Beware Paypal
 

I’m done using Ebay because I’m done with Paypal.

A few weeks ago I purchased Guitar lessons via Paypal. For some reason they limited my account, the transaction was ‘cancelled’ and the money transfer from my account was ‘denied’.
To un-limit my account I had to follow 4 steps, one of which I can’t. Because I don’t have a credit card (one reason I use Paypal), I cannot un-limit my account. I contacted customer service about it, but I keep getting the same automated response, follow the 4 steps, and then we’ll un-limit you. I can't help but wonder why are they so desperate to have a credit card? They pull funds directly from my account, that's should be better shouldn't it?
So, my account is frozen, and there is nothing I can do. But wait! It gets even better. I discovered that the ‘denied’ money transfer for the 'cancelled' transaction was still completed. Isn’t that unusual? So, now they have more of my money. And, because of the ‘limitation’ I can’t get it back; I can’t pay; and I can’t even close my account. So, they stop me from doing anything, and they keep my money. Does that not sound a little crooked to you?
I’ve sent several emails, and customer service is completely useless. I’m currently in Kazakhstan, so I’m not going to bother to phone and waste my money on their infamous phone system. According to other forums, it’s near impossible to get a real person on the phone anyway, it’ll cost me more than what they’ve stolen. That is what they count on, that way my money looks ‘abandoned’.
Before this, I’d used Paypal as both a buyer and seller and was really happy with the service they provided. Unfortunately, I’ve encountered the “dark-side” of Paypal. So now the convenience of Ebay is lost to me; aren’t they the ones who own Paypal? Well they’ve lost a customer, and I plan to spread the word.
I’m not the only one who has lost faith in Paypal. Do a search and you will find several websites and forums dedicated to the “scam that is Paypal”.
I didn't do anything wrong, but still I've been treated like a criminal, and have had my money stolen. Check the sites out, and beware using Paypal.:eek3:

I don't use it now, simply because I am in Estonia and my PP account was linked to a UK account.

However, I did notice that they were starting to try and coerce people into joining the Premium membership with a fee and higher commission charges, but higher monthly spending quotas.

B*ggered if I'm going to get forced to buy into a service I don't need, so I just kept my purchases within limit, and now of course, Ebay is a bit obsolete for me.

Its all very cheeky IMO :nono:

No idea
 

All I can say is I have often used ebay.de which is the German site of course. Only a few Germans seem to accept Paypal. I have no idea why but it leaves Barclays Bank able to charge £15 for each transfer made. I've asked before to send cash but that wasn't accepted. PO said they can post cash with it insured though. Linzi

Buyer beware. I had my identity stolen with Pay Pal with thousands of dollars in bogus charges.

Paypal are IMHO the market leaders. All the banks are in such a hole through their own mismanagement and simply paying themselves too much they've lost the plot. HBOS are now pushing me to have a "premium" account where I give them £10 a month and they provide a load of rubbish (eg travel insurance and mobile phone insurance that doesn't cover any vehicle!). The Europeans have long had bank charges on bank charges (their 50 year mortgages turn them into slaves to one bank) and it's spreading. That BTW is why E-bay Germany customers don't like Paypal, their own banks add to the charges for talking to a different bank.

For UK customers, the solution IMHO is to look at the traditional institutions like the Coop bank, national savings and the mutuals. They still work on the basis of reserve banking (in otherwords they lend your savings to 2 people not 93) and thus are unlikely to go bust and should keep free banking. Don't expect easy money transfers abroad though, the whole BACS system is owned by the big banks who'll use it to get themselves out of their hole. A credit card paid off every month and used like a cheque book really is your friend BTW, I really would encourage everyone to get one.

Anyone old enough to have banked in the 1970's will know where this is going. If you have a wages in-bills out account it'll be free. If you are a good customer they give you an Access card. Anything else you'll pay through the nose for and then get blamed when they can't do it.

I've had no hassle with Paypal BTW. They think they have access to my money, but will find I'm quicker to take action if they upset me.

Andy

3% is not unreasonable
 

Ever had a small business accepting credit cards? You pay at least that amount as a merchant for each Visa or MasterCharge credit card transaction (AMEX is higher) so this is really an established method of operation - won't be no class action suit. Larger retailers, with higher amounts of cc transactions, pay less than small retailers, i.e. eBay sellers, so there is a range of fees charged the retailers, but 3% is pretty reasonable. eBay sellers are typically small merchants.

How would you propose eBay operate without the ability to conduct business with credit cards? Its established law in the U.S. at least that sellers can't charge more for an item when someone pays with a credit card (hence, all buyers, including cash customers, pay more to sellers in the U.S. when they have that Visa/MC logo on the door).

PayPal allows online sellers and buyers to have some form of mutually agreeable payment and recovery process. Credit cards have a long established method of buyers seeking redress for rip-offs. Paying by credit card is still the best method for buying something on eBay - you have an opportunity for getting your money back on a bad transaction. Pay cash (via direct transfer of money) and you are usually out of luck.

There has to be a fee for the card processors/banks, since so many people cancel transactions, make claims for recovery, etc., that no credit card company would be in business if they didn't.

Paypal
 

One thing I would say is life (for me) is now a lot easier with companies like paypal and even ebay. I am happy to pay a fee as long as it is fairly advertised. I really enjoy the freedom of online shopping (as I HATE UK town/city centres - all the same and full of robots all dressed the same) ....

For me Paypal, ebay and online shopping have created a great leap of freedom ......

But when I do find a shop that I like (such as Stanfords) I love to shop in there for hours.

Paypal/Ebay link up does seem to be a bit of a monopoly, but it certainly doesn't inconvenience me.

50/50
 

The result is 50/50 so far ................

Not a good sign for paypal I would say ....

I'd say a pretty good sign is the massive use of their service and the profits they bring in.

As far as polls like this go the truth is that someone who has had trouble with paypal is 3 times more likely to complain about it than someone who has good service is to big it up.

A good example, if my washing machine works great I am not going to go online and say "Hey everyone, I have the best washing machine in the world" But if it is broken I am likely to go on the net to try and find out if others had the same problem.

Personally I use Paypal pretty often and have never had any trouble with their services.

Ride safe,
Ol

Ol - I think you are right, those upset are always loudest!

PayPal has worked very well for me and is a small price to pay for their service. The thing that really annoys me are people who try to sell you stuff on line and don't have PayPal. As a matter of fact, i sell lots of stuff on E-Bay and on the forums. My ONLY accepted form of payment is PayPal, or cash from a local buyer. Don't have PayPal, don't bid! I also use PayPal to move money between accounts in other countries, which is free. For example, i can send my girlfriend $1000 in PayPal and it cost nothing. She can then transfer the money to her account, which is also free.
MollyDog, the sky isn't falling! Like every service, car, bike, taxi and hotdog, there will be a small share of those who feel cheated, but the vast majority are satisfied. I'm sure if PayPal decided to remove money from my account without permission, or didn't follow through on their insurance policy, that i too would be pissed and singing a different song, but as of now i am a satisfied customer. :thumbup1:

I HATE Ebay

I HATE PAYPAL...

But, i use them both regularly because its plainly the easiest way to buy things. CHEAP !

Its great as a buyer, it really is.. You can infinate choice on ebay and you can pay for it (99% of the time) risk free..

Its when you sell stuff that the whole corporate scam takes over. The charges are rediculous and there is no service to go with it..

I sold my Playstation 3 on Ebay and they FORCED me to only use paypal (for security).. This meant I had to pay them 3.5% of the £350 .. BASTARDS !!

Still, It would still be sitting here if It wasnt for ebay !

So far I've had good results with them. Even got through to someone on the phone with no problem when I had to make some e-mail address changes. Sounds like it was my lucky day! :thumbup1:

catch 22
 

I'm actually becoming more hopeful about reaching someone by phone. The problem is, I'm not willing to try from Kazakhstan because of the long distance charges. I would use skype, but I need to add time, for which I have to use paypal, which is limited, so I can't, which is why I need to call Paypal, for which I'd use skype, but I need to add...

Ah, such a vicious circle...:eek3: lol

PayPal are BASTARDS!

And they must pay peanuts 'cos their employees are monkeys. Or maybe they are just paid to be monkeys. Nothing against monkeys, I just don't like dealing with them when complaining about important financial transactions gone tits up.

OMG I can't believe I'm reading this, today this exact same thing happened to me and I'm really pissed off about it!! the person who I sent the money too now thinks that I'm trying to dodge them, it's all very embarrassing and annoying and not what I need.

However I think the reason is that as I am sending the money from South America it might set off a flag in their system of some sort.. who knows, mine was only a $50 transaction so they really shouldn't be able to do this!!

Oh and might I also add that I too don't have my original bank account or credit card so I sent them an email but I bet it will do no good...

I had similar problems with paypal in the beginning, but that was all sorted when I followed the steps where they put a small deposit in your bank account and you let them know how much for - just so they can 'prove' you're who you say you are.

When I looked into it in more detail I discovered it was due to anti-money laundering legislation in the UK and the US - this was the primary reason for the split of paypal.com and paypal.co.uk - the new steps where put in place as a direct result of that legislation.

As I understand it, they can 'prove' who you are a couple of different ways - before I had a CC it was the bank deposit thing - now I have a CC it appears to be much easier - they're 'allowed' to trust the CC providors information.

I'm just looking back through my paypal statment now and realised how much I use it - I live in Australia at the moment and moving money from there to the UK is free via paypal or £22 via Abby, or $30 via Commonwealth Bank of Australia, I also use it to pay for my monthly subscriptions to blip.tv, fund skype, purchase from ebay, buy a magazine subscription, oh and most importantly, pay for my Horizons DVD - all within the last couple of weeks...

Meh, I think they've got a shit load of legislation they have to abide by and they're caught in the middle in terms of 'having' to freeze accounts that don't meet the rules that are put in place. That doesn't excuse bad customer service though.

Whilst we're talking Credit Cards - it's increasinly difficult to live in todays society without one - which I think is just plane wrong - however, if you can't get a cc - as I couldn't for a while - then there are a few options that can make your life easier...

1 - Try Capital One - well known for issuing CCs with small limits to people who otherwise can't get one - it's also a full 'Credit Card' so can be used to authorise things like PayPal (£200 is the normal limit)
2 - Try a pre-paid card - but it has to be one registered to your name and address rather than an 'annomous' one bought from the post office - your bank probably already does one, if not try your local building society. This got me out of a hole when I was traveling for business and HAD to leave a copy of my CC at a hotel reception.

Hope that helps.


m

I have never had any problem with paypal.

Once your account or card is verified your transactions will be smooth as silk.

Lee

Account is verified... smooth like silk for ages... now, feels like the toilet paper in a German trainstation.... ouch..

How long have you been working for them, then?

How many international transactions have you tried to complete when suddenly "Verified" means sweet FA, all because PayPal don't have any cajones. Nor do they have the cajones to counter a complaint.

Paypal
 

Most disreputable company I've ever had the misfortune to deal with.

I am happy to say that I dont work for them, and my opinion is that I have not had any problems and that my transactions, UK and International have been trouble free............I think Paypal is a great service...Thats my opinion, you are entitled to your opinion aswell

Lee

I know the UK caved in to Ebay's request that all listings must have paypal as a method of payment. WHY did the Uk allow them to put that clause in all listings I wonder? They tried that in Australia and there was such a huge stink that they went away with their tail between their dirty legs.

IMO, they are one of the worst examples of a greedy monopoly; this culture is also evident on their Skype phone charges which are now exorbitant when compared to VOIP sip plans.

I've used paypal several times to purchase items from the US as well as from the UK. My credit card gets billed, no problem. I guess it may be different if I were selling items and collecting funds via paypal. I have no complaints.

I have had a problem with Paypal in the past, just a small issue but it was handled appallingly:nono: I now have a small issue with a ebay seller. I bought some pannier inner bags from a seller (via paypal) and all went well, the bags were delivered a few days later, so far so good. But a day later another set of bags turned up, so being honest I emailed the seller to let him know of his error, he emailed back saying to post them back and he would reimburse the postage, I'm still waiting for the £5.15 postage three weeks later, after emailing him and requesting payment:nono:
I know it's not alot of money, but for my honesty I'm being dicked about by a twunt! I should have just held onto the goods until payment was received or made him have them uplifted at his expense, or even just kept them and said nothing and sold them to someone else:thumbup1:
This has ruined it for the next person that does the same/similar thing, once bitten.................................:thumbdown:


Trophymick

just to sound like everyone else.... i got screwed by paypal and eBay (more than once)


Last time I got screwed I sold something, sent it... and then got accused of not doing so. I proved my innocence with proof of postage. I got screwed. They withdrew my money and treated me like shit. Sod em. I boycott ebay by contacting the sellers and either offer to pay them by cash in person or by a free wire transfer an agreeable sum. So far it works for me.

I'd agree - buying has never been a problem, but recently I have sold two items and both times the funds have been 'on hold' until the buyer has left me positive feedback... what is that all about then?

I'm meant to post something that I own, at my expense, to someone I've never met... and 'hope' the buyer likes it before I get my money?

Sounds like bollocks to me... oh and while I'm at it, Ebay have put their final value fees up to 10% of the sale price now... suddenly selling on Ebay doesn't look like such good value anymore.

Gits!

xxx

Broadly I agree, except it has not been all that sudden: things have been working against the sellers for quite some time in my view which is why I haven't sold on ebay for quite some time, but I am constantly buying via ebay.
So, there are two answers to the poll: yes and no (it takes two to make a deal - purchaser and vendor) - therefore, no vote from me.
In due course, things may swing again toward the seller.

Totally agree with the business view(s) expressed earlier as well: 3% is a very reasonable charge for transferring cash/goods/services worldwide. For a rip-off try Western Union.
Also, money laundering IS a big deal; the more checks the better so far as I am concerned.

quite agree, corrupt and dubious, wouldn't touch them with a barge pole!
except maybe to bludgeon them with it..

So why does this thread keep bumping to the top even when no one is posting to it?

Suspicion
 

My suspicion is when someone votes in a poll it counts as a post and therefore bumps with no apparent post

The real problem here is the fact that you've essentially given access to Paypal to directly debit your (savings?) account without need for confirmation.

This is very dangerous, and I would recommend anyone against using this or anything like direct-debit for this particular reason. You don't have control.

The difference with using a Credit Card is that they act as an intermediatory, giving you some level of protection against fraud, criminality and other. You pay for the service but at least a Credit Card doesn't have access to your money.

I haven't had any problems with PayPal but I am ALWAYS wary of where my money goes.

Oh and incase it wasn't clear, STAY AWAY from DIRECT DEBIT !!

+1

It's a useful if expensive service

Correct.

"Stuck between a rock and a hardplace" - that sums up Ebay/PayPal.

Most people purchase items from Ebay as they are often cheaper than other online retailers, or the item is used and you get to buy it for a fraction of the original price.

The problem with Ebay is that it is monopolistic as it tries very VERY hard to ensure you only use its bought-and-paidfor PayPal payment service. As a new seller you can ONLY accept PayPal payments, and even with a feedback score of 104 (as of today) I cant decline to use paypal. Hows that for monopolistic business practises.

This is OK for the buyer, but as a seller this is a problem. The buyer can at anytime within 60 days of paying for the item "dispute" the transaction - either "the item hasnt arrived" or "its not as described" or "its damaged in transit" etc etc etc. As soon as the buyer files a claim, PayPal immediately remove the purchased money from the sellers account - irrespective of whether he is in credit with his paypal balance or not - then they start their investigation! In otherwords "guilty until proven innocent". More than 99% of the time PayPal finds in favour of the buyer and refunds their money and the seller is left out of pocket and without the item! For those sellers who say in their auction text that they "wont accept paypal" or "cash on collection only", if PayPal finds out about that text (and they even have automated search software bots to locate phrases like that) they will cancel your auction and mark a warning against your seller account as it breaches their monopolistic terms and conditions.

As said earlier in the thread, unless you absolutely have to, always use a creditcard with PayPal. PayPal is NOT as secure as you might think and the number of hacked pp accounts increases every day. You as a buyer have some protection is you use a creditcard but NONE if you have PayPal connected directly to your bank account. For those who have a points-generating creditcard or a cash-back creditcard like me, it also makes sense to use the creditcard for PP payments as you earn whilst you spend (just zero the balance every month because of the interest).

I believe there is a website called paypalsucks.com or similar. I use Ebay and therefore use PayPal to buy lots of items, but when I sell on Ebay its after I have tried local classified ads for forum-direct-posts. I am ALWAYS nervous selling and accepting PayPal payments.

Many Paypal users don't know how to use their accounts properly so when something happens and they complain it's often caused out of their own ignorance of how a Paypal account works and how the account holder should manage it.
I've had people accusing me of taking money from their Paypal account without authority because they are too stupid to understand that when they click 'Pay Now' it means just that - they are paying now.....doh They then fire off very aggressive emails threatening legal action and demanding immediate refunds when in fact it is their own stupidity that has created the situation. They often don't know about the dispute resolution proceess provided by Paypal. Some people just shouldn't be allowed to use the internet. :nono:

I'd like to see Paypal cheaper of course, who wouldn't, but as someone else already pointed out you can send personal money and it's free - then you can that withdraw it for free....where's the problem with that? :thumbup1:

Hi,

The problem is i think they bock mony back very easy. I think all the bayer has to do is to klick he did not get his item or if he signed he got it that it was broken. Then if the seller doesnt have a tracking code his money is gone and if he has the code they tell the bayer to ship the used Item back even there was no return accepted in the transaktion. The seller is allways the looser here. His money will be gone and he even payed for shiping one way...

They also blocked my accound when i needet it...when i loged in from different countrys while traveling. Thats where Paypal would make sence because onlinebanking doesnt work if your cellphone cant roam to get the TAN SMS. As long as you can use onlinebanking, there is no need to use Paypal.

So what? Tobi

+ 1 .. nice writeup .. saves me typing pretty much the same thing.

above is why I stopped selling on ebay. buying is still OK because everything is slanted in favor of buyer. ebay has set up seller to screwed at will by buyer.

sellers are at the mercy of dishonest buyers. sellers have little to no recourse if buyer should decide to screw you. all buyer has to do is claim item is not as described.... you funds are frozen then sent back to buyer. who then has your goods and his $$$ back.

No Troubles
 

I've used PayPal for years and have had no troubles, either buying or selling, with the exception of 1 seller slow to ship. A week before losing my ability to retrieve funds, I let him know I was going to do it in 2 days. He shipped the item the same day I sent the email...

I usually keep a small amount of funds, less than 100.00USD in my account. Anything above that draws from credit card, which gives me a dual layer of dispute. I only use PayPal as a second to last resort, the last being wire transfer.

I also believe that the vast majority of people out there are generally honest, but that doesn't mean I would proceed without caution...

PayPal works well. No one can "take" money from my account, but as I said above, I limit what I keep in there.

Regards,

Rey.

I have used PayPal more than a dozen times with no problems. I'm assuming because I've never opened an account with them. I simply purchase goods using my credit card on file. I believe having a prepaid account with them is not a good idea.

I don't have a pay pall account. But I use E bay to buy. Find a friend who has an account and ask them to buy it for you. That what I do. Then get the seller to send it to you. To pay my friend I just deposit money in to his account at my local town. Work's well for me.
John933

It's moved on a bit since then - to about a 2/3 positive feedback.

I use ebay much less nowadays, for selling, because of the way that ebay changed their rules a few years ago (as per posts 35 and 38 above). These rules have not caused me any problems but I just lost interest when the ebay system was skewed so heavily in favour of the buyer - so, nowadays, I tend to use it for buying only; of course, for that to work there still have to be some sellers on ebay!

The type of scam in the thread below is very likely based on the current ebay system:-
http://www.horizonsunlimited.com/hub...xample-s-72903

we will be closing our ebay shop soon. A few times we have been caught by people receiving their item, then claiming the money back through paypal. They can enter a variety of excuses such as the item was not received (even though they had left positive feedback) or the item is not as described (it was, they are new items, sold many many times previously).

Paypal then refund their money, they keep the item. It's an easy way for them to obtain free goods, paypal basically endorses it and does nothing to protect the seller.

Paypal and ebays's attitude seems to be the buyer is always right, the seller is always wrong. Selling via paypal is now a high risk activity.

The other reason is, the fees are now just getting too high

Paypal supports fraudsters?
 

I lost my money with Paypal UK and the item i purchased. I pre-paid for a 350 pound item i liked on a website - when it arrived it was a load of rubbish or technically drastically wrongly described - i informed the buyer and demanded a refund - he gave an address to return it, i went there and it was bogus - he promised to collect on a number of occassions and never turned up - he then claimed to Paypal it was not wrongly described - we both submitted evidence and Paypal found in my favour and awarded a refund - Paypal sent notification the sellers bank informed them there was insufficient funds in his account - seller then claimed i failed to return item - i sent it insured by carrier - he claimed to Paypal parts were missing, it was damaged even though he signed that it was ok and i was attempting to defraud him - Paypal then informed me he had supplied evidence that parts were missing - i told them we had witnesses and photos to prove everything was returned but they would not allow me to submit this proof - I lodged an appeal with Paypal with lengthy submissions and after several weeks a few words came back saying the refund was not granted - 3 months + later i have not had one penny refunded and the seller has the item and will not reply to me how i can get it back if i so wished - i was informed by sellers family and colleagues he had heart attack and i am responsible for that because of hassle i caused him - he continues in his own name to list the same bogus item on ebay. As far as i am concerned Paypal supported him in defrauding me.

I had an identical experience to the OP and despite checking account transactions, it was never clear just who started the problem - the seller, paypal or my credit card supplier - or all three. Stupid thing was the purchase was for a whole $8.55 Doh!

Also like the OP, being on the road with no access to original documents, it was impossible to follow the 4 steps to the end. I ended up writing paypal a reasonably polite, but nevertheless, what was very obviously a pretty abusive letter and they immediately withdrew the freeze and reinstated everything.

The trouble is, being constantly on the move and with fewer businesses wanting to deal with overseas customers and fewer wanting the risks of foreign credit cards, paypal is a bit like water - there might be alternatives but you risk dying of thirst if you try living without it.

My credit card bank(Citibank) is the worst for these random acts of bastardry for no reason. We have purchases and monthly payments to and from places all over the world - often from opposite sides of the globe on the same day - and they always wait until I am in the highlands of PNG or in the middle of Alaska before putting a hold on my card for suspicious activity (always involving a piddling amount) and then phoning my Australian contact phone to let me know - despite being told many times we don't have a phone when travelling and email is the only way. Then because they can't contact me, they cancel the card. Even stupider is I can always then make the purchase with my wife's card which is an ancilliary card on my account. Double Doh!!!

I've used pay pal since 2005 has it been perfect no,,,,,,, would I trust them no,,,just like I wouldn't trust any one else with my money,,,,,, but its a lot easier paying for items though pay pal than doing transfers,,,, sending p.o.

This year I sold my BMW bike and the guy done a transfer from pay pal rather than carry cash, when he was at mine to pick the bike up, he done it as a family and friend so there's no charges, when I checked I'd been charged £89 so when I phoned up they simply accepted it was a mistake and transferred that £89 back to me,

Your account only has a set amount you can transact with, this is so you can't run a business from that account ,,,things to do,,, ether validate your account or upgrade it to a business account ether way they transfer about a 3p to your personal account then you will need to get the PIN number attached to that transfer and validate your account again,,,, I don't think you will need a card for this, Then you will have access again

Try buying a prepaid Visa card for your credit card requirement. You can go on line and register your name and address to the card to make it pass their check. I think this should work for you.

I agree that Paypal can be a problem. Someone on here commented on the 3% charge. If that were all it wouldn't be so bad. Do all the calculations after selling something and by the time you have transferred the money into your account you're likely going to find its 10% after Paypal and Ebay both get their fees. But that's not the crux of it, it's the power that ebay can wield with reviews or status or money holds. Really something you need to enter with eyes wide open.
Best if luck.

yup .. paypal and ebay can be a giant pain in the ass!!

that said .. both can be the easiest way to handle certain type transactions. despite the 3% to 10% toll ebay/paypal extracts on transactions.

but one must know the rules under both operate under. for instance if one is shipping a sold item. one MUST know under what terms items is considered delivered. electronic tracking yes .. but at what $$ is signature required to prove delivery.

then how does one protect against the biggest gotcha for seller on ebay? which is buyer can claim "item was not as claimed" paypal has your funds locked up and will return to crooked buyer.

one must understand paypal/ebay only cares for paypal/ebay. they go to great lengths to protect itself but cares little to nothing for seller, who pays all the fees.

so one MUST understand the rules and take steps accordingly. for instance if one is selling a DVD player on ebay. one must take a series of videos/pictures showing DVD operating in every possible mode. if crooked buyer says DVD tray is broken .. you pull out video proving otherwise, etc. etc.

what PITA to sell goods this way .. much easier to sell on craigslist!
I've all but stopped selling on ebay but still purchase small items on ebay.

paypal is completely different .. I'm constantly using paypal for transactions amongst Adv folks buying gear. which is one of the most cost effective way to gear up for a trip. buying/selling amongst establish forum members has to be one of the safest ways to trade.

purchased my R80G/S sight unseen based a trusted Adv member's word. beemerguru did a frame off restoration on R80G/S. sent paypal for the entire amount. then paid for shipping from California to Oklahoma. G/S arrived in mint condition, along with clear title.

This is true.

Personally I have never had problem with them, though I know many who have.

But, however unsatisfactory Ebay and Paypal may be, they are stacking up success upon success. These guys continue to grow, and fast, and Ebay is already trying out 'amazonian' features such as same-day delivery and free shipping, that is only going to increase its pull. And I believe PayPal are now encroaching upon Visa and Mastercard, allowing people to pay on their mobiles ..?

On the market Ebay is sitting very comfortable, with 16% rise last quarter - (upgraded from Neutral to Buy, in the eyes of many pundits ...http://www.quotenet.com/) - and predicted revenue of over $20 billion by 2015.

Ebay with Paypall, is a top-performer on the market, even if not so much in the minds' of its customers.

Paypal
 

I used paypal to buy an item here in France . The buyer swore he never received the money and it left my account , so where did it go .
after a while the seller sold the item to another person ,i lost out on a good deal .paypal said they retrieved my money from the seller , the seller left me bad feedback . So where did it go ?????:confused1:
Martin

I don't use Pay pall, but I use E bay. See what I like. Drop an e mail to my mate. He buy's it with his account, then get's it posted to me. I put cheque in post. Sorted.
John933

my sister wants to sell her dvd on amazon so they said fine! 50% please!

Paypal are cheeky banks are worse and amazon well..........

The little people business get royally scr3w3d !!!!!!

Had some trouble with Paypal lately. Did not do anything wrong only wanted to return a 10gb hard drive i received after buying one with 1tb etc.

Now paypal wrote me that in future they will not give me the so called "Käuferschutz". Paypal without the safety is expensive but useless:

Entwicklung Ihrer PayPal-Transaktionen.


Uns ist aufgefallen, dass Sie eine ungewöhnlich hohe Anzahl von Problemen mit Ihren PayPal-Transaktionen gemeldet hatten. Dazu gehören Anträge auf Käuferschutz oder Probleme, die Sie bei Ihrer Bank gemeldet hatten.

Wir möchten, dass Sie mit Ihren Einkäufen zufrieden sind. Sollten wir aber weiterhin eine überdurchschnittlich hohe Anzahl von Problemen mit Ihren PayPal-Transaktionen feststellen, so kann dies dazu führen, dass Ihre PayPal-Kontofunktionen eingeschränkt werden. Außerdem besteht die Möglichkeit, dass wir bestehende und zukünftige Anträge auf Käuferschutz aussetzen. Wir behalten uns das Recht vor, solche Anträge in Zukunft abzulehnen.

Political post removed.

Reason: http://www.horizonsunlimited.com/hub...hu_forum_rules

I'll trust paypal for buying some small things, but nothing tech related.

Yep. Hate the bastards. Citibank regularly stop my credit card for all sorts of spurious reasons despite me telling them over and over that in any one day it is quite likely there will be a regular payment done in the US and another in Australia, plus a purchase or three or four in three or four different countries. That's is what credit cards are for, get over it.
Then paypal - yes even stupider and they have pulled the same trick on me as they did the OP. But I wrote them a very sternly worded email and they pulled their head in and reinstated my account. Total morons.

Trouble is without a credit card and paypal I would be right up all sorts of creeks.

Only ones who do the right thing ALWAYS are my Credit Union which I swapped to 25 years ago after getting sick of the banks.

However, the reward points on the credit card are nice, the insurance and similar perks are great, so what else can I do about credit cards. Paypal - make a payment to anyone with an email address for a reasonable charge. Who else offers that service.

Hate them by all means, but don't cut off your nose to spite your face.

It's probably not much help to you Tony, but in the UK there is a relatively new service called PayM. This allows payments to be made from a smartphone knowing only the payees mobile number. Check it out at nearly all the main UK banks. It's intended for small payments between friends and family but it has scope for much wider use.

door
 

It is a bank so they will offer smiles and cheap then start turning the screw once they have a big enough market share to maximise profit and f*** the customers. Repeat it is a bank!

I have never really trusted eBay or PayPal mainly because they used to be based in Austria and were not covered by most of the banking regulations. Also eBay owners PayPal. It's like the shop owning the bank... Just does not sit well to me.
Stopping sellers leaving bad feedback is another reason. I had a chap who wanted to pick up an item. Messed me about from start to finish and when he did turn up was very abusive. I reported him to eBay in an attempt to warn other sellers... Wast of time.
Also a well known scam which I was a victim off, eBay or PayPal did nothing about and if you would like to know how to get free items deliver at no cost then let me know..

I've seen the dark side. Got a very convincing phishing attempt regarding an ebay purchase and my PayPal account. Luckily, I contacted them about it first.

I run a "small" business (designing and producing race parts and accessories) and only accept Paypal at a rate of $5k /week and never had a problem, nor my clients. I sure hate the 3% fee, but it would be similar if accepting credit cards.

Lee

Well said, in the early days of ebay/paypal the system worked great because there was an adequate checks and balances system on buyers and sellers. When Meg Whitman came in, I'm pretty sure she tried to mimic Amazon's system of courting 'the mega sellers." She did her best to tip the playing field towards the big guys and I think that strategy worked to increase profits for a while, but now ebay has lost of its core following.

As a seller on ebay, I think a lot of the issues have to do with what demographic of people you are normally dealing with. If you are selling used electronics/ video games then it is going to be a lot of young kids buying your products. If you are selling new race parts then it is going to be 35-65 year old high income people.

I recommend being wary of all large companies. Not just eBay and Paypal, but Amazon, Google, Facebook, even Apple throw some weird shit at times. I've heard multiple horror stories about all of them.

Its ridicilous what they sometimes get away with, but most of the case it goes well though. I haven't had any issues myself personally, but I'm trying to make sure that I always have a plan B.

And all types of corporations, not just tech companies.

And not just corporations, but all business dealings. lol


I think the above 2 posters must have been high when posting. :offtopic: