All the kit, or what?
 

The same old question.


Ride with all the kit or just what you think is good for the day?


Some will say all the kit all the time. Other's what I feel good in, on the day. Of course there's distance to be taken in to account, and weather. Hot very hot and cold. Is a full set of leather's in 30/40 degrease of heat. A good idea? Or dress down so you don't over heat. The min I will wear is. Kevlar jean's. Gloves, Boot's, and a long sleeve top. I must admit, that the long sleeve top is usually a long sleeve thermal vest and wool or thick cloth top.


A lot better than short's flip flop's and a vest. I have also noticed that with all the kit, I kind of slip in to power ranger mode. Less kit and I ride a lot gentler. So there is something to say for the less kit approach.
John933

I know I should wear the same gear when touring Vietnam that I wear in OZ but I find that being comfortable, and not overheating is just more important.
I do wear a shorty helmet, hi top sneakers(to be replaced with a more bike orientated type) ,long but light pant, shirt +denim jacket, leather gloves. Thats touring.
Around town its do as the locals do,helmet,tshirt,shorts,sandels,gloves and then proceed with great care and attention. That's worked out fine for the 40.000+ kl done in country so far.
Hoping I haven't jinxed myself doh
Cheers, Macca

The thing with naked skin is... Is the first contact with the ground. So in my book's any thing is better than zip. And two layer's are better than one. You'll get some gravel rash. But not half as much if you have no cover. Boot's I can't get over not wearing boot's? "O" well that's just me.
John933

Every town throughout tourism asia, has a line up of fools that ride in their flip flops, singlet & shorts. Oh, and don't forget the bandages that the 'lucky' ones get to wear doh

When touring in Asia, it is kevlar cargo pants, Keen sandals(enclosed toes) & a DriRider vented jacket for both myself & wife. Buy good quality helmets when we get there & then leave them behind with the rental crowd :thumbup1:
Naturally, other rides & climates require evaluation:scooter:

Locally I wear the full kit all year round !

After removing skin from most of my body in a single crash i know where "all the gear" and if its to hot outside to wear it i watch TV with a pint with the AC on max.

Mezo.beer

There may be some regional variation in this but commenting on it from a UK perspective I've read (and heard) time and time again people saying they wear the full protective ensemble everywhere they go, all the time, and that anyone who doesn't is foolhardy, shortsighted and irresponsible. And in the middle of a UK winter I have some sympathy with wearing clothing appropriate for the conditions. :freezing: :rain:

It's when the snow finally melts and the thermometer emerges from a block of ice that the problems arise. On a hot day is it safer to keep wearing winter grade clothing for its protective value and raise the risk of having an accident through heatstroke or "strip off" to maintain mental functioning and hope you don't have an accident ?

When I've spoken to many of the "safety first - keep it on" advocates hardly any of them have ever ridden outside the UK. They have no idea how hot it can get in eg southern Spain / Italy. You might be able to survive 20 /25C of the UK summer ok but 40C is a different matter. I have seen someone (a pillion) fall off the bike through passing out while wearing a full set of protective clothing in 40C heat. That's not the risk of an accident, that an actual accident. Back in my early biking days I had (mild) heatstroke the first time I ever went to Spain on a bike through continuing to wear UK appropriate clothing (black waxed cotton Barbour in those days). It took me three days lying in a tent to recover.

So what do I do these days? I strip down to a minimal safety level that I think balances the risks of overheating and the resultant risks from an accident. Very occasionally (I can only think of one occasion atm -freak day over 50C) it has been to shorts and t shirt. Anyone who says think of the gravel rash would get the reply of lets see how far you get dressed up in full armoured black riding jacket and trousers in 50C temperatures before you either colapse or hit something through impaired judgement.

I am riding around Northern Thailand now and I am sweating my perverbials off but I am wearing all my kit because you never know, dogs running in to the middle of the road, mad kids and adults on scooters which just pull out when they want, no road sense, getting over excited on the twistys, the list is endless. Wear the kit, better to be safe than think...I wish I had worn it!

