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Need objective advise on my around the world journey 2020
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Hey guys,
New to the website, I was recommended here from a thread I started on adventure rider. https://advrider.com/f/threads/ditch...world.1399037/ So a short synopsis is I am currently 34, I was medically retired from the Army in 2013 after I spent 17 months in a treatment facility from injuries I received in Afghanistan. It took until now 2019 for me to condition my mind psychologically to manage and rebuild my life to start the serious preparations for my around the world journey. I want to live in each country for a few days or up to a week that I travel to, not just ride through. I am doing this solo and I have limited social dynamics back home. My current tentative start date is August 2020. Here is a fast synopsis of the current macro overview: 1. Bike - I just bought a 2019 DR 650, picture attached. (I picked this instead of my current GS 1200) 2. Outfit the bike - I have a whole thread listed above on the details 3. Get all the required insurances (Medical, security, etc) - I can purchase these the day prior if I wanted 4. Get my travel shots - Not done yet, will do 6 months out 5. Get out of the lease for the house I am renting - This is done and I sold a lot of my possessions and the rest is going into a storage unit I already now rent. 6. Acquire miscellaneous gear left - Gopro, decent camera, and waterproof riding gear 7. Ship the bike and head over - I got the quote already and I can fly for free overseas as retired military on a military space A flight. Here is where I need objective advice: Currently, I will not be able to financially start outfitting my bike until April, which at that point moving forward my finances are completely cleared up from my retirement and I am good to go indefinitely, but it is a few months before when I originally wanted to leave in June. To financially outfit my bike, ship it, buy all the insurances, and head out it would be August possibly until I fly over. The issue to me is I was going to ship the bike to Spain and ferry it into Morrocco and ride through northern Africa, hop into Jordan, and come back to northern Africa to have my bike shipped into Greece where I could go all through Europe and eventually make my way to Asia. I figure if I start my journey in August, it might be getting cold by the time I get into Europe. Ideally, I'd love to travel through colder climate regions spring-summer time and travel in more traditionally hotter climates in the wintertime, giving me the most ideal riding weather year-round. So my question is if I leave in August - September and I want to stay in a mild to warmer climate year-round riding, any recommendations on a different starting entry point/path globally for my journey to where I could ride into the fall without being in 30-degree weather within a few months? |
Hello vagabond2020 and welcome to the forum,
It sounds like you have given this some thought but my first observation is that your proposed route across North Africa is not currently possible starting with Algeria being off limits as is Libya further long. It is possible to head down through West Africa from Morocco all the way to South Africa where you can turn around and head back up the east side if you have a mind to. I suggest that you start by reading a few of the ride reports and see what routes other people have taken and during what seasons they were there, you will find yourself spending more than a few days or a couple of weeks in some countries. Hopefully others will be along to make suggestions as to which route you might think about, the other thing to research when planning your route is which countries don't allow US passport holders, Iran and Sudan both make it difficult which is a shame as they are great places to visit but there is usually an alternative. |
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Mark, Thank you for the response. I just looked at a map of Africa and you are right about the physical barrier to northeastern Africa, are they restricted from the State Department as a security risk? I have put a ton of time into research for most facets of my planning process and I feel fairly comfortable with most of it. I just bought the DR 650 instead of taking my GS 1200 and I already have the mechanical aspects down and what logistically, for the most part, needs to happen. There is a mass amount of information out there, I am new to this site, the route planning and my starting point is the only really vague part to me at this point. I agree on the point on what countries don't take U.S passports. I want to have a path I can take around the world that will give me a good flow to go from country to country. I agree too that I will most likely be spending more time in some countries than others. I will check out the ride reports as you suggested. |
Hi Vagabond
Is South America on your itinerary? Not done it myself (yet) but have done the east route up from South Africa (which is great) so wondering if going down through South America, then ship to South Africa and ride up to Europe from there might be an alternative? Only did South Africa to Ethiopia so missed the Sahara but weather was all good (I did start June to early August) Just a thought. |
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I need to find a trip report or someone who has visited there recently to get some good information on that. You are right though I could ship from South America into South Africa and make my way up to northern Africa and from there Europe. |
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Here you go: https://www.avvida.co.uk/ |
Hello
First have a look at klimamaps of the world, then you can figure out when is the best time to travel by motorbike in each country. Depending on your "travelspeed" (different by every traveller) you can plan a basic route around the world. Plan enough time for shipping between continents depending on your budget. https://www.horizonsunlimited.com/get-ready/shipping Next is to check if you can travel that route or if some countries are a problem for you (passport,visa) or your bike (CDP,no Independent motorvehicules possible, only guided.like Thailand, China, Myanmar, check here on the hubb for the latest info). Once you have that there is the problem when you need a visa, can you get it on the road or only in your homecountry. Many of those visa are only valid a short time before entry. For your current plan to ship to europe in August, I would say start in nothern europe, then travel south and head into Marokko and spend the "winter" in africa (but I don't know where and when to go there from marokko). Alternativ, start in August at home and head into mexico and central america, then spend the "winter" in south america. For visa, south america is pretty easy, central asia is a nightmare, southeast asia and australia/NZ O.K. ,don't know about africa. have fun planning sushi |
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There are similar limitations scattered throughout the world. Trying to plan at this level without enough background understanding will just lead you into a variety of dead ends. We are privileged as more or less financially secure Westerners, but the world doesn't actually revolve around our desires the way it used to in our favorite fantasies. I'd suggest: start with one or more of Chris Scott's books if you haven't already done so. Hang out on sites like this one--far better than ADVrider unless you intend to stay USA-centric for the rest of your life--just reading whatever comes up to accumulate background information. And use the weather as one of your central organizing principals, since not doing so will make you miserable, perhaps immobilize you completely, and may even get you dead. Motorcycles and bad weather don't mesh well for most people, and this includes rainy seasons, temperate zone winters, hot seasons in an increasing percentage of the globe, and more. If you're starting in September it would make perfect sense to head south into Latin America--with a few minor cautions about rainy seasons and occasional hurricanes. The whole of Central and South America are accessible without insoluble visa issues, carnets, or even non-Latin-based languages (for the most part). Exploring southern Europe before heading south into Africa would also make sense, although Africa's not as straightforward as South America for the less-experienced. That would also be a reasonable time to start off in SE Asia or the subcontinent, but it's probably best you be comfortable with psychotic drivers and traffic if you do this. Not so good heading into autumn: northern (followed by Central) Europe, mountainous areas all the way across to South Asia; much of Russia, China or Mongolia, and more. I've gone on too long already, probably the result of that extra cup of coffee. I don't know if the above is helpful, but I hope so and wish you well on your journey--the one labeled "life," not just the portions conducted on two wheels. Keep posting up here when you feel inspired to do so! Mark |
I have not travelled RTW so my advice is worth little. However in my planning I have started doing short trips away to work as a shake down on what to take and what I can handle/like etc.
I have found that being middle aged with a knee replacement I need more rest time than I thought. Is that worth doing if you haven’t already. Have fun. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk |
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When I say this I mean it, I really appreciate you taking your personal time to communicate with me. I don't mind the cold hard truth, in fact, I seek it. I can't properly start to build my representation of how to plan a journey like this if I don't know to take my mind down the proper planning path. There is a ton of knowledge out in the world, but it's not about reading everything, it's about reading the right material. Funny you mention Chris Scotts book, I actually already bought that and I am currently reading it and I have no desires to stay in the U.S, I can do that type of traveling much later in life if I wish, I need to maximize my vitality and youth to do what I am planning currently. I agree with you on the weather, I did not mention that in my pretext of what I was saying in my original post, but I had pondered upon that. I agree with you that I have many fundamental flaws in my knowledge on what countries would be off-limits or issues for my motorcycle overland travels, I guess my goal with posting this was to get a macro shotgun blast synopsis of what I am doing with the hope of creating a crude framework from others with experience to create a path for me to start my planning cycle. So end state for me is to sit down and write out continent by continent and region by region the weather (Temperature and raining seasons) and start my planning cycle around that in combination with open-source security analysis of each country. I think the nucleus of that research will naturally create my path, along with some objective criticism of others on here with more experience than me. So another question you might know, what is your experience with storing motorcycles overseas? If I get down to a region and the weather in the next region is going to turn, I can fly back to the U.S until the season permits and keep going. I could possibly rent a storage unit or pay a dealership to store it? |
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Thanks for the objective knowledge. I agree with you and from another post on here from Mark, that I need to do a security assessment in combination with seasons for weather in each region. My path for travels will naturally start to unravel. From what you and Mark said, it seems South America in the fall might be a good option, I need to sit down and go region by region and do my research on the seasons and off-limit countries. |
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I found a report (attached) that is from this site: https://southamericabackpacker.com/s...erica-climate/
Per the hiking website, it says "These months have been selected based on a number of factors including, weather, temperatures, transport accessibility, prices, and overall attraction availability. However, with countries so vast in size, all of these things vary hugely from one end to another." I will research the validity of this chart, but I figure backpacking chart would correlate closely to what I am doing on a motorcycle, being exposed to the elements constantly. |
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So I went to the state departments website to find the security threats for South America and Africa. South America looks pretty hospitable, besides Venezuela which is obviously restricted.
Africa has a lot more concerns shipping from South America to Africa, it almost seems like it might be better to ship into Morrocco from Brazil and once in Morrocco if I have locations I wish to see specifically in Africa, I can fly into the specific locations and rent a vehicle, I am not sure it's worth riding through high-risk areas alone. From Morroco, I can plan around the seasons to start my way to Europe and beyond. So the first phase tentatively could be South America starting September 2020, I could arrange the shipment of the bike ahead of time so I can start in September in accordance with the seasons. So after looking at the map from limited research, I see a possible way to see South America in the following order: 1. Columbia - Ship the bike in here from Florida. I will have to avoid the raining season which is October and November. 2. Ecuador - From Columbia ride in and the weather in September through November is good. 3. Peru - From Ecuador ride in and the weather in September through March is good. 4. Bolivia - From Peru ride in, but raining seasons starts in November, so I want to be there and out prior to that. 5. Chile - From Bolivia ride in and the weather from September through February is good. 6. Argentina - From Chile ride in and the weather is good from September through February. 7. Uruguay - From Argentina ride in and the weather is good from September through December. 8. Paraguay - From Uruguay ride in and the weather is good September through March. 9. Brazil - From Paraguay ride in and the weather is good September through March. I can ship the bike from Brazil to Morocco in northwest Africa. |
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Hey man, I appreciate the reply, I agree it's about what we can handle, I am taking the same approach, I am going to go 100% while I have the youth and vitality. |
Couple of quick points: You’re going way overboard on your security concerns. The US State Department may have access to certain forms of information, but their ground personnel are largely ninnies who are forbidden to leave their precious safe zones. There are better sources of “security” information, including these forums. Note that the above holds true for all levels of skittishness about foreign travel.
Second, I’ve never heard of anyone shipping from Brazil to Morocco. I’d be inclined to doubt that it’s practical—or even possible—whether by air or sea. Of course, I haven’t looked into it and you’re welcome to prove me wrong. And sure, you can fly into various cities and rent local transport, but that’s going to be unpleasant, inefficient, ridiculously expensive, and wholly unsatisfying. You’ve already said you don’t like cities; now you’re going to see an entire continent by flying into major cities, then trying to find vehicles to rent, making your torturous way out into the countryside(s), then back again? Yuck. I’m pretty sure you didn’t find this stuff on The HUBB or ADVrider, and I’m positive it’s not based in any Chris Scott book. Guess it’s time for me to step out of this discussion and let it go wherever it goes. And again: hope that’s helpful. Mark |
Hello
Official sites about security are not usefull, to overprotective, read here in the hubb where and when someone travelled the "critical" countries. Those countries are usually hard to get into, to get a visa. Same goes for automobile clubs for infos about the CDP. For the shipping I've linked the database from the hubb. https://www.horizonsunlimited.com/get-ready/shipping But at the moment it is broken, so only few a result: "Please NOTE: Due to a Google change in the API, the system is partly broken - you can ONLY search Continent to Continent! We will get it fixed as soon as we can but it is a big deal. :( " There are many infos about the weather/clima of the countries around. For motorbikes it's winter and rainseason that can close roads, heat is just unconfortable. Have a look at websites/blogs when they travelled and how fast. What is your planned travel time/duration for your RTW? sushi |
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Have a great trip Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk |
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I agree with you on the security issue being overblown, for the most part, you have to understand because of my professional background I am trained to always analyze my environment from a tactical perspective when I went into a country it was survival. I have seen people ripped to pieces from RPGs, small arms fire, and have had people in general commands around me kidnapped and tortured/murdered. I am hoping through my travels that my defensive mechanisms to violence and humanity will be weakened and I can see the world from the outside of an indoctrinated political ideology that is not so purely tactical or political in nature. I think it is easy for the general population to speak about conscious constructs such as peace and to view everyone or everything in a holistic perspective of cohabitating. Unfortunately, I have viscerally experienced the worst of our unconscious biological mechanisms of humanity and when those conscious constructs of humanity we use to cohabitate are deconstructed and all that is left is survival. You can not just release these defensive mechanisms from your mind once you experience them, you just lessen the responses so they are less acute. So if you never experienced that you will not appreciate the threats that exist out there until you see your own blood or someone else's as a subsequent response from those actions of survival. So when I start my planning process, my training and my experiences drive my conscious actions towards certain paths of those processes. Again my goal is to break away from this and to get on the ground objective opinions from people who have experienced large parts of the world themselves to prove me wrong hopefully so I can grow past what I hope are false barriers towards me connecting to something beyond my own ideology and mechanisms. You are right on the State Department, they put their political barriers to what they asses as threats, these are sometimes very subjective in nature towards what is a threat. There may be threats to them because they are a target of political ideology, but towards the average drifter, they are probably not, because we are disconnected from that ideology. On the shipping from Brazil to Morroco, I was doing research on that last night, I saw a few random threads on it, I don't know if it's possible either. Again I am putting information out there to be proved wrong or to steer me in the right direction towards my planning process. You are right once you put it in perspective about renting a vehicle and flying to specific countries, now that I imagine that it seems quite arduous. Finally, I understand your perspective or why you may seem disenchanted with some of my ignorance on certain subject matters and I understand. However, I do not have willful ignorance or a desire to stay ignorant in certain perspectives. That is why I am on here, I am checking factually what is true and not and I understand I need to alter my perception to connect the world around me. I don't mind being wrong, I am not insecure. Part of the journey is discovering myself and the world I live in, I am no so ignorant to think the way I perceive reality is the epitome of perspective. |
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Sushi, Thanks for the reply. Again you are echoing what Mark on this thread was speaking upon. I agree that security threats can be overblown. I am personally working on lowering my defensive mechanisms from my professional career and looking at the world outside a political or tactical ideology. My goal in my journeys to reconnect to the world from outside those perspectives and defensive mechanisms I have acquired. Thank for you the link on shipping. I don't have a set duration for my journey, I am single with no kids, little family, and on a retirement pension. I have unlimited flexibility in my travels, I want the world to be my oyster and to just explore it all. If it takes 2 years great if it takes 7 great too. |
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[QUOTE=sushi2831;603395]Hello
Official sites about security are not usefull, to overprotective, read here in the hubb where and when someone travelled the "critical" countries. Those countries are usually hard to get into, to get a visa. Same goes for automobile clubs for infos about the CDP. For the shipping I've linked the database from the hubb. https://www.horizonsunlimited.com/get-ready/shipping But at the moment it is broken, so only few a result: "Please NOTE: Due to a Google change in the API, the system is partly broken - you can ONLY search Continent to Continent! We will get it fixed as soon as we can but it is a big deal. :( " Sushi, I looked into that link you sent me from hubb. It appears there are few options from South America into Africa, one is indeed from Brazil. |
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Actually I meant as a shakedown before you go. I found I dumped a fair bit of gear from my kit. Just for a laugh - when two of Australia’s main explorers went off to find their way nth thorough the bush they took a Chinese gong with them to announce meal time. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk |
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A Chinese going? Man that is comical! |
Hi Vagabond
Forgive me if I speak out of turn but if you are trying to deconstruct yourself, for want of a better phrase. Why not start somewhere less intimidating than South America or Africa. Might it not be easier to start with a trip to the port in America as a way of testing your gear and set up. Then ship to Europe for the summer and work your way round. I started a trip round the world once with a ticket to Bangkok and made the rest up as I went. There are so many options from Europe and making it up as you go might help. Take a rough idea of the thing that you want to see and work around them. |
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I thought about what you said this morning and I will already have environmental stressors compounding the inherent baseline of my mind as it is, I think getting use to the bike and doing shakedowns here in the U.S and having the European leg would make more sense. I could basically venture into the rest of the world on a path that naturally creates itself as I travel, but I would be starting out in more permissible and lower skill region to begin in. Even if I start late into Europe August/September 2020 as I have currently planned for my timeframe, I could still conceivably ride into October for a few months with the weather, probably get back into it around March/April and go all through Europe and after having that experience I could segway into a more challenging Asia region. I would like if I ship the bike to Spain to hop down and see Morroco before heading into the rest of Europe though, I always wanted to ride through Morroco. What do you think about that? |
Sounds like a good base for a plan and the weather in northern Europe is good in August(most of the time). Your plans might change 100 times the more ride reports you read. The planning is all part of the trip enjoy it :thumbup1:
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At this point, my first departure date for 2020 is going to be Aug-Sept definitively. It will give me a few months in Spain, Portugal, Morroco, and beyond into Western Europe. I can come back regroup after lessons learned and from getting my feet wet, then when March/April rolls around it will start warming up and I can go for 6-7 months into Europe and so onto into Asia as I will be in the optimum season. The further I go I will become more seasoned in my craft and I can use that in more challenging regions. I agree that the planning and this whole process is part of the joy for me. Now that I am pegging down a macro framework of my plan and have the bike, the details of the variables will shift as it all comes together, I agree. |
My trip that is in the initial planning stage at the moment has me going to Egypt via various countries including Iran. The only legal problem that I know of is getting through Iran as a British citizen - I can go there but I would need a guide - who I would have to pay for including accomodation etc. The same is true of American (and Canadian?) citizens.
I have managed to avoid this situation because I have Irish citizenship as well and will travel on an Irish passport. I was wondering - are you able to do the same? It may make access to some countries easier. |
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I will say countries like Pakistan, Iran, Afghanistan, etc I have been to some in my career I’m not sure I would go there outside a professional dynamic without asset support. I understand the people as a whole are wholesome enough and not a direct threat, but the political ideology of the governing body is radical. Since we are not affiliated with our nations political ideologies professionally currently (I’m assuming for you too) you think you will be treated as just another “tourist”. I wouldn’t be so quick to make that assumption, you are still a representative of your nation and it’s ideology. It makes for a great propaganda opportunity for the small percentage of the radical ideology of the population of that nation to potentially make an example of a wandering tourist that’s part of a nation that directly opposes their interest. 9/10 you could probably go through checkpoints and various gateways throughout these countries and be fine, I’m worried about that 10% chance. I know from experience from my past work in more under undeveloped countries the corruption is beyond belief. A lot of government officials are directly interconnected with the very “insurgent” forces they oppose. It takes one of those local national military or police force checkpoints to tip-off on a vulnerable and isolated tourist to make an example of you to further their ideology. I’m going to complete my around the world and take the calculated risk, that’s part of the experience if my return on investment is there for my risk. I don’t personally see the ROI on putting yourself in regions that are historically known to be high threat areas comparatively to the rest of the world. The travel would have to be incredible to take that risk, if you determine that it is, then do it. Personally, the most beautiful country I have ever been to currently is Afghanistan so I see the appeal and challenge. |
My rationale for using the Irish passport is that it reduces the level of investment I need to make to visit a country that has a magnificent reputation in welcoming visitors at the “Joe Public” level and has some interesting, to me at least, architecture and history. If I were to travel on my British passport I would firstly have to pay to have a guide and be limited to where I were to stay - they get to choose the hotels, etc.
As you say whatever the reality of your political / religious beliefs you are likely to be viewed through a particular lens by host nations political infrastructure based on your nationality - hence choosing use the lower profile nationality as it is likely to lead to less formal contact with the powers that be. There have been few, if any reports, of non-Iranian nationals getting hassle from Iranian authorities that I am aware of. Please note that I am aware of a couple of dual nationality British-Iranians that have fallen foul of the Iranian authorities and I do not make light of their plight (unlike the pillock that is currently the British Prime Minister who single handedly managed to double the prison sentence for a British-Iranian woman). The biggest problem is that Iran does not recognise the second nationality of a dual national and so does not allow consular visits etc. |
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The only advice i can give you is try not to over analyze......the questions will NEVER stop and the world will leave you sitting on your ass until your old as f%$k.......get the basic weather pattern and the countries you can travel without issue,pack the bike and go.:scooter:
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Hey vagabond2020
Have to agree with brian p. Take a hint from Nike and just do it. I'm 60+, just spend 8mths riding and working around Australia on a Transalp. Now I've bought another in Germany and heading for a few years exploration of Africa. No idea of a set route, timeframe, budget. Wing it is a frequently used phrase. If its of use to you: Pack the minimum you think you can get away with. First couple of weeks you'll ditch the unnecessary crap you thought was essential. Make stuff up as you need to i.e. be resourceful and adaptive - like making a broken clutch cable repair with stainless fishing braid. Hey - got me to Perth. Change your plans - A LOT! The great plan today is often impossible tomorrow or gets superceded by a much better plan. Yes - walk with your eyes open, but also have faith that most people in the world are humans too (many Governments excluded from this though!). A genuine handshake and gidday mate go a long way. If everything goes according to plan - its a pretty shit adventure. Best stories come from getting yourself out of deep doo doo. (aka rear shock self dismantling about 500km from closest civilization in 50+C heat on the gnarliest corrugated dirt roads) All just encouragement mate to open the throttle and just go. Adventure motorcycling is the most expensive way to live like a homeless person :) |
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Thank you for your reply, you are an inspiration. Most people any age, let alone beyond their later 60's would do something like this. I am 100% on board, I have fully committed and as you said I am "just doing it". I moved out of my house I was renting, a lot of my possessions have been sold and the rest in a storage unit all ready. Doing this at this point is my reality and motivation on a day to to day basis. I already have my timeline set in stone and everything else is just unfolding. I agree about not over planning, I have a generic plan for the administrative side, but rather than that I am letting the adventurous spirit be what it is. I can't wait to see everything, I am going to take my time. Yes, you are right, I will be spending a lot of money to be homeless :blink: |
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