New KTM 790
 

Moved from T7 thread



The new 790 has only been out a year now and very few out in the public so far. And the 790 Duke has not been released in USA yet! So, I'd say it's still early days on that engine and the bike overall.

I'm sure KTM have pre production bikes out there and the race team testing is invaluable. But small part and involves a small number of machines.
Lets hope they've got it right first time out ... God knows they've taken enough time! (probably busy fine tuning the Chinese plant operation? )

Will you be a Beta tester for this new KTM ... on your pound? :smarts:

Good post! and so true. I don't see any China bashing on this thread but we see plenty of that on other forums ... especially KTM and BMW forums.

So true, this is all changing and as you say, it's the parent company that matters. They set the standard. All we need do is look what is coming out of Thailand. The new Triumphs are damn good. Most ALL Thai made with Japanese engine parts and internals.

Yes but remember the Duke sits in the "Supermoto" category and is tuned for power. The Adv is projected to have around 90 which should be good for longevity but still result in a good performance from a bike intended to be the lightest in its class.

790 ktm
 

As factual an article as anything else in print to date:

https://www.bennetts.co.uk/bikesocia...coming-in-2019

More info is now available for the two new KTMs: 790 adventure and 790 adventure R.

Seat height: 33.5 to 32.7inch (R 34.5inch)
Suspension travel:
- front: 7.9inch (R 9.4inch)
- rear: 7.9inch (R 9.4inch)
Ground Clearence: 9.2inch (R 10.4inch)
Dry weight: 189kg
Tank 5.3gal

[url=http://www.motorcycledaily.com/2018/11/2019-ktm-790-adventure-combines-street-and-dirt-capabilities/]2019 KTM 790 Adventure Combines Street and Dirt Capabilities

https://www.ktm.com/en/travel/790-adventure-r/Overview

I think the comparisons between the 790 and the T7 just stopped. With just 72 bhp and weighing in over 200 kgs dry, the T7 has shot itself firmly into the Africa Twin category. The 790 is thus a bike out on its own, lighter, more powerful and, with the pannier type tank, no doubt feeling a whole lot lower.

I'm pleased they are offering a base and R model, as the base looks pretty good for adventure touring while the R will be a bit higher with more electrickery for sporty riding.

Next questions, when and how much???

March 2019 and US$11.5k is my guess based on the info I have seen to date.

KTM dealer in Bogota will have a demo(s) units by the end of this year so I'm told. Let's see if that plays out, I hope so!

I agree, Yamaha T7 just got killed off. Although they do have until 2021 the expected USA release date to fix it :-)

189 kg dry and 20 liters tank with 450km range so it's about 204 kg wet, not that bad similar to T7 which has smaller tank and range as well as less power.




still heavy, not sure why some would buy this instead of 1090 adv R?

That weight specs are far out! The KTM 1090 is 205 kilos dry so no way the 790 can be ~ 11-12 kilos more. The specs in Tremens thread seems correct - 189 kilos dry and ~ 204-205 wet.

You are right Snakeboy. I did the change.

Patrick

where did you hear that fairy tale? :)

Maybe 5+ years ago, but not anymore.

You only have to look at some of the RTW reports, more than a few 100k+ KM's 1190's still going very strong.

I'd agree about the importance of reliability but I wouldn't agree the 790 can be judged on it. After all this is a virtually brand new engine, KTM have done a mahoosive amount of work to develop it and there have been no problems I'm aware of reported in the 790 Duke which has been out for nearly a year.

It's wrong to judge KTM by the standards of its past bikes (though BMW kinda trades on that), and even if you do there are plenty of examples of machines that have clocked up huge mileages with no problems.

I find it incredible that KTM thinks this is an advert for an adventure travel bike. Enduro yes, but definitely not Adventure.

Let's see some photos with luggage and sensible off-tarmac riding, not some juvenile Top Gear type antics.

50 kg heavier is not a selling point to me and I definitely don't need any extra power, so it looks like I will stick with my KTM 690 'bumbling adventure' bike.

The one thing that might have swung it for me is if KTM had made the spokes external to allow tubeless tyres.

I've tried both. Against things that penetrate the outer tyre, the thickness of the inner tube has no relevance.
Heavy duty tubes might help with 'snake bite' punctures when you are running at low pressures over rocks and where the tube gets pinched, but there's a downside that even when fully inflated they limit the speeds you can run at due to heat buildup.

Slime has never worked for me. Some people report that once a tube has had slime in it, you can't patch the tube, but I find it washes off just fine. But then I rarely patch tubes, I replace the tube with a new one and then have the old tube vulcanised.

So at the moment my preferred options are tubeless or running mousses. I use mousses in my KTM 690 Enduro. Michelin BIB mousses are a real PITA to fit but they last as long as the outer tyre.

if I'm not mistaken all new adventure bikes from KTM, BMW, Suzuki XT versions use tubeless, spoked wheels so only honda is behind and Kawasaki. We'll see what approach T700 is gonna take.

I think it's important to make a distinction between the basic 790 Adventure and the 790 Adventure R. KTM themselves describe the Adv as a long distance touring bike with offroad capabilities, while the R is clearly more performance focused, with its single seat, high front mudguard and many selectable driving modes. I'd agree with you the R is not an Adventure bike as we would generally think of it.

I'll be able to let you know how capable the Adv feels in March hopefully, as I've just put down an deposit on one :scooter:

https://www.asphaltandrubber.com/rum...0-enduro-2019/

Interesting that KTM is muddying its own waters by reintroducing the 690 Enduro R using the Husky 701 engine for MY19.

Yes, you are right, the 790 Adventure looks a far better bike for travellers. The more I look, the more impressed I am. 15,000km service interval is brilliant, a wide variety of accessories and luggage. If I was in the market for a mid-weight travel bike it would probably be a toss up between this and the BMW 850 (which has tubeless spoked wheels).

Hope it lives up to your expectations :thumbup1:

790 Adventure also has tubeless spoked rims.

The R version has tubed DID rims.

No mention of that on KTM's own site.

https://www.ktm.com/en/travel/790-adventure/chassis

exactly, while on 1090 adv R they say it clearly it has tubeless wheels:

https://www.ktm.com/en/travel/1090-adventure-r/chassis

790 also doesn't seem to have hydraulic clutch, which is interesting since most of ktm have it. Would that indicate it will be budget version of 1090?
which in turn was budget version for 1290 adv r :)

Would be a shame if there is no hydraulic clutch, as you really need to work it on some slippery terrain... But I don't believe the 790 will be a cheap version of the 1090 : Totally different frame and engine !

if I see right there is standard cable clutch on this clip:

Looks like a space ship though?



Good for Matlock Bath but not good for Mauritania?


It gave me a big slackie as soon as I saw it. Too flash for proper travel and those big fuel tanks low down at first strike poimt are just asking for an angry thorn.


But to be fair, take off the homo-erotic body-work, and replace with something understated, you have a very workable machine. good punt KTM, just roll it up and zip it in like everyone else does.





children eh? xxx

Well I searched high and low for more information. Nothing about tubeless on the specifications on the KTM site. I studied photos in detail and there was no sign (for me) that the rims were anything but tubed.

However, I found the video below shot at EICMA. At about six minutes in, KTM Italy's Head of Communications, Paolo Fabiano, is talking about the 790 Adventure, and the subtitles state, "the rims are tubeless with KTM technology".

The journalist says tyres with tubes but Fabiano corrects him, waggling his finger, saying they are tubeless wheels and tyres using the same technology used on the other KTM adventure motorcycles.



I'm really impressed with KTM's understanding of the needs of the 'bumbling around' off-tarmac adventure tourers; tubeless with 21/18 is a great combo for this :clap: :clap: :clap: whilst those who want to play silly buggers pretending they are Dakar Rally riders can buy the tubed 'R' version.

Having suffered with mudplugging, I'd like to see a bigger gap 'twixt the tyre and front mudguard. Perhaps the R mudguard could be fitted.

And then I suppose there's the endless list of little things that you would think an adventure bike manufacturer would provide as standard and rarely does
- wide footpegs
- big foot on side stand (this must cost pennies at the build stage)
- loud horn
- LED aux lights so oncoming trucks realise you are not a moped

The 790 has a slipper clutch and different traction control and ABS modes that let you select how much wheel slip you want on or off road. As you say, it's a totally different bike to the V-twins and will be much smaller, lighter and lower. Far more suitable for offroad use, and I don't think having a cable clutch will be any impediment. Far from it, it's something that's a whole lot easier to fix if it goes wrong in the middle of nowheristan.

The R mudguard could be fitted, yes - KTM say all the parts are interchangeable. But I suspect few of these bikes will see really, really heavy mud and in that case the mudguard will be the last of your problems. It's not a trail bike, and even then I've been on a trail bike with high mudguard in such sticky mud that it just clogs the forks and brakes and jams the wheel anyway.

KTM already list big footrests as an option I believe, as for the other things you mention they wouldn't be a very high priority for me.

Lastly before I fall off my soapbox, a thought on davebetty's points. The overslung tanks didn't appeal to me at first but the more I think about them the more I like them. KTM state they have tested them for impact resistance and from the look of them they have outer panels made similar to crash bungs to protect them in the event of a road spill. And of course they help keep the weight low, very important if you're travelling on a rough road or dirt track. If it's cafe posing you're after, stick to a big V-twin with a big fuel tank perched on top of a tall engine. To me small and simple is sweet.

Having fixed the leaking clutch slave cylinder of my 701 on the side of a croatian road, you make a really valid point here [emoji28]

from what I see so far I'd rather get 1090 adventure R for traveling, 18kg difference is not much and you get premium most of the components plus more power. The question is only price difference.

here is very good close up video even under the bike, looking good I mean not visually because it's ugly but most previous ktm adventure bikes problems seem to be addressed. E.g. side stand no longer mounted directly to the engine, stiffer and reinforced headlight mount, easily accessible air filter (under the seat) etc

......and a garbage paper element air filter, ready for a K&N for the Starbucks crowd, really KTM?

I've been to some KTM dealers here in Germany these days and they're actually selling off last years 1090 models now for around 10k€ whilst the new 790 / R is just about to hit shopfloors these days starting from 12.4k€ / 13.4 k€.

One of the dealers mentioned he wouldn't understand the price politics, but you now have a chance for a very reasonable price on the 1090 in case you've been waiting for it.

for me you can shove that!! at 6'5" the 990 is a bit on the small side, I have raised the seat and lowered the footpegs just to make it comfortable.
ABS, egnine management mode, on road off road rain sport what have you canbus electrical system ""simple"" really?

dont get me wrong I am sure it will be a nice bike but simple is just not true, but none of the other new bike are simple either.

To me TALL or Extra TALL, and old fashioned electrics, no abs, etc, is simple, so no new bike for me :(:(:(

I think my days of ever buying an new bike are over, what I have is already TOO complicated.

The low tank is actually an argument for me to buy the KTM 790 Adv R. Look at the BMW F850GSA, the one bike in the same class that actually has the same reach or beats the KTM when it comes to reach. All the weight is far on the top. Vice versa KTM has decided to go with the rally-proven design to position the fuel low. I am not the tallest guy (1.71m) but have a lot of experience with high bike in the same class, currently the Africa Twin. So I am very much appreciating that the handling of the KTM will probably be superior to everything else in the class, 'cause of that low tank. And this makes life for me with my short legs much easer. Yes, I could have gone for the lower non-R model, but I'd like to have the full adjustability, even if the stroke length of the suspension might be total overkill for the kind of riding I do.
The only negative point of the tank is, that the width down there might make it difficult to pass trough the gabs between stone blocks on the side of road barriers, but of course I'd never do that anyway. Honestly...! :innocent:

I have a test ride being organised on both versions of the 790 Adventure hopefully by the end of this month.

The increased fuel range over my 690 (the 11.7-litre tank on my MY13 bike gives around 300 km range) would be welcome for real long off-road stages such as Western Sahara. I have a 30-in inseam and can just manage the 910mm seat on the lightweight 690, but would need a lower seat for a heavier bike. 880 mm for the 790R might be a tad tall.

KTM 790 Adventure £11,099
21/18 tubeless Avon Trailrider
850 mm seat
95 bhp
189 kg dry
23.8 kpl x 20 litres fuel = 470 km range
Service interval 15,000 km

KTM 790 Adventure R £11,999
21/18 tubeless Metzeler Karoo 3
880 mm seat

This is how a 2019 model 690 (with the bigger fuel tank) compares
KTM 690 Enduro R £9,599
21/18 tubed (though I use mousses in mine)
910 mm seat
75 bhp
146 kg dry
25.3 kpl x 13.5 litres fuel = 340 km range

As @5ooX points out above, UK dealers are discounting the 1090 Adventure
though I'm not keen on the 19/17 setup on the non-R version.

KTM 1090 Adventure (2018) £8,899
19/17 tubeless Metzeler Tourances (wheels too small)
850 mm seat
125 bhp
205 kg dry
17.8 kpl x 23 litres = 400 km range
Service interval 15,000 km

KTM 1090 Adventure R (2018) £9,899
21/18 tubeless Continental TKC 80
890 seat

I believe both the BMW 850GS and the Adventure version are tubeless and I'd love the 550 km range on the Adv. Not keen on the 17-in rear which makes it more difficult to source off-road tyres in remote countries.

BMW 850GS £9,875
21/17 presumably tubeless (would prefer 18-in rear)
860 mm seat (835 available)
95 bhp
24.3 kpm x 15 litres = 350 km range
229 kg wet

BMW 850GS Adventure £10,600
21/17 presumably tubeless (would prefer 18-in rear)
875 mm seat (lower available)
24.3 kpm x 23 litres = 550 km range
244 kg wet (due to increased capacity tank)

There's two schools of thought here. One is as you suggest, that you should be able to fix everything by the roadside. It has merit, absolutely. But the other is that with well designed modern electrics you shouldn't have stuff breaking down by the roadside in the first place, and that's where I'm coming from - and unless you want to cast around for antiques that's where you'll be heading sooner or later too.

I mean, how many people ride bikes with contact breaker points any more? How many people have had an electronic ignition system (not a generator) fail on a trip? How many people are on the road right now with fuel injected bikes. The world's changing.

yeah, this is clever design base on Dakar bikes. CoG will be low as opposed to new Tenere 700 for instance.

Here is nice size and weight comparison between those three, 1090R, t90R and 690R. The 790R is wider then 1090R :)

Joe Pitchler's travel blog through Africa riding a 790 Adv R. He's been on the road for the last three months!

Reiseblog Afrika 2018/19

And now I'm totally confused about the tubed/tubeless situation with the R 790. This photo shows the R being fitted with an inner tube: http://www.josef-pichler.at/content/blog-afrika/28/

But this site reckons the R has tubeless: https://ktm.adventurerallybike.co.uk/machinery

EDIT: Just heard back from the dealer, "Both bikes on the parts finder system are showing tubeless components" and a comment on AdvRider, "Default rims are tubeless on standard and R model, DID wheels (tube type) can be ordered from Power Parts." So I've edited my summary a few posts above to reflect this.

Again good points. My wifes bike is just off the road due to the hall sensors on the crank pick up. BMW R1200 owners suffer from antenna ring/fuel pump problems that there are third party companies making a good living selling get you home wiring solutions. There are multiple issues with owners having issues with lcd screens both on KTMs, and BMW,s, The current crop of 1190's/1290's take a look across various forums there are electrical problems a plenty that have not been addressed and sorted.
I love my KTM 990 to bits but the quality of the electrical connectors and components is appalling, an yes I carry a spare ignition unit, and its not even can bus at least I can work on that without the need for a computer.

I am in complete agreement with you that a well designed modern bike should not be an issue but the fact remains that they ARE, because the electrical systems are not yet reliable.

KTM 790 Adventure review (UK)

I don’t get to ride a huge variety of bikes so my notes below are very much a comparison of the 790 Adventure to my current KTM 690 R Enduro.

Any bike by definition is a set of compromises, especially in the long distance comfort vs off-tarmac choices. The 690 is one of only a few bikes that you can stick 50 kgs of luggage on, ride 1000+ km, and then head off over a ploughed field or sand dunes. Whilst not particularly comfortable, it swallows long distances and motorway speeds—I’ve ridden my London-based 690 from Aberdeen to London in a day which is 880 km (550 miles). In a 20-hour period I rode my Spanish-based 690 from Marrakech to Tanger, took the ferry to Spain then rode on via Granada to our cave in the mountains which was 1100 km (690 miles).

There are lighter (i.e. better) bikes for off-tarmac adventures, but they can’t carry sufficient luggage, would be excruciatingly uncomfortable for long distance, and have a service interval measured in hours rather than 10,000km. There are better (invariably much heavier) bikes for distance travel but unless you are an off-road god they are impossible riding in loose sand—I’ve been there and done it, with a BMW 1200 GSA, and have no wish to revisit the nightmare.

When I’m in Morocco I normally ride solo, often in very remote places, sometimes in 40ºC heat with no shade. Getting a puncture in tubed tyres in those conditions is a real downer so at the moment I run the Spanish 690 with mousses, an expensive solution as the mousses cost as much as the tyres and need replacing as often. Consequently the tubeless tyres on both models of the 790 are a huge positive as far as I’m concerned.

So… getting on with the mini review… The UK has basked in unseasonably warm sunshine for the last week with record temperatures of over 20ºC (70ºC) and there’s the danger of rose-tinted glasses when riding a bike in such conditions. But no worry, I woke to cold, grey, overcast sky and the promise (duly fulfilled later) of light rain. Jason Jones at The KTM Centre in Hemel Hempstead had the 790 Adventure waiting with only 40 miles on the clock. Trade plates were fitted as the ’19’ plates are only legal from tomorrow (1 March).

To differentiate the models I would have liked to refer to the non-R version of the 790 as the 790S but ’S’ is reserved in KTM nomenclature for alloy wheeled models. So I will call it the 790B (basic).

Looking at the paper specs, the 690 has a 910 mm high seat, the 790R has 880 mm and the 790B has 830-850 mm. But this takes no account of the seat curvature and the reality is that the 790B with the seat in the low position feels almost the same height as my 690. I have a 30-inch inseam and on the 790B am only touching the ground with the balls of my feet. I suspect there will be a lot of potential 790R customers out there who will either move to the 790B or have to do some form of lowering

The extra 50 kg of weight over the 690 wasn’t particularly noticeable when moving the bike around and it felt lovely and light on the road, very balanced. The fuel tanks look rather bulbous in photos but you don’t notice them. Much of my riding in Morocco is at ‘bumbling along’ speeds and I often get 300 km range. Similar riding with the 790 would allow a 470-km (290 mi) range which is really impressive.

The first thing that will impress everyone is the TFT instrument panel which in addition to the usual rev counter, speedo, warning lights, also shows multiple trip odometers, ambient temperature, battery charge condition, fuel range, fuel consumption, ride mode, ABS mode, traction mode, and so on. The various bike settings are controlled by a four-way handlebar switch. Thanks to the intuitive software, when it started to rain, I was able to switch the ride mode from ‘street’ to ‘rain’ without even having to slow down.

The noise from the standard silencer is quite muted. Riding the bike with ear plugs it was hardly noticeable. I have a Wings exhaust on the 690 but this was fitted primarily because the standard 690 can/CAT runs so hot it melts plastic roll bags! The 790 cat is under the engine and I would probably run the 790 with the standard exhaust.

I took the bike north on the M1 motorway seeing what it was like at high cruising speed. The airflow over the windshield was fine and I rode for some time with my visor up. The windshield is adjustable and could be lowered by maybe 25mm to ensure the helmet is in clean air. Also the much lower R windshield could be fitted.

The engine has ample power, feels more like 1000cc, pulls well from under 3000 revs in 4th, feels very happy at high revs. The fueling is spot on, no hiccups in traffic, the engine is smooth with no vibration, and a constantly clear image in the rear view mirrors (vibration-induced mirror stem failure is common on the 690).

I meant to take note of the seat comfort but forgot to, which says something quite positive about it. One major advantage of the 790 is that it can definitely take a pillion. I have ridden the 690 with my wife on the back but it’s only viable for short distances, it’s cramped and one’s gonads are rather squashed.

Having ridden north for a while, by now I was well and truly lost so I thought I would use the bike’s simple navigation facility to route me back to The KTM Centre. I had the 790R owners manual on my iPhone so I stopped to read this to check how to link my phone to the bike’s TFT screen. First of all, I had to download KTM My Ride from the Apple App Store (£7.99). I got it linked and then set up a route in the KTM app back to Jason, but couldn’t work out how to display the app on the TFT screen. I was a bit exposed sitting by the side of the road, so I skipped that and used Apple Maps on my Watch instead.

I took a twisty route back through the Chiltern hills. By now the bike and I were firm friends and I was really enjoying myself. I probably didn’t go over half throttle the whole journey but loved the way the bike reacted.

One unsung aspect I really like are the twin storage compartments either side of the bike, one holds the tool kit, the other could be used for chain lube or other needs. I didn’t think The KTM Centre would thank me for take the bike off-tarmac in the rain in what are half-half tyres (Avon Trailriders) but I did try standing on the pegs and everything felt good. Yes, it’s not as light as the 690 but then I’m often off-tarmac on the 690 with 50+ kg of luggage and the 790 sans the luggage would be about the same.

What didn’t I like? I thought the side stand foot should be bigger so it doesn’t sink into mud or sand. I never understand why they are invariably so small. I couldn’t think of anything else I didn’t like.

I would probably fit a louder horn and like the idea of fitting Barkbuster hand guards with built-in LED running lights so oncoming traffic in Morocco realises I’m not a moped.

wonder how this bike compares to 690R, when I tested 690R some time ago I was not impressed.

@tremens: It's all to do with trade-offs. The 690 R is very much in the style and riding manner of an enduro bike, and KTM being very much 'Ready to Race' build the 690 with hard suspension to deal with how they perceive it will be used.

Which is nothing like how I use it. LOL

http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/2019...c004838132.jpg

I borrowed a 701 in Ouarzazate recently and found the engine smoother with better fueling. I believe the 2019 Enduro R has many of the 701 improvements, so should be quite an improvement. But it's still an enduro with road-legal bits added, whilst the 790 is a road bike at heart, along with the Africa Twin, BMW 850GS and so on.

Owners manuals
790 Adventure: https://www.ktmshop.se/documents/19_3213918_en_OM.pdf
790 Adventure R: https://www.ktmshop.se/documents/19_3213919_en_OM.pdf

so the question is will you replace your 690R with new 790R? :)

Very tempting bike indeed but the new engine is relatively new and not sure we can trust it yet, heard some reports about overheating, oil leak etc on duke 790 forums. Also TFT dash can be problematic, when it's fail bike could not start for instance. Have seen such cases.

Duke problems reported are minor—a few reported oil leaks from bottom of engine, water leaks from thermostat area, poor running. If the 790 Adventure engine hadn't been used in the Duke I might be slightly more concerned.

Human nature is such that many people only post on forums when they have a gripe and the vast majority of silent customers are very happy. I've found all three of my 690R bikes to be ultra reliable and the only problems have been introduced when dealers have serviced the bike (or not serviced in one case).

My initial plan was to part exchange my 690R in Spain for the 790, but seeing as I sold my London 690R a couple of months ago along with the Tenere and another bike, I've decided to buy the 790 Adventure for UK/Northern European travel.

I can't see I'll come across much in the way of off-tarmac routes, but am confident the standard bike will be able to handle them.

I agree 100% though I never heard anybody wrote about yamaha or honda fuel pump failure but I've seen many posts of failing ktm fuel pumps even on newer models. So...

In 2008 I started a thread on UKGSer about breakdowns caused by the fuel pump controller on the BMW R1200 GS. Eight years later the fault was still going on and the thread now contains details of over 450 failures. It became a personal crusade of mine as many of these poor guys were on their annual holidays and had their trip totally ruined.

The sorry saga of 1200GS/GSA fuel pump controller failures (410 so far))

Archived reports: http://www.ukgser.com/forums/showthr...roller-replies

The early F800GS and F650GS twin models (introduced in 2008) had numerous chain failures, numerous radiator hose leaks, steering bearing failures, wheel bearing failures, fuel tank splits, and so on. I personally suffered from a chain failure PLUS repeated radiator hose leaks PLUS a rear wheel bearing failure (in Fez). You can read about these under 'warnings and recalls' at http://www.ukgser.com/forums/showthr...OPULAR-THREADS

Eleven years on and my blood still boils about BMW's couldn't care less attitude and their attempts to hide the scale of problems. A company that size should have done the right thing for its customers.

Unlike BMW's marketing strategy for the twin cylinder F6xx/F7xx/F8xxGS bikes, the two 790 Adventure models are exactly the same in engine mapping, engine performance, gearing and wheel types.

There are no factory-fitted KTM options, everything is retrofitted at dealers. The windshield, seat and front mudguard are different on the two models but you can buy the part from the other model and swap it in (windshield is £70-80, seat is £120 and mudguard is £60).

The tubeless tyres are different brands, but my dealer is doing a free-of-charge swap of the Avon Trailride tyress from my 'non-R' for a set of Karoo 3 tyres from the 'R'.

The 'R' has an advanced Rally Mode option but you can add that to the 'non-R' model, either at the time of purchase or later.

So the ONLY permanent difference between the two bikes is the suspension; the 'non-R' has shorter, non-adjustable suspension and the 'R' has higher, adjustable suspension. And of course this affects the ground clearance and seat height.

Dakar rider Chris Birch describes the bike as a modern take on the old KTM 950 Super Enduro, but "with a lower seat height, all the electronics and good fuel range." The general opinion amongst test riders is that KTM has created a new category of adventure bikes and that even the standard 'non-R' model is superior off-tarmac to the Triumph Tiger 800 tiger, the BMW F850 GS and the Honda Africa Twin. On-tarmac might be a different story, so await road tests with more insight.

The 'non-R' is likely to be the better adventure tourer. Obviously someone over 1.85m (6') might go for the 'R' together with the optional higher seat purely for the legroom, but it seems there's a lot of shorter people out there who are planning to buy the 'R' even though the bike won't actually get to see the rough stuff that the suspension is intended for.

I've been following the reports from the press launch last week in the Erfoud/Merzouga area and the video linked below is the best I've seen with a lot of 'insider insights'.

same engine and leaking oil pretty common :(

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C_JEG2g7C3o

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Guti36BZI0o

An oil leak there is not uncommon on any KTM and is an easy fix... If you slide off the front sprocket there is a bushing behind it that rides against the outer counter shaft seal, this bushing can be easily slid off by hand.. Between this bushing and the countershaft bearing is a 25mm x 2mm o-ring {maybe bigger on the new bikes} that seals the inner countershaft.. So it works like this, the o-ring goes against the counterbearing, then the bushing pushes against the o-ring sealing the oil from getting through from inside the bearing.. The outside of this bushing seals against the case seal keeping oil from escaping out side the countershaft.. In order to seal the O-ring to the inside of the bushing the countershaft bolt/nut has to be correctly tensioned to hold pressure against the works.. The whole idea of this design is that instead of the case seal cutting a groove and wearing the expensive countershaft, it instead wears out the easily replaced inexpensive bushing sleeve... The o-ring is pretty much the only thing that will fail in this system and is easy to replace... Running a too tight of chain is one of the biggest reason that the little o-ring fails in the first place... As the suspension compresses to mid travel the distance from the countershaft to rear sprockets gets farther apart causing a snug chain to become tighter causing bind on the countershaft as to where it pinches and shags the o-ring.. When we have a group of riders parked around I will usually take a walk around to look at the bikes and often will spot at least a couple bikes where I recommend the owner add some slack to the chain.. I see bikes come out of dealer service with the chains to tight.. On my bike the same O-ring that fits behind the countershaft bushing also fits the clutch slave cylinder so I carry a couple on each trip to perform double duty, though I never remember having to change one in the field.. I put on a new countershaft O-ring seal every time I change out a worn countershaft sprocket, seems to be a good practice as the seal seems to hold for the life of the sprocket..

damn, I sat today on 790R and it's so wide in the bottom because of that tank it will be hard to fit between 2 pines in woods tight trails :(
don't like that design.

Wider than your knees or the bars?

no, not wider then bars :)
wider then your knees but at the level of your ankles...
Bars you can turn and fit into very narrow area but not so much with that tank.

here is example on my yesterday's ride, I wouldn't rather get through on 790 here:

https://i.imgur.com/xfUh3zp.jpg

end problems have started...

That video is bullshit, groundless scaremongering about Chinese build (that hasn't even started) and a few gripes lifted straight off Facebook. If you took any new bike you'd get worse than that.

took a look at the front of this bike without factory skid plate,
and didn't like what I saw. Straight in front, down low fuel line connecting those two part of the tank, inches from the ground and front wheel. When you hit there on the rock with that thin skid plate you can have a big problem, not to mention fuel pump which is on the left side of this tank on the very bottom...
doh

I had finally opportunity to test this 790 adventure bike today and I agree what you said above. KTM 790 engine is a street bike engine tuned down a bit but for me there is not enough torque. Even my nc750x had more low down torque, at least it felt like. For those riding mostly street that maybe OK but not for me so looking forward new 1090R. BTW it's hard to grip this widening tank with your knees, weird feeling plus wind screen pretty bad for my height 6.1".

It seems KTM have worked hard to provide unacceptable buffeting for riders of all heights on both the R and S models. Am awaiting third party offerings (Puig's is far too high) and in the meantime am running with a clip-on deflector. Apart from that, very pleased with the bike.

I'm quite happy with the Puig spoiler on my 790 Adventure R, windshield in high position, spoiler in low position. I'm 175 cm.

Many of those who have bought the 'R' model of the 790 Adventure seem to view the lower 'S' model as a crippled version, yet it still has 200/200mm suspension and in my opinion makes a perfect dual sport adventure bike.

This video is Bret Tkacs' take on the model.

Good video link there Tim, I must say the non 'R' version of the 790 Adventure does tick all the boxes as my next bike, I was thinking of a Tiger 800xca, but the KTM looks like a much lighter and more dirt worthy travel bike. I might give it a couple of years for the bugs to be ironed out first :)