Wayne

Your post fall's in the appropriate time and the appropriate place. I think I would do the same. Only from what I have seen of some of the You Tube video's of them places.
John933

Only a helmet is needed
 

A common sight in France in high summer.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...in_traffic.jpg

I would label that as heat exhaustion; heat stroke can kill the human body within as little as 1/2 an hour.
I am reminded of the two unfortunates who died of this condition in Morocco while trying to dig their bikes out of the sand; temperatures were about those that you mention IIRC.
There is a post some where in here about that incident - probably in "the safety on the road" bit. It should have been made a sticky but I don't think that ever happened.

You may well be right but I've had "exhaustion" a number of times - particularly in the early days of my running "career" where I pushed for too long in too high temperatures and fell over. Usually with a bit of shade, maybe some oral rehydration and about an hour I've been ok.

The incident in Spain was different. The stuff I remember from it -

"dry skin, vertigo, confusion, headache, thirst, nausea, rapid shallow breathing (hyperventilation) and muscle cramps."

is pretty much the same as the NHS website symptoms for "stroke" above -
apart from muscle cramps. I don't remember having those.

Either way, HE or HS, it laid me up for three days and it's probably why I don't over dress in hot climate rides.

The other factor that's relevent is acclimatisation. From a UK perspective it's going from a cold and wet July into the full heat of a Med summer virtually overnight. On a flight no one would get off the plane still wearing an overcoat, scarf, gloves etc and keep them on in the midday heat but that's what bikers are doing and then riding for hours without a drink. Give it a week or two and your body adjusts but by then many are heading for home.

Hopefully wearing appropriate riding gear for Thailand? ... not UK Winterized gear? Good HOT weather gear exists. No need for flip flops and shorts. Many Farang end up in emergency there. Nasty. (seen it in person!)

We see a few RTW travelers come through California & run into them in Mexico wearing gear suited for N. EU and UK climes. Thick, heavy WP jackets/ pants, don't vent well. Good down to below freezing but over 27C (80F) they are miserable.

ALL W R O N G for Summer or the Tropical South! Heat stroke is real. Dehydration, exhaustion ... misery.

Why not do what racers do? I'm sure our Oz brothers know about this too.
In my racing days I rode a few Enduros in Hot weather, did Desert racing in the Mojave too.

You had to have protection ... but needed to stay cool. Used those tips from back then in current hot weather riding kit. Not perfect, but much better than flip/flops and shorts.

Part of this kit includes mesh dirt bike riding pants. Very strong, yet flow a TON of air, even moving 15 mph. If it turns cold ... you MUST stop, change, or ...slip rain pants OVER the dirt riding pants for warmth.

I always wear my independent KNEE and HIP guard armor under the dirt pants.

Up top it's a compromise ... risky.
No armored riding jacket (w/built in back protector). But there are now so many GOOD Fully armored FULL mesh jackets out there that work very well in heat and humidity. Light colors helps too. That is my recommendation ... perfect for Thailand.

But when going without Mesh jacket I wear long sleeved dirt bike Jersey but with independent Elbow/forearm strap-on guards. So ... NO back protector. But one could wear one.:innocent: ... or get a Mesh jacket ... many for under $100 USD.

ALWAYS wear Boots & Gloves ... no matter temps. (unless just popping out for dinner, short distance) Almost always wear my Flip-Up helmet (UP position in slow going) but ride with it down at speed.
In SUPER-HOT heat, it's cooler to run shield DOWN. (IE: Death Valley in 118F/47C)

Toughest heat, IMO, is places like Asia/India where you've got 95F/35C with 90% humidity. Very tough, no matter what you wear. After time and acclimation, you may be able to ZEN your way through this ... like the locals do. Takes practice. Most fight it ... and end up hating life and whinging.

