2 stroke
 

Anybody done any serious miles on a two stroke.
Just thinking if there was a low tune two stroke, it would be reasonable economical. Cheap. Reliable. Easy to repair and service.
Just remembering the old mz250. Many did huge mileages with little work.
Anything current or recent available?

I've done quite a bit of two stroke touring in the (dim and distant) past and may well be going down that route again in the next year or so as a kind of retro experience similar to using a film camera and buying vinyl records.

The main problem with 2Ts is supply. There just aren't any mainstream touring smokers around these days so it has to be something donkeys years old or try to cobble together a silk purse out of a sow's ear. People still try though - here's a link to someone (recently) overlanding to Cairo on a 1952 BSA Bantam Overland To Egypt

I think an MZ250 could form the basis of quite a nice low tech, low cost tourer and they're still cheap enough on ebay. I had an early one many years ago and did many eurotrips on it although it could be temperamental at times. Even MZ technology moved on though and many of the things I found exasperating were sorted out in the later versions. There's a few other people here that still run them and I'm sure they'll be along to expand on things.

Just don't get MZ and CZ mixed up though!

Emmisions are what killed them. Piagio made high rech one which passed emmisions. Not sure if it went into production. Even then it was for a scooter i think. Mz live on i think under a different name made In Turkey. With the use of modern 2stroke oils it should help with longevity.

Just do it
 

Yes sadly, the green guys got their way here. Bought myself a Jap Yamaha TZR250 from the 1980's.
Good condition with low mileage, goes like stink. Limited to tarmac though as it's not built for sand. Most I ever did in a day is 460km. Economy is not really great - my car gets better fuel economy. Four strokes are way better a sipping fuel.

But nothing beats a two stroke for driving pleasure.

Well i don't have enough info regarding 2 stroke bikes but why don't you go for any 4-stroke bike? Isn't it affordable for you?

Are you planning to ride off road or solely on tarmac?

If your determined to stick to a 2T and you need off road ability then its impossible to overlook a DT125, they're as common as muck all across europe, tons of spares everywhere. Ive seen them clear 40ft tabletops round our mx track and they can withstand a lot of abuse.

The only trouble now is finding one that hasn't been crashed, bent, stolen, jumped and ran out of oil.

If your going to stick to the tarmac, consider a TDR125, similar motor to a DT but a bit of wind protection and more road manners, very common in Europe.

There are no commuter/comfortable 2Ts left really, the 2Ts only lingered on as race reps and off road bikes through 90-00s.

New there's really nothing out there.

Sorry about the essay, hope it helps

new 2t's
 

If you want to buy new in South Africa there are two choices:
Yamaha DT 175 @R32 000
Suzuki AX100 R 7999

You can get two stroke at most big supermarkets and many garages.

New 2 strokes!!

new jawa motorcycle price list in the uk

2 strokes
 

Rode my 350 LC 100 miles back home this morning...35mpg....ouch ouch ouch..can just about get double that from my Xt..

Sweet ...
 

That limited edition military style Jawa got me salivating ..... beautiful colour and look at those tires!

new jawa 350 motorcycle models in the uk

An average 60 mpg doesn´t sound too bad.

I own 3 MZ's plus enough bits to build another. I guess since 1990 I've done something like 100000 miles on them. I won't be selling, they are the most fun to ride machines there are.

I would however never use on for any journey of more than a day or two unless the sole purpose was to do that trip by MZ. Parts are now less available than the likes of BSA's. They need good oil which is stupidly expensive in Northern Europe and simply doesn't exist elsewhere. They are in a state of constant destruction. I have a 301 motor that has 65000 km on it and has never let me down. I've had that one from new and done the seals and de-cokes bang on the service intervals, it has had the sort of mixed use variable speeds smokers like. One bike I bought siezed on the way home because the PO had set the timing half a degree too early to get more power and had only ridden it on a 3 mile commute.

There is no way that Jawa does 60 MPG unless they've detuned it the sort of power you'd get from a CG125 and ridden it at 50 mph on a down hill autobahn. MZ's do 40-50 mpg in real world use, the Jawa is similar.

If you want easy use on a long trip get a small 4-stroke. If you want simple and interesting try an Enfield or Hinckley Bonneville. The only reason to go with a smoker is because of the way they ride.

Andy

See my comment on my 1974 Jawa in another thread here.

My first ever 'new' bike. Pure heartbreak. And I wouldn't believe 60 mpg for a minute. Mine got mid-30s at best. I doubt if electronic ignition has made that much difference. Kawasaki triple running costs with Bantam performance.

Maybe they are better these days. They couldn't be worse, after all.

Edit: I am a big fan of 2-strokes - owned, and loved, a 350 Power Valve and a GT250A. But I wouldn't choose one for an extended trip away from sources of good, low-ash 2T oil. A 4-stroke is much easier to live with.

I wonder just how important hi-tec two stroke oil is for 70's design smokers? Back then when we were running them all over Europe we'd buy two stroke oil if we could get it but if not then car 20-50 went into the oil tank. I can only ever remember fouling a plug once and no other problems. Of course people were slightly less sensitive to the clouds of smoke coming from the silencers back then. You wouldn't even notice two stroke smoke in the clouds of truck diesel fumes.

These days I do use the lowest smoke oil I can lay my hands on for my Kawa 500H1 but it only ever gets used for (relatively) short trips so the crankcases are never oil scavenged properly and the smoke just pours out. On a long trip the smoke level would drop but at 30mpg (and a two gallon tank) it'll be a while before I head off to Greece on it.

When we were two smoke touring we assumed for planning purposes we'd get 50mpg from the collection of stuff we used over the years (250 Yamaha/ Suzuki/ MZ, 350 Yamaha / Suzuki and T500 Suzuki) and by and large that's what they returned on long trips. I was going to upgrade to a new Suzuki 550 triple until I saw the magazine road testers were only getting 35-40mpg. That was just too low. Any two wheeler that can't get 40-45mpg has to have something else going for it. A lot of bikes do but the mid 70's Jawa 350 that a friend of mine ran for about three years wasn't one of them.

I had to resort to 10/40 engine oil in my Tdr 250 a few years back to get back along the m4 down m25 and home...didn't seem to do it any ham,just not ideal...

1970's petrol wasn't full of detergents and other stuff we have in there now. I started to get fouling using supermarket brand smoke oil in the 90's. For long trips it was just a case of mixing throttle settings, for city use it was better to buy the good stuff.

Andy

On the Yam and the GT250 I used the best I could afford ('low ash' is how I remember it, no idea of brand) and I never had to decoke the silencers of either. Can't remember how many miles I covered on them - it's too long ago. In the Jawa I think I used cheap stuff, and the silencers would pour out tarry filth. I think I decoked them about every 1500 miles. So perhaps it does make a difference, not to performance but to maintenance. Or perhaps that's the difference between pre-mix and metered.

I think I'd agree with that.

How much!
Used to be a guy near me who had one years ago.
Used to spin the gear lever over and use as a kickstart!!
When he gunned it up the road it was like a smoke grenade going off!!!!
It broke down every week.
Usekess it was.

The combined gear lever/kickstart was an answer to a question no-one had asked. You ended up with a kicker that was too small (and too close to the footrest - my left big toe still hurts in wet weather after mashing it against the very solid footrest a million times) and a gear lever that was too big and clumsy. You had to ask - why?

If your mate's bike broke down every week, it must have been one of the good ones.

Useless doesn't come close.

Mz 250
 

Three guys on MZ two strokes rode from Japan home via Mongolia, Russia etc. this past summer, 2012. Bit of welding needed I think but they made it without ann major mishaps.

Nothing serious, but I rode South Africa to Kenya and later Morocco to Guinea Bissau, on a beat up classic Vespa PX200E... not exactly reliable, not exactly fuel efficient, not exactly environmentally friendly, and not exactly suitable... but still capable, even offroad.

Still, single cylindered two strokes are great - especially for their simplicity and ease of repair and service.

My biggest concern with two stroke engines is oil consumption. You think gasoline can be difficult to get in some places, try to find two stroke oil! Of course it exists, but finding the holy grail might be easier. And as for synthetic or even semi synthetic... ha, ha, ha.

With your regular 2% oil mixture, and pluss minus 5L fuel per 100km (heavy loaded old tech single cylindered two stoke bikes with small engines are usually thirsty), cutting the shortest distance across Africa translates into 12 liters or so of two stroke oil... that is if no oil is spilled, you don't mix too much, no bottles are broken or lost, and no detours are taken, and no idling with wheels not rolling. In all reality, the oil consumption would likely be more like 15 liters. So, if you plan to go through the heart of Africa and don't want to spend much time searching for oil, be prepared to carry many liters of oil at all time!

Some places, digging for it might actually be easiest.

TST - Two Stroke Touring
 

My '89 Jawa 350 I´ve been riding since´93. Great bike, points-ignition, single carb, low-cost everything except fuel & 2-stroke oil. Never let me into big trouble, just a handfull of roadside-adjustments when I´ve neglected the ignition-timing. The bike needs enthusiastic owner, and lasts forever. Mine starts in 28 celcius below zero, does 80+ km/h with two-up plus campingear for wintertime. Friend did Oslo-Irbit (Sibiria) and return, 9000 kms without problem. Another friend did Hammerfest (190 kms south of North Cape) - Praghue and return, 8000 kms. No problems. Lend me the bike last autumn for a short trip to North Cape. The Jawa 350 will do the job, but I think you have to be slightly interested to keep it running:thumbup1: