Overland in the UK are using them also, as an alternative they can take care of the whole thing for you, top company. I did it all myself, with the help of the Portuguese leg of Macs. Cost 2200 US$, and took a couple of weeks. They work with a company in WB, called Manica. Very good, and there's a super fellow called Max Benade (max.benade@wfs.com.na +264 81 124 7520) he got my Land Rover out of the port on a Saturday, during a strike.....in his free time! To clear a 20 foot is about 900-1000 US$, depending on how much you have already paid, when shipping out. WB is very efficient, everything works and everyone knows what they are doing. Make sure to check your passport if you go though......long story. I'll be there in August, going up north and into Botswana/Zambia. Cheers, Ib. |
I've received one quote from First Base Freight of £2190 to ship a 20ft container to from UK to Walvis Bay. This is a lot more than I was hoping it would be, but equally I'm not keen on roll on off.
I'm waiting for 2 other quotes to come back - one from MACS (via John Good as UK agent), and one from Russells Freight. Does anyone have a view on what a "reasonable" price from the UK to WB is? I was initially encouraged by the cost of shipping RoRo at £780 (which was cheaper than RoRo to TZ), but the container quote is a lot more than to TZ... :( |
Hi John,
Try and contact Paul (top bloke) at Foleys, they ship all the time. I got outstanding service from them. I currently have two tires in transit with them to WB..... Cheers, Ib. |
Thanks Viking. I'll give him a call. John
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We used Foley's too.
As I recall it was not far off that amount in 2008 though ... However, if Foleys have stuff to ship out too (like Viking's tyres for example) they will contribute to the cost. Quite a few things came out in our container. |
We're currently travelling north through Africa, initially intending to go from Cape Town to Cairo, but with Egypt still looking uncertain we are looking into other exit strategies. I read your comments about Dar being a nightmare, so maybe Mombasa is a better option to ship our car back to the UK. Does anyone have a shipping contact there?
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My Toyota is now safely sealed up in a container bound for Walvis Bay. It should arrive on 3 September.
I have been reading other threads about insurance, and it sounds like 3rd party insurance in Namibia is automatically provided through a fuel duty supplement. My agent in Namibia has said that more comprehensive insurance is available but at a cost - about 10% of the vehicle value! I'm guessing most people just use the free third party cover? On another note, I haven't yet worked out how to get a permit for the skeleton coast - I want to go as far north as Terrace Bay, abd understand I need a permit to get up there. Sounds like a transit permit can be got in Swakopmund, but only with an accommodation booking in Terrace Bay - and what's the best way to get the accommodation booking in Terrace Bay??? I have emailed a website called "Madbookings" who advertise camping there, but am waiting to hear back. From other sources I've read it sounds like camping is not an option in Terrace Bay anyway. Does anyone have any other suggestions? I'm then planning to exit east via Springbokwasser and then continue north to Kaokoland. Finally, does anyone have a recommendation for a nice campsite near Walvis Bay? Thanks! |
Hi John,
As all our camping gear is stored in the car during its journey to Walvis Bay we have always opted for a little self catering flatlet called Ana's Inn. There is camping along by the lagoon which also has self catering but at a price. Permits for Terrace Bay are available from the Namibian Tourist Board but are only valid during the summer months as far as I am aware. There is camping at Henties Bay and also at 3 mile along the coast. After leaving the tar road and travelling inland you will find camping at Palmwag and Khorixas. Do you T4A on your Gps? they also produce excellent paper maps full of detail. Margaret (will give you more details if you want them) |
Thanks Margaret
So do you think it's not possible to get to the Springbokwasser gate from the coastal road outside the summer months? And would I need a permit to get to Henties Bay? I had hoped to get further up the coast road, but it sounds like I may need to turn inland at Henties Bay. Is it necessary to pre book camping there? The self catering flat sounds like a nice idea while we wait for the car to arrive... |
Sorry John I must not have made myself very clear - let's start again! After leaving Walvis you can travel north on the salt road through Henties Bay at any time of year without a permit till you reach the Springwasser gate. At that point you buy the permit to travel through the 'park' both north and also eastwards at Torra bay on the C39 towards Palmwag etc . It is Terrace bay where the camping is limited.
If you would like the details of Ana's Inn I will p.m.them to you. Margaret |
Quote:
You may do a google search to locate them. Hope it helps. Cheers |
Hi Margaret. Thanks for clarifying, but looking at the map I am still unsure about this - do you mean you can continue north of Henties Bay without a permit as far as the Ugab gate (rather than Springbokwasser gate)? From what I've read you need a permit to go any further up the the coast than the Ugab. And is it possible to get a permit to transit through from Ugab, turning east before Torra Bay onto the C39 and exiting by the Springbokwasser gate, without an overnight reservation? It sounds like camping is only open in Torra Bay from Dec to Jan, and as you say, there don't appear to be camping options in Terrace Bay. It doesn't look too far to drive from the Ugab gate to Springwasser gate in a day though - if it's allowed! And yes, it would be great if you could PM me the details of Ana's Inn. Thanks, John
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Right John. Out now till mid afternoon but will pm you then.
Where are you? I'll also give you my phone no as it is sometimes easier to talk than write. Margaret |
Great, thanks. I look forward to hearing from you. I'm still in the UK until the end of the month.
John |
Hi John,
I was just trying to do what you want to do, only a few months ago! The camping in the park is only open Dec and Jan, when there’s some big fishing tournaments going on. The permits for the park are quite expensive….but you can get a transit permit for free, that will allow you to be in there all day. They are issued at the gates. Not much to hang around in WB for, in Swakop there’s several campings, in my opinion by far the best is Alter Bruge. My truck is currently in Swakop and I’m flying down there on the 26th of Aug. Planning on travelling some more in Namibia, then across to Zambia and Botswana. If you would like to hook up somewhere for a couple of coldies, that would be fun. I would not recommend to travel too much on the coast alone, without another truck with a winch……you also have to take care with fuel going up north. Take lots of cash, as the petrol stations don’t take cards. I’m in a Defender 110, with all the gear….been driving all over the world but don’t know too much about Africa. When you enter Namibia, make sure you check your passport and entry stamp to see if they gave you the time that you asked for. I did not, and sat 3 days in jail in WB…….. Ask away if I can help further… Cheers, Ib. |
Thanks for the info Viking! Good tips. I've kind of resigned myself to a making day trips with a transit permit. I'll try to find another vehicle to tag along with further up into Kaokoland. I was expecting to pick up my Landcruiser in WB on 3 Sept, but just had an email from the shipping company saying that it's now due in on 9 Sept(??). But either way I hopefully won't be too far behind you - I'm also planning on working my way through Botswana and Zambia, en route to northern Mozambique, hopefully before it gets too wet over there... It would definitely be good to knock back a few brews with you somewhere. I'll keep you posted on my whereabouts. I've travelled quite a lot, but not in Africa and not with a car, so this is all going to be new for me. I nearly got stuck in Russia overstaying on a visa earlier this year, so that's something I'll pay particular attention too! Jail time in WB is not on my agenda...
Cheers, John |
Hi John,
I had a crack at it last time, but difficult and expensive unless you stay out of the park. The lodge inside will not let you camp....but theres plenty of places between WB and the south gate of the park, where you can camp on the beach for free or very little. You can then continue inland and up north, the tracks are very good. My (very lose as always) plan at the moment is to drive down to Sossusvlei, from there to Windhoek to pick up my new tires, then up north to Kunene all the way to Epupa. From there on trying to follow the Angolian border to the Caprivi strip and further into Botswana. Last fuel going north is in Opuwo, and depending on how much you want to do, you'll need to carry a fair bit of fuel. My truck was also a little delayed arriving in WB, happens! Did you find a good clearing agent? As mentioned Max is a top bloke, very dedicated to the job. I'm an ex RTW biker, I did an almost 3 year trip back in the early 90'ies, before all the GPS/computer/mobile phone crap came around....but only touched Africa back then in Egypt. Would be cool to meet up and swap some stories, Namibia is a great place to be with your 4X4, look forward to it! Did a trip through Russia myself back in 2010, on route to Mongolia. Loved that country Mongolia, will go back there some day. I'll PM you my local number, once I get one in NAM. Cheers, Ib. (that is actually my full name...Ib.) |
Thanks Ib. I did think that was an abbreviation for something! If you let me have your local number, I'll give you a shout when I get into WB (should be 8 Sept). My planned route is basically the same as yours but with a detour to Etosha: Palmwag-Kunene-Epupa-Etosha-Caprivi-Botswana. If we could hook up for any of it, that would be good. Agreed re Mongolia - I can't wait to get back there some day. Stay in touch, J
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Hi John,
Yep, that name have given me nothing but trouble! I'm flying back to NAM tomorrow, and I'll let you know when I have a new number. Your route sounds good, but I'm not sure if they will let you in at the Galton gate (western gate) as that part of the park is only for Namibian tour operators. You can try, otherwise you can drive further onto the Anderson gate. You can buy a very good map of the park in the Okaukuejo camp. See you down there! Cheers, Ib. |
Hi John,
I have send you a PM with contact details, currently in Windhoek doing some work to the truck, but will travel up north soon. Cheers, Ib. |
All, Useful info, thanks.
Our vehicle wont get to Cape Town till about end Oct (due to some transport issues we've had). Our (revised) plan is to spend November till mid December in Southern then Northern Namibia (incl Etosha, Opuwo, Caprivi); then Northern Botswana end of December; return to S Africa (Cape Town to Durban route -ish) for Jan / Feb; before heading to Vic Falls March; and Zambia to Tanzania March / April. Trying to avoid wet season before we head north to Uganda. We realise that this is possibly not the best timing, but those are the cards we've been dealt. Any thoughts? |
Hi guys,
Glad your plans are coming together. We spent three years avoiding the rain. It is possible! This is what I'd bear in mind: Rainy season in Southern Africa (ie SA, Namibia, Botswana, Zambia, Malawi) is mid November to mid April. January and February see the heaviest rain. This does not apply to: a) the very south of SA (where November to March are the driest months with only 2 or 3 days rain a month on average), or b) parts of Eastern Africa eg northernTanzania and most of Kenya which have short rains in Nov/Dec and long rains in March to May/June ie Jan and Feb are, in theory at least, dry. This is the most popular time to visit the game parks in E Africa. So that means that during this period you can escape the rain in the very south of the area you're talking about or for Jan and Feb you can escape it in the very north ie Tanzania. Rainy season will have a bigger impact in some areas than others. For example, it may be a good idea to limit your time in the more off-road destinations as you will get plenty of mud and camping isn't such fun. It won't have much of an impact on you if you're traveling on tar. Some parts of the area you are talking about are desert and see little rain even in wet season so consider spending plenty of time in the middle of the wet season in these areas (eg the Kalahari). South African school holidays have a massive effect on the availability of accommodation esp in game parks. These run from early Dec (6th or so) until mid Jan. You will find it hard to get into game parks during this period and they will be heaving (personally I would avoid Botswana in late Dec, same goes for Etosha or Kruger. If you do want to be there then check availability/book now). For us this area is largely about the game viewing. If you're the same then get to some good areas as soon as you arrive. A couple of weeks after the rains start - lets say by late Nov - there will be enough water deep in the bush to make it much harder to see game and access will get trickier. If game viewing is important to you I would think about heading straight to Botswana and saving Nambia until it's wetter. Etosha is a good game park to save until the rains as the roads are all weather. Similarly KTP (Kgalagadi Transfrontier Park) is also still good in the wetter weather. It is a doddle to check availability/book SA parks online (go to SAN Parks website). It harder to book spots in Namibia and harder again in Bots (but I have the email of a nice lady in Maun who will do it for free ...). Have fun planning. |
Thanks for the info 38, good to know!
John, I have just today found out that one needs a Cross Border Permit, and it's only issued in Windhoek,,,,,,,,,went and got mine today 220 NAM Dollars. Apparently the fine for not having one when going through roadblocks or crossing the border is 1000 NAM Dollars,,,,,,,,have gone through some roadblocks already, and nobody asked for it,,,,the border might be different! Got a mate in Windhoek who can get one for you if you want, you don't have to show up in person,,,,,,,, Cheers, Ib. |
You can buy the Cross Border Permit at any border crossing into Namibia as well as at the road authority office in Windhoek.
Margaret |
Hi Margaret,
That´s correct, but when you ship into WB you can´t buy it there for some reason......not sure if you can get it LEAVING Namibia...... Cheers, Ib. |
We had the same issue shipping into WB ie it wasn't possible to buy a cross border permit. We bought it in Windhoek - no issues.
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Thanks all.
Ib, I have sent you a PM. John |
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