If you can avoid super hot weather, do it. If not, try to ride smart. Ride EARLY AM or at night. Knock off early, get drunk! bier Not much fun riding a bike, stuck in traffic, going 10 mph, sat at traffic lights in mid day Sun.

I pretty much wear the same gear all year round trail-riding in the UK. Thin HH baselayer, waterproof enduro trousers and a Hein Gericke waterproof cordura jacket. In the winter I might add a thin fleece and a snood.

If riding from UK to Spain in the summer, I loose the waterproof jacket and trousers and wear a codura suit that used to have a removeable waterproof lining and has loads of vents. I carry army surplus goretex waterproofs just in case.

Yes, when trailriding, it can get bloody warm but it beats getting gravel rash WHEN I bin it or ripped to bits by shrubbery. The secret is to only stop in the shade and loose your jacket straight away.

Road riding I've never been dangerously too warm.

Oh, yeah, hydrate constantly. A camelbac is a must for me.

Those are regular temps here in the Oz outback in summer & still plenty comfortable with the right gear.
The more skin you expose, the faster you dehydrate.
I run a wet vest under a mesh jacket & sip regularly to maintain hydration :thumbup1:

I rode back from Alice Springs recently with a mate whose idea of keeping cool was to take off more clothing. It was him that I was drip feeding pain pills to at night, while I went for a feed and a beer
He was supposedly a teacher & sure as shit, wouldn't listen :oops2:

Dehydration & headache was his constant companion due to stupidity.
I have several outfits for different conditions & pray that you pick the correct gear for longhaul runs :mchappy:

You can always make your summer kit warm enough for winter temperatures by layering under and over, but you can't really do the same and make a 3-seasons or winter kit more suitable for warmer climates.


For my trip in South America I was facing that problem, I was going to face all sort of weather extremes. I figured I would go with a kit I could use in the warmest temperatures and add layers to make it work in colder temperatures. It worked very well.

I am wearing off road gear, meshed off road trousers and thin off road top, vented gloves, got the knee protection, meshed body armour, off road boots and an off road helmet with goggles as is let's a bit more air on to the face.

Wayne


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All the kit ?
 

After a slide down the road wearing boardies & T shirt, I had the gravel scrubbed out of what was left of my raw bleeding skin with a nylon brush under a saline shower :eek3:

Answer's easy, or what? doh

similar experience but dropped it twice, icy side of the mountain-dry on the other-inner side of the knee cap had no skin or flesh ,right past those protective denim jeans .

I think my internal thermostat must be broken. I love warmth, once it gets to 30-35C I start to become really alive. Above 45C I have to take things quietly.

To see me you would think I always wear the same gear, but not so. The outer layer is usually the same except when very cold or wet on go the windproof waterproofs. It is what’s underneath that changes. and also how things are arranged, For instance in hot weather have the cuffs and trouser bottoms open. not many layers.

A week ago I went for a little bimble about in 2-3C after 24 miles I was feeling a bit chilly. another 10 and I would have been chilled. That is about my limit for cold weather.

In hot weather you do really need to drink often because riding then is very drying from both sweat and breathing. Stop often ideally to sit in the shade, drink a little even take a rest. My chair is off with just two bungees, and water can be slid up out of my luggage.

Deadly issue
 

Yes, certainly it was your experience so I am not bothered how the cut line is defined between the symptoms.
The whole lot is hyperthermia.
Hyperthermia - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
and it is ignored at our peril.

Yes, it is a function of aging and we are more susceptible, as are those who carry less fat on their body.
So, you were a potential case of hypothermia.
Hypothermia - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

All the gear, all the time. Open all vents in summer, liners and warm gloves in winter. Each to his own.

I'm from Australia and currently in SEAsia.
The off road pants are awesome for airflow and I wear bike shorts or nicks underneath. I have a full mesh high vis light colored jacket. Take lots of breaks. Wet your shirt underneath and drink, drink, drink. Make shade stops. Start at sunrise and finish at lunch time.

I'm am ATGATT advocate. And I've ridden and lived in mountainous, tropical and desert climates.

