Adventure or Extreme Motorcycling?
 

Without detracting from Ted Simon and all before, the modern term Adventure Motorcycling should reasonably belong to the brothers Vince, et all, from 15 years ago. But it is generally credited to Chris Scott in his books using this in the title. His introduction starts “What is Adventure Motorcycling? As far as I am concerned it involves a challenging unsupported journey into the wilderness or a significantly strange country”.

Since then interest has increased exponentially as a result of increasing restlessness, leisure time, image and the publicity of the odd celebrity trying a hand (or wheel) at it. This has led to Joe Public’s usual response being “Oh, like those two actors” when talking about any trip beyond tarmac.

Not only have numbers of participants increased but also firms supplying vehicles, equipment, clothing, stories via DVD, books or downloads, etc. - all using the expression Adventure Motorcycling. It is around us everywhere, yet not fully deserved any more if considering the original concept.

The expression Adventure Motorcycling is becoming too broad and diluted a term. It is now generally far removed from Chris’s description and used by travellers, posers and suppliers alike to present or describe almost any journey that involves going outside of the M25. I suspect the greatest percentage of equipment never goes far from where it is sold, probably the Home Counties of England, other that a run down the A7 to the sun - or for the really adventurous, the alternative N7.

Should we leave the expression Adventure Motorcycling to where it is now mostly used, the marketing and posers, and those truer to the original idea of “unsupported journeys into the wilderness” start to use another term?

How about kicking off with the suggestion of "Extreme Motorcycling"?

"" Extreme Motorcycling "" brings to mind young guys on moto cross bikes performing stunts that involve aerial acrobatics .

Not quite what this site is about !

How about Overland Motorcycling ?
[Mind you it's a bit hard to do it over water .]

I think that most are comfortable with whatever you'd like to label it and wouldn't feel threatened by others enjoying their pastime whether a poseur or a 'real' adventurer.

That said, as one who might reasonably be labelled "poseur", I'd be interested to understand your definition of "the original idea of unsupported journeys into the wilderness”.

That was Chris's definition, but I interpret -

-'unsupported journeys' to be just the rider(s) and what they have, without a series of 4x4s in tow containing mechanics, translators, spares, heavy equipment, medics, fixers, etc. Riders having to primarily rely on their own ability and ingenuity to get them through and deal with immediate problems.

-'wilderness' to be somewhere where the infrastructures of modern life and civilisation are not abundant. Out of ones normal environment, perhaps.

Okay.

So are you just saying drop the "significantly strange country" from the definition? Just trying to understand the proposition.

How about 'gone riding'.

Does a weekend trip to North Wales count then?:innocent:

Tony you trying to rattle a few cages.
Its a funny thing cos I did a few biggish trips in the late 70s (for me at that time they were well out of my norm or comfort zone these days they are nothing more than tourist runs anyway - probably were back then but felt big at the time in my tender years ) I have also pushed out in different directions since the late 90s some places were true wilderness or very Alien but were great fun or experiences.

I may be old fashioned but back then as now I called it touring on a motorbike. Is this not all it is. Add all the bolt on bits the buzzy lingo whatever really its just touring - maybe off the beaten track a bit but touring all the same.

So I propose we could call it Motorcycle touring - quite gritty don't you think.

Back in my younger days, I was heavily into downhill skiing. Would miss maybe 10 days in the season. Back then, where we were going and what we were doing, we just called it 'skiing'. It's just what we did.

Now I see it on tv, and they call it 'EXTREME SKIING!!!'. Guess it's important in this 'hey, look at me' society that is going on in the western world. Twitter is a prime example of this, I think...telling the world that you're going for groceries.

I don't get it myself, so I just say: 'I'm going riding'.

EXTREME GROCERY SHOPPING !!!!! Yay -- Way To Go !!!!

You must have met my wife :rofl:

I'm with Adventure 950 on this. When I started in the early 70's it was just bike touring. Not that many people were doing it, there wasn't any suppliers infrastructure or really any suitable bikes. I went up the Todra Gorge in Morocco on a loaded up GoldWing because I didn't know any better.
The "adventure" bit seems to have come in when companies realised there was a market to be sold to. Make you feel that you're out "on the edge where few people go" and you're more likely to buy whatever it is they're trying to sell you. Specialised cutting edge activities need specialised equipment, right?

I think it is really important not to become elitist about bike travel.

There will always be people that like all the gear more than the adventure and there will always be someone willing to go for that little bit longer or to a stranger place than you.

The important bit is the fact that they are doing it and on two wheels.

My two cents worth..

I agree that you shouldn't get hung up on titles. I've got into this late after years of doing a bit of walking. I'd class what I did as backpacking - walking, climbing and camping for days/weeks in 'wilderness' areas, using my own resources (no GPS!!). Yet 'backpacking' is also the term used for people who travel the world staying in backpacker hostels - quite a different thing - so I'd always say I was 'going for a walk'. I just loved the challenges and and although I've only just started this game, there are many similarities, and I'm now looking forward to doing a bit of riding.

