Changing carnets
 

We're in Namibia, our existing carnet runs out in May and I've been in discussion with the RAC about a new one.

The RAC will only issue the new carnet for the day after the old one runs out - they won't issue it to start a few days beforehand to have an "overlap".

So - I can't exit Namibia into Botswana stamping the old carnet out and stamping the new one in (unless I was to manage to do it at exactly midnight on the day of changeover!).
The only other way I could see was to drive all the way to Zambia while the old carnet is still valid, stamp the old one out of Namibia, enter Zam on a TIP and then activate the new carnet on the next border crossing. I'm not massively keen on this as it is going to involve a 1000-mile detour in a 40mph vehicle.

Talking to the RAC, they suggest that I could remain in Namibia even though the old carnet had expired, drive to a border, cross over and stamp the old carnet out, then "in" on the new carnet on the other side. When asked if the Namibians wouldn't have a problem with that, the answer was "so long as you have the new carnet with you it shouldn't be a problem".

This somehow doesn't seem right to me - maybe I'm being paranoid, but surely you need a "current and stamped" carnet in-hand when in a country?

Can anyone shed any light on this please? I need to book flights for my wife who is coming out to join me and I need to know where to book her flights for!:confused1:


Thanks, Ian

That sounds really inflexible!
I just got new extension to my carnet from ADAC Germany.
My original carnet will run out early June, but I need new carnet to be valid already from mid April. This was not a problem for ADAC.

Hi Ian,

I don't think anyone will be able to give you a definitive answer here.

For what it's worth I think the RAC are right. A carnet does not cease to have effect when it's expiry date is up (otherwise no-one would worry very much about claims ;-). Plus if you are in possession of a new one then the continuity is clear.

However that doesn't mean that a customs official won't refuse to stamp a document which is out of date. He may think it's the correct approach (a fair enough assumption) or he may just be glad of a reason to inject a little interest into an otherwise boring day.

If it were anywhere other than a SACU country I would be very relaxed about it as the chances are no-one will even look at the date. However, I understand that SACU are responsible for by far the majority of unclosed RAC carnets. In other words if you don't get it stamped out for whatever reason then it may be difficult to get your release notwithstanding other evidence (eg subsequent carnet entries and exits and even the presence of the car back in the UK).

In short you need to make a decision whether you want to risk it or play it safe.

Perhaps ask the RAC if they would consider doing you a letter to show at the border (only if the issue arises - don't bring it up yourself) saying that you have replaced your carnet whilst overseas and could the customs official please ensure that the exit stamp is on the same document as the entry stamp notwithstanding the date on the document. I suggest you draft the letter for them and ask if they will have it put on their headed notepaper and signed. They may say no but it would be worth a try. "Official" letters carry a lot of weight at African borders.

Best of luck.

Thanks Itchyfeet - a very clear reply.

I'm feeling a bit risk-averse on this (a Unimog at 200% might be a deal-breaker!), so I'm thinking about that long haul up to Katima - not my favourite journey by any stretch of the imagination.

It seems the RAC are more stringent than most other organisations these days, I'll see if they'll write a letter for me, but I'm not hopeful.

Ian

This is what I'm thinking of proposing to the RAC, any comments would be welcomed:


To whom it may concern,

Whereas carnet number XYZ expires on XX May 2013, the Royal Automobile Club of the United Kingdom has issued a subsequent carnet number ABC to the holder which ensures continuity by commencing on XX+1 May 2013.

The RAC requests that,

· on exit, the original carnet be stamped whether it be in date or expired, allowing Mr CCC to discharge the responsibilities covered by said carnet,
· that on inspection within Namibia, the new carnet be considered to be a valid continuation of the original carnet due to it’s continuity.

Thanks, Ian

Did you see this:



http://www.horizonsunlimited.com/hub...h-africa-66959

I hadn't spotted that - I thought I'd seen all of Neill's posts about his carnet - that's very interesting - it does mean that I'd have to be in a major town on the day of the swap-over.
I've written to the RAC and spoken to them on the phone, they've promised to let me know what I need to do next week.

Ian

I would also contact the SA AA, just in case.

Just an update - I'm struggling with the RAC - they're not answering emails and when I call they don't seem to have the answers.

I'm now getting worried that the carnet may not even turn up on time as my wife is supposed to be bringing it out at the end of this week and I can't get through to confirm if it's going to be with her in time or not.

Sorry to hear that Ian. Don't get too stressed. I would send them an email with an indication of the urgency and your wife's flight date in the header.

And if the worse comes to the worse they can always courier it to you. It only takes a day or two.

I would also try and research where you can get this done - a border or airport may be easier than a major city for example or it may be you need to go to head office to get it done. Their website is

South African Revenue Service - Welcome to the website of the South African Revenue Service (SARS)

Good luck.

Hi Itchyfeet,
the RAC haven't replied to a single email that I've sent in the last couple of weeks, so I've just lost all confidence that I'm going to see the carnet in time! I don't trust courriers out here - I had some stuff sent out by DHL - it took 2 days to get to Windhoek, then got lost for 5 weeks! The only way I got it out of them was going through a friend who places hundreds of thousands of pounds of business with them for their business - suddently it was found!

With the lack of guidance from the RAC I've taken the decision to get my wife to fly into Windhoek where I'll meet her, there will be customs both at the airport and in the city (plus I know that there are a lot of Germans around who keep their vehicles there all year, so they'll know how it all works). I know where the AA offices are in Windhoek, so once I've got both carnets in my hand I'll pop in and see them for advice.
If all goes wrong I'll still have time (just) to make it back up to the Zambian border.

Tomorrow's job is to continue phoning the RAC ......

Ian

I was in a similar situation to you Ian and ended up stamping out of Namibia on my last day of carnet and then going through Bots in SA and back into Namibia. At no stage was asked for a carnet and as you see from one of my last posts I hope to cross over into Zambia towards the end of the year.

Surely they will be happy to get me out of their country and will only control me on the way in..having said that on the boarder east of Windhoek they are very lax with their controls and I have never had to show paper work for the vehicle.

Keep us posted as to the out come
Ben

Frencian,
You are asking RAC things they are unable to answer... And anyhow the issue is not in their hands but rather the customs of the country you are in.
The only thing you should ask RAC is the following: will you accept (to return my deposit) a carnet that has been closed by the customs of the various countries but that has not the last page filled (the one that should be filled by you country or any EU customs upon your return)?
So I would suggest that you enquire with the NAM customs, maybe with the assistance of the local AA...
Good luck!

PS
I was in your position a while ago and, not knowing that you could do the swap with the customs, I ended up driving to MOZ... doh

The carnet arrived finally yesterday - just in time for my wife to bring it out. Lots of stress induced by lost emails at the RAC, but we got it sorted finally.
No letter from them, no advice either - so I'm off to the AA on Monday to see if we can do something "in country".
I'll let you know what happens.....

Ian

It's Monday, the carnet arrived on Friday evening.

While we were doing some major work on the truck we met a few germans who haved based their vehicles here for a few years. They all suggested trying the customs house in Windhoek and kindly supplied the address.

so - this morning I shot down there to find an Austrian driver already with the customs officer - the Austrian was holding 2 carnets and didn't look too happy.
When the Austrian left the customs guy looked at my carnets, asked to check the chassis number on the truck, came back in and stamped both carnets while telling me that he was very happy that I was doing it "the correct way" rather than the other guy who had let his old carnet expire even though he had another that started immediately afterwards. Apparently he had refused to stamp out an "expired document". It took all of 5 minutes for mine - I spoke with the other driver outside and suggested he could speak with the people either at Transkalahari or Elisenheim as they both seem to know "how to do things that can't otherwise be done".

Anyway, for anyone else in a similar position in Namibia - get yourself down to the customs office on Voigt Strasse just opposite the Post Office before your old one runs out and you should find it easy.
I'm going to add a summary of this to Neill's post re swapping carnets in Capetown so it's easy to find.

Ianbier