With the variety of vented and mesh gear options, I don't believe it makes sense to risk road rash or more serious injury regardless of temperature or comfort. But that does require good gear and perhaps multiple jackets for summer vs winter vs rain vs desert. I resolve this by buying good but used gear. I've found most of my kit on ADV RIDER.

But I'm also not going to bash those who choose to rider with lighter or less gear. I did the same when I was a teenager and was lucky enough to survive a few minor bang ups and avoid and serious injury. Everyone must make their own decisions and deal with the results of their choices. But I vote for and encourage ATGATT!

Putting a myth to bed
 

Vented jackets and trousers make you feel the breeze and increase your perceived comfort but, in reality, they allow your sweat to escape.
Stating the obvious -sweat is precious water being used to cool down your body. Allowing it to escape in high heat conditions where replacement water may be scarce is very unwise. Keeping hydrated at all times is critical.

Want to feel great as you are baking? as you refuel, find a hosepipe/tap/water can and drench your jacket, trousers and helmet and keep those vents closed.
Fabulous

Bertrand I have to strongly disagree with you.


Sweat cools you by evaporating, hence keeping your vents open is the best way to evaporate that thin layer of water on your skin and making you cooler. When humidity is really high, heat becomes unbearable because sweat accumulates and evaporates slowly. Opening the vents on your jackets and pants, allowing the maximum flow of air to pass on your body to accelerate the evaporation of water is the best way to cool you down.


Suggesting to keep your vents closed during extreme heat is IMHO a very bad advice.


Google the physics of sweats and evaporative cooling.

Just to add...


Of course keeping hydrated is always important, especially when you sweat a lot.


That being said if your vents are open and much wind is passing through, around, your body, you might not even need to sweat because wind dissipates heat very fast.


The purpose of cooling and venting is to allow your body to dissipate the heat.


Mesh panels and vents opening are there for a reason. Those engineers working on the development of summer riding gear certainly know a little about the physics of heat dissipation.

You are quite free to disagree!
Retaining moisture on your body / in your clothing acts as an 'air conditioner' and continues to cool you down.
Allowing this moisture to escape is fine as long as you can drink more water to replace what is being /has been lost- If that is the case, vent away; my jacket and trousers have vents too and let some heat out.

However, if your water supply is low, as I said, before, uncontrolled venting isn't wise. Jackets/trousers are not totally sealed- heat will leave via the gaps and through the materials in any case.

Your water- your retention or your loss- it's your decision.:Beach: A chacun son truc jeune homme!

a slow speed fall wearing no protective clothing resulted in removing the skin from my knees to my hips and my forearms as well as the need to scrub out bitumen daily for 2 weeks...ATGATT now.

I wear an airflow suit over wet clothes on the hottest days. I add layers of merino clothes underneath and a windproof but breathable outer layer when it's cold.

In my experience (and according to all those promoting the benefits of materisls that wick away moisture) trapping sweat is NOT a sound practice as overheating the core increases the need for hydration.

My understanding is that water that is not being evaporated, warms up to your body temperature and ends up doing nearly nothing to cool you down.

Mais bon, si ça fonctionne pour vous, pourquoi pas?
;)

This is counterintuitive, but all true, or so the experts tell us. You really want to keep the "sweat inside". Too much air flow can really dehydrate you fast! We still see the Harley guys riding in a tank top and beany helmet in severe heat waves. Then at the next Tavern stop, they pass out. Been there, seen this in person. So cover up, keep some of the sweat inside. Booze makes it all worse.

It's a delicate balance between comfort and safety. Some air flow/venting is good but TOO MUCH is NOT good. And of course, as stated : Drink Drink Drink!

In the tropics, riding small roads at low speed, a mesh jacket works well, but it's always hard to stay comfortable with high humidity with high temps.
I've used the wet T shirt/helmet technique for decades. Great in Desert, not so much in tropics.

Now there's a vision for eight o'clock in the morning. :eek3: :rofl: