Lessons in OIL PRESSURE (or how to weld camshaft to head)
 

Another lesson in mechanics, brought to you by XT GIRL :D:D

Some pictures of why I'm stuck in Maroc at the moment, waiting for the friendly fedex guy, to deliver me some spare parts.

As part of my trip prep, I installed an oil temperature guage, thinking I'm safe if I keep an eye on that - knowing that the 1VJ has issues with overheating.

I rode a couple of hundred kms in searing heat, as high as 43°C - but my oil temperature stayed at a happy running level.

Then, suddenly, bike started running ratty. Then ground to a halt.

I opened the valve covers first, and immediately saw that it was HORRIFYINGLY dry and sticky in there.

Picture shows what I found, when I opened it up.

REASON:

Oil pressure / temperture was enough to lubricate engine and keep it cool, but just not enough to push oil up into head cover for cam shaft lubrication.

LESSONS LEARNT:

1. Change oil to higher temperature grade when you're doing hot riding... (duh!)

2. In very hot riding CHECK OIL PRESSURE periodically!


>>PICTURE: There were lots and lots of sparkly bits... mixed with sticky bits and pretty little grooves and ridges where once, a smooth camshaft laid<<

http://xtgirls.co.uk/images/cam-shaft.jpg

OHHH NOOOOO !!!! Nasty !!!!

And the oil pressure light didnt come on ??

What oil were you using ?

Was there enough oil in the bike ? You sure ? lol


Looks like you didn't have enough oil in the engine or the oil pump failed ! Unless you were running chip fat for oil, any modern oil should of put up with those temperatures. How old was the oil ????

The damage in those pictures looks more serious than bad oil. Maybe the feeder is blocked.

Was your timing ok ?? Another possible cause could be that your camshaft clamps were loose allowing lateral movement.

But , as you say it it was dry and sticky in there, oil feed seems to be the problem.



What spare parts are you having shipped in ???????

Ted

what disaster ...
 

XTG, sorry to hear about your woes - hope you get the parts (new head & cover & camshaft? - ouch) quickly.

Actually, I cannot confirm your diagnosis that heat impedes the flow to the head. Actually, heat makes oil thinner so pumping it up should have been easier. I suggest a couple of things to tick off:
1. Enough oil in the bike?
2. Did you replace the oil pump for new when overhauling the engine? If not, does it work correctly? Upgrade to later model (3AJ) pump is recommended.
3. Might be that somewhere the circuit is blocked - suction filter in the oil tank, checkvalve at pump outlet (clutch cover), suction filter return pump (in the engine, can only be checked with engine apart)
4. I assume you took the engine out of the frame to work on it - how did you prime the oil pump? If not at all, that might explain the damage.
5. How did the camshaft bearing surfaces look when you took the engine apart at home? If they were already bad then, this might just be a development of that wear.
6. The oil flows through the camshaft to lubricate it's bearing surfaces, rockers, etc. Is there a leak somewhere there so that the oil circulates but not passing by the locations that should be lubricated?
7. How does cilinder and piston look like? Still ok?

I would suggest to get to the root of the problem before you even attempt to start it again with new parts - as you risk damaging them immediately.

Good luck!
Auke

Your mechanical knowledge (or lack of it) scares the hell out of me!!!

PM me if you are struggling to get a new head. I may have one tucked away somewhere...

Sorry about the bad luck.
Auke's got it right, IMO. Either the oil pump was not pumping (never primed properly) or an oil passage is somehow blocked.
I'm sure you had oil in the bike cause I know you know enough to make sure of that.

What should have been done on the rebuild would have been to run the motor with valve covers OFF to make sure oil was being pumped up into valve gear/top end. Checking oil pressure will also be important to ensure pump is at 100%. :scooter:

One minor problem that can be overcome!!!keep going for it and don,t let anyone get you down..:clap:

guys wait till you see my pics of my stator melt down wayyy worse.

Wow.. not pretty....

Auke/Mickey.. How would one prime the oil pump?? And when? Only after rebuilds?

After a rebuild, easiest way is to fill the bike up with oil and turn it over by hand or kicker (ignition off) until the jets start flowing with oil... best done with the rocker cover off so you can see it. Some people do it with a few taps of the starter.

Theres also a breather on top of the oil filter cover which should be bled using the same method. If the filter hole is weeping oil, then you "should" be ok at the top.

You cant realistically check the flow at the top end after oil changes so just bleed it at the filter and check the oil levels.

If you think you need to bleed prime your pump, at least pull the valve inspection caps off and check the top end is nice and wet before heading into the sunset..

priming the pump
 

By kickstarting or using the starter will not work. On the older XT / Tenere models the suction hose from oil tank to pump inlet is simply too long. My approach is as follows:
1. When reassembling the engine, leave clutch off.
2. When engine is installed in the frame, do not tighten the bolts on the flange of the hose
3. Pour oil into oiltank
4. Wait till oil appears at the flange (this is called leaking)
5. Tighten flange bolts
6. Turn oil pump by hand (in the correct direction ...) till oil comes out of the discharge hole. Pump is now primed (the oil has passed the pump, no air in suction line)
7. Assemble clutch and r/h cover.
8. Pray and start.
9. Only when engine has caught loosen the deaeration screw on the oil filter, let out the air till oil shows
10. Ride ....

This operation is only necessary when the suction hose has been emptied, so not needed after a normal oil change.

Auke

PS - I learned the hard way ....

I especially like number 8 !! :)

I have no personal experience with the pump in these models. It's strange to think the pump is so difficult to prime. Won't the pump pick up after sufficient, constant cranking ?? Even if the pickup hose is very long, as long as there is more sucking than escape, the pump will eventually fill and the filter hole will bleed.. ???????

hello XT Girl
 

Huuu,

this looks bad.

I have ridden an 1VJ Tenere around the world for 6,5 years - it had about 270.000 km on the odometer when I returned to Germany.

I have used all kinds of oil, even single grades, and I can tell you that this was not caused by the kind of oil you used - there was no oil in the head.

Mine got sometimes so hot, that I could not ride it anymore because the clutch would not work any longer - but I never had this kind of damage.

The Tenere is a fantastic bike, but you have to know what you are doing.

What Aukeboss and the others have said is correct.

I changed my oilpump every 50.000 to 70.000 km for a new one (3AJ model). But I was sponsored by Yamaha Japan and Kedo Germany.

It is now time for you to learn more about the bike, ask questions here and we will tell you all you need to know. Take the oilpump out and check it (how to do check it, is written in the manuel).

All the best and enjoy

Mika from Switzerland

It's the 'sufficient cranking' that does it here. The suction hose is (apparently) so long that 'sufficient' is measured in hours ... As opposed to for instance the newer XT's with oil in the frame and the TTRs, where it is much easier to get the oilpump primed, as the suction line is much shorter.

Believe me , I learned the hard way.

Auke

newbie question.......what oil temperature should the xt6e run at ?

My il temp gauge gets in the red at 120 celcius.

But ive seen small cars that have the red area at 140 celcius.

With interstateruns in the summer, mine climbs to 120, it should be easely capable of that.

My temp gauge, recently installed, reached 100'c last week.....had me nervous considering this thread and then the wording on the site where I bought it.

MOTO-DETAIL Motorcycle Oil Temperature Gauge

Thanks

Well, mine has almost 80.000km on it with the engine untouched, and still going strong. :thumbup1:

The 1990 manual (my bike is a '03) says to change oil every 10.000km, and thats with pre 1990 grade oil, now were 20 years later, with better oil, and i still change 2-3 times as often as i should.

What they say in the link is, that you shouldn't push the bike to much, before the oil is 80 degrees hot. Nothing about how hot is allowed to get.

my gsxr is oil cooled and the oil gets very hot as it is spayed onto the cylinder head i did 420 miles the other day in hot weather and the oil was still doing its job just fine :thumbup1:

xtgirls bike suffered from oil starvation more than likely caused by a blocked oilway from using too much or the wrong sealant during the last engine rebuild :(

Mine frequently ran at 120-140c in summer traffic etc !!

No problem at all with modern semi synth oils.