I never had 'all the gear' either (or certainly never last seasons)- always too broke!! "Adventure" and "Extreme" are just marketing tools that sell. The danger of that is that it is selling a dream; 'buy all the gear and you too can do it', but of course, as we all know, there's a little bit more to it than that.

Go to the top of the page and look at the banner on the left.....it sums it up perfectly.

HORIZONS UNLIMITED
The website MOTORCYCLE TRAVELLERS trust.

That's what we are, plain and simply, no matter what or where you ride.

We all like to compete a bit, be part of a teams, groups that like to be seen to be 'in' and those who define themselves as being on the 'outside' but I think the quote above is more about humans trying to look more confident but actually becoming more insecure. When you meet people we usually try 'to make a good impression' but this idea could actually be distorted into 'being what you think other's want you to be' and that doesn't sound good.

So the idea of labeling travelling around on motorcycles has less to do with taxonomy and more to do with a generally increasing level of insecurity (possibly heightened by effective marketing techniques).

How about using the term "Holiday" if you HAVE to call it something.

Personally I hate labels so as I am concerned you can call it anything you like ("Bob" perhaps)

I can follow the OP train of thought easily enough, there are plenty of mobile touratech adverts out there who seem to miss the point. I was waiting for a ferry when a pair turned up and spotted my Dragon/Elefant/finnish rally stickers. The first question was why did I put the stickers on the Bonneville when I'd need a GS or KTM to do those. These two had been on their trial run for their big trip to Brugge!

My intial thought was to label them as ******s. Then I thought, what the heck, if they enjoy themselves spending £20K for a week in Spain before they go back to playing power rangers on sunny Sundays who really cares. My only worry is that anyone interested in real travelling might be put off by their insistance that you need three GPS's between two and a yellow painted aluminium thingy to hold your butties. That I guess is where this site comes in.

I'm with the guys who suggest "Motorcycle Touring". "Extreme" anything (the possible exception of ironing) will just attract Bill and Ted lookalikes who''ll want to wear orange and ride in circles.

Andy

I agree, I have always considered all my trips away from home to be "touring". But then, that is because thats what they were :)

Did anyone else read that in the voice of Edmund Blackadder or was it just me ?

If you really are into extreme ironing.....
Extreme Ironing World Championships

I'll drink to that. Personally I don't give a monkey's ballbag what anyone else wants to define me as - assuming anyone could give a flying bugger in the first place.

But if I'm caught in some sort of moral or social dilemma, I do tend to use the maxim "well, I am on holiday" to decide the issue.

Cheers

I think you'll find that A/M started long, long before T/Simon and the brothers Vince, despite the excellence of their travels. But they wrote or filmed it better than many before them. You must check this out, and find a world of travel by bike you never dreamed of. There are accounts out there of what earlier riders did. If you've been at Ripley, then you won't have missed Paul Pratt, who travelled by bike in a way which is gone forever. He may not write as well as others, but he did in circumstances which would daunt some modern travellers. There's Elspeth Beard,and a few other women riders, there's the "One Man Caravan " bloke, and a number of others. And I don't refer to only RTW, for motorcycle adventure certainly doesnt depend on that. More can be better, but it's surely not necessary for a fulfilling trip. I've suggested before that if you scribe a 3000km circle from a place in Western Europe,say from Edinburgh or Swansea, you'll find a treasure of places to go which tick the box.

The definition given of A/M, however now corrupted, still stands, IMO. Those who pay someone to take them on a tour certainly have fun, but have no adventurous journey, rather like voyeurs in a peep show, who never get 'the full monty". Commercial tours in motorcycling (or mountaineering*) are the corrupting element.

*See John Krakeur's "Into Thin Air" to see how destructive commercialism can be.

I like to think of it as "going out for a bit of a ride". Call me cynical if you want, but isn't this just a way to make a difference between them and us. And in doing so to somehow make us feel more superior to them.

I'm sorry but as far as I'm concerned we're riders, and one person's piss about in the park is another person's adventure. Just because you don't find it challenging doesn't mean it won't be the biggest challenge of another's life.

Extreme is for ironing, and damn fun extreme ironing is too.

:thumbup1:+1 to all of you .

It's been said. Period.

Now I'm buyin'...who's up for a beer:mchappy:

PS.: labelling or not, live what you want.

Well there you are....sitting in Hampi as a half dozen guys on a Royal Oilfield tour roll in . They are sent into a restaurant, then 'given' 2 hours to look at Hampi, and then ordered back to their hotel in Hospet, a particularly crappy town. Their whole trip is like this.


Points against...

They dont meet any locals, for they speak only to each other.
They are told where and when to do things
They pay a lot of money
They have no independence whatsoever

Points for...

well you tell me, cos I havent found any yet

They don't lay awake a night thinking about what happens when the Bullet eats it's bottom end, the only car that stops to help contains four large blokes with machettes and a bale of opium and one of them obviously fancies you? When the bike throws it's toys out of the pram or the local mafia turns up, or the border is run by a bloke who hasn't had his leg over this century, the tour company earns it's money. It's a different sort of holiday, one that I've tried and would never reccomend unless people realise it's like going to Euro-Disneyland not Paris. Disneyland suits some people though, I think the only time I might have a problem is when some holiday maker thinks he's Ted Simon because he hired a Harley in Florida, but you get ****wits in any hobby.

One of my co-workers informed me on the last day at work before the holidays that I must have larger than average genitalia (or words to that effect) due to the fact I ride twelve miles a day through snow and ice. I wonder if I can now get a T-shirt proclaiming that I'm an "Extreme-Adventure-Commuter" :rofl:

Andy

This is absolutely spot on. That's one for the plus list:thumbup1:

"Nevva, in the field of motorcycling, have so many bottom ends been eaten by so many for so few kilometres."

:clap:

You could be onto something there, "Extreme Commuting" could become the next big thing, and think of all the marketing opportunities.

I can see it now:

" Be it a CX500 or C90, CommuterTrek can supply all your Extreme-Adventure-Commuting needs. New for 2010 we have pre-dirtied semi-flourescent vests with a choice of Railway company logos. Our range of pre-filled ex-pizza delivery box carriers have now been extended to include ham and pineapple, calezone or even desicated rat......pre-scratched mirrors and engine bars.......spray on road filth.......live the dream, for a few hundred quid you too can be a dispatch rider or pizza guy lookalike twice a day every day (except weekends and bank holidays)!"

Andy

LOL
Love it!

A quick online search for the definition of "Adventure" produces this:
ad·ven·ture (http://img.tfd.com/hm/GIF/abreve.gifd-vhttp://img.tfd.com/hm/GIF/ebreve.gifnhttp://img.tfd.com/hm/GIF/prime.gifchhttp://img.tfd.com/hm/GIF/schwa.gifr)n.

1. a. An undertaking or enterprise of a hazardous nature.
1. b. An undertaking of a questionable nature
2. An unusual or exciting experience
3. Participation in hazardous or exciting experiences
4. A financial speculation or business venture.

v. ad·ven·tured, ad·ven·tur·ing, ad·ven·tures
v.tr.
1. To venture upon; undertake or try.
2. To expose to danger or risk; hazard.
v.intr.
1. To take a risk; dare.
2. To proceed despite risks.

So if what you are doing is hazardous, questionable, exciting and risky then it is an adventure!

For me riding to Taoz in Southern Morocco was an adventure, yet I had a book of routes to follow, GPS, a credit card and a mobile phone.

Perhaps if I'd done it without any of the modern gadgets it'd have been more adventurous, but then, I enjoy those things so would it have been as much fun for me?

Dunno. Each to their own. Personally, anything outside Europe or the States would count as an adventure to me.

I'll go with this one;

1. b. An undertaking of a questionable nature.

:blushing:

Brilliant Cam " Royal Oilfield" I will be using that one a lot. How's Hampi? We'll be there around the 6th, without tour guide or Oilfields :thumbup1:

Pete & Caf

This is my third reply ! they keep being eaten.

I sent a lot of info but its gone, so

rent a moped beside the temple for 140 rups.(15 sq kms of temples etc!)
thalis in Hampi bazaar for 35-50 rups.
see the temple elephant bathing each morning in the river
beers on the other side, 15 rup ferry, stops at dusk.
Hospet sucks
Train to Goa (Vasco de Gama/Margaon) 6.30 am but usually late coming in from Calcutta.

Namaste from Goa:palm::Beach::scooter:

That covers the ride to work then!

You can have an adventure in Scotland or Wales and I can certainly see that riding the trails in Southern Morocco is a bigger adventure still (I've done nothing bigger or better for sure). Even the blokes riding the tour company Bullets were doing more than I'd guess most had done before. All good stuff.

What I think does alternately make me smile or want or hit someone is people give themselves inflated titles based on some deed that in most cases has been done plenty of times before. I met a guy who was planning on writing a book because he was going to the North Cape. Like the idiot I am I assumed he was going in January on a C90 or was planning to list all the decent hotels, campsites and bars along the way. He was a little put out when I said I'd done that route and it was really just a nice road ride. The book of course never appeared as far as I know and I'm sure amongst his mates he's now known as Mr Extreme-Adventure-road tourer, but amongst some of the company here abouts I don't think his book would sell!

Now my mate at work who thinks I'm a cross between Sir Ranulph Feins and Dougie Lampkin because I don't put my bike away from September to April, he'd be impressed by the North Cape. What I'd want to do though is get Steve to load a plastic fuel can on the back of his CBR and ride there, not encourage thinking that he needs to buy a GS and do the anti-kidnap training. I think titles like extreme and adventure just bring out the people with questionable motives and attitudes? ?c?

Andy