M/c licence: necessary?
 

I know I'll get all sorts of flak for this but ...

Is it essential to actually have a motorbike licence? Yes I know it is legally required but how often is it checked? Is it ever checked?

Oh, and what happens if you don't have one and you get checked? (I guess that'll depend a lot on the country.)

(A licence doesn't guarantee competence nor does no licence mean incompetence.)

Cheers.

LOL - You are definitely getting flak for this mate. I will give you the benefit of the doubt and assume you are riding off road ??? Cause if you are riding on the road without a licence, well let's just say you'll only be checked by a copper ONCE ! [emoji23][emoji1787]

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I can't remember the last time my licence was checked either in the UK or in any of many the other countries I've visited. Probably at least 20 yrs. So, if I was feeling lucky, I could have done any of the trips I've done in that time (a lot) without a licence and be no worse off for it.

But how much my 'good fortune' is down to the fact I drive / ride like a care home resident on my way to a bingo session, use sedate and sober bikes / cars that are all taxed, insured and MOT'd so I don't trip ANPR cameras and don't get flashed for speeding you'll have to decide for yourself.

If you go to all that trouble you might as well get a licence for the peace of mind. If you haven't got a licence and don't want to get caught you're going to have to be very very careful with immaculate roadcraft. The training involved in getting a licence is partly a process of giving you that roadcraft.

If you're pulled without a licence expect to have no need of one for some considerable time. If you have an accident and are found to have no licence expect to be unable to afford one for some considerable time - particularly if there's third party damage or injury involved.

Plenty of people drive without licences but I'm not sure how border crossings would go?

could you travel on a provisional licence? I imagine to the average cop in another country they wouldnt be able to tell any difference.

I had an international licence many years ago, I think it was only valid for a year but i just kept changing the date and it never got questioned.

I'd have thought in plenty of countries if you are happy to pay bribes it would make little or no difference.

But why risk it?

my DL never was checked at the border.

Me neither. Passport, insurance and, once, bribe have been asked for but not licence.

An international one from the post office (in the UK anyway) might sound like a cheap option but both of the ones I've had in the last three years have needed me to present my regular licence which was both forensically examined by the counter lady (it's the old paper one which I don't think she's seen many of) and then scanned for their records.

Getting licence in a 'foreign' country
 

Thanks. Most interesting and helpful. The insurance thing is pretty serious of course. But anyway just wanted to hear your opinions.

So that leads to the next question: if you are out of your own country is it possible to get a licence in a 'foreign' country?

Cheers.

You can get one in a foreign country, you'll just have to go through all the training and testing requirements for that country. Some may also require you to meet a residence requirement.

I'm struggling to see why anyone who's considering a long trip wouldn't get a licence. Aside from the insurance angle it's the whole legality thing, get into any trouble with the local plod and you're in a world or pain if they start finding you're riding illegally. In the UK you can't even buy insurance without a licence (they ask how many years you've been riding) which means you can't buy road tax either. So you're riding unlicensed, uninsured and untaxed. Get into an incident or get picked up by ANPR and your bike will be confiscated on the spot.

I know the new testing procedure is a bureaucratic PITA and not cheap either, and someone who's been riding off road may feel they're competent enough, but the authorities in every country take it seriously and it only takes one to check... you know the rest.

It’s a common course of a decline on medical travel insurance.
Someone rents a 100cc motorbike, they don’t have a bike licence, have an accident and their insurance won’t cover the medical costs.
The last one I saw was a guy in Thailand who lost his leg and faced a £250000 medical bill, so, you decide.

In Australia any time I have been pulled over for a breath test they have asked for my licence. There has only been 1 occasion where the licence was not asked for, and that was a rare situation as there were about 15 of 'us' pulled into a cafe. They don't get many 'tourist' there and he upped his quota in a very short period of time, with our total cooperation.

FYI. Original and subsequent question relates to already being overseas (i.e. in a 'foreign' country/countries) and wanting to get a bike.

Sorry should have mentioned that first.

Cheers.

Which Country? check and see if you can get the licence there, at least then you will have a licence and insurance (sometimes can be purchased locally)

Agree with the above - which country?
There are too many variables between countries to have one rule or guide as to getting a licence.

As you in that country it is probably easiest to ask at a driving school.
First question "How difficult would it be for me to get a driving licence"?
Then motor cycle licence... Motorcycle ones are usually more difficult.. with the vehicle test. But the rule tests are about the same. And the conditions - resident, proof of who you are and where you live are the same.

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China is interesting. As they have not signed some international agreement there licences are not valid overseas? So there is a 'tourist' industry where Chines citizens go to South Korea and get their licences there, as part of their holiday. China recognises these licences and issues Chines ones where that licences is presented.

Just to cover all the bases, if lack of licence is the topic under consideration there's always the DIY route.

Plenty of people will supply you with a, well, let's call it a 'comfort licence'. https://www.myfakeid.biz/fake-id/driving-card.aspx

Funny old world though when a 'copy' costs more than the real thing.

On balance though it's probably not the best of moves as getting caught with no licence is almost certainly a lesser problem than getting caught with a fabricated one. Certainly in Europe / N.A. etc anyway.

It's inconceivable to me why I wouldn't have the appropriate license, insurance and registration in place at any time I was asked for it.

Well now, at times this is totally impossible: there's no insurance available at a border, or the law says you can't ride/drive without a local license. If you haven't run into situations like this, maybe you haven't traveled very widely--to Peru, say (the former), or Vietnam (the latter).

More often there are choices involved. Others choose differently from me, and differently from you. Personally, I tend to make every effort to follow the rules because why give the folks in uniform any excuses to squeeze me for money? But sometimes I make the choice to ignore what's strictly legal because it's either inconvenient, expensive, or flat out obnoxious. YMMV.

Mark

Or apply for full proper Chinese driving / bike licence.

vette

Hi Grahame:

Welcome to our forum community.

It's difficult to give a concise answer to your question, because so much depends on where you are and what exposure to loss you have or are willing to tolerate.

In fully developed countries (Europe, North America, Japan, Singapore & similar): Yes, absolutely, if you are going to ride a motorcycle, you have to have a licence for it, simply because you may be held criminally & civilly responsible if you have an accident and are found to not be properly licenced to operate the moto. Your vehicle insurance company will decline responsibility.

In lesser developed countries (Caribbean tourist destinations, many sub-Saharan African countries): It kind of depends on what you are riding and where you are riding it. If you rent a 50cc scooter in a popular warm tourist destination, you might not encounter problems... but then again, if you get into an accident, you could face the same problems as mentioned above, or if you get stopped by the police, you could be squeezed for a bribe.

The risks get higher if you own the moto you are riding - it may be confiscated or impounded, in other words, you might be looking at a financial loss.

Off-Road (anywhere): If you are only operating the motorcycle off-road - meaning, not on public highways - then you might not be legally obliged to have a licence for the motorcycle. Check the laws of the country you plan to operate in.

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A better way of looking at it might be "What do you have to lose?" If you are 21, have no assets, and have not established a career yet, perhaps you could tolerate getting stuck in a jail for a month. If you are in your 50s, have substantial assets (including an expensive motorcycle between your legs) and a career where regulators would not look kindly on a criminal conviction, the risks are unacceptable.

Michael

Yes it is important to have a licence. Whilst having one doesn't guarantee competence there's a greater chance of competence occurring than if someone doesn't have one. As has been said before, insurance will be void without it.
To answer your question in another way .... imagine if a close relative was killed by a vehicle (any kind, take your pick) and it transpired that the driver/rider didn't possess a licence to be on the road in the first place ... how do you think you'd feel and what punishment do you think that person should receive??
Anyone who drives without a valid licence deserves everything that will surely come their way.