XT600E 2002 Engine Oil
 

Hey guys....in Rabat and about to do an oil change but getting conflicting opinions from fellow overlanders. Please can someone tell me what oil I should put in. Synthetica/ semi synthetic 15/ 40...50 etc.

Any prompt replies would be greatly appreciated.

Cheers!

The great oil debate!
 

I've had this discussion so many times. Everyone seems to have a different opinion. Here's mine (based on a lot of reading and discussions over the years and running a number of XT600s over many tens of thousands of miles)

Synthetic is at best a waste of money and unless it is motorcycle specific you risk clutch slipping problems.

I've used semi synthetic or synthetic fortified for many tens of thousands of miles no problem.

If you're going to experience temps near zero degrees at any point, you should use 10W 40. Otherwise, 15 W 40 is probably better for higher temps.

Remember to measure the quantity your putting in carefully - you won't get the total quantity your putting in until the engine's run for a minute.

Mark

The manual says a Yamalube 4 20W/40 SE/SF or a 10W/30 SE/SF, but any motorcycle oil will do, the XT isn't fussy if you are stuck for choice, mine runs on a Halfords 10W/40 SL.

Use semi-synthetic.

I don't get a good reading of oil level easily on my 4PT. I ride the bike round for five minutes, then come back and check the oil level is not overfilled. Then measure the quantity of oil drained, and refill with the same measured quantity of fresh oil, then ride round for 5 minutes before checking and topping up if necessary.

I run fullsynth all the time. 10w50, and 5w40 in the winther.

I've un a lot of different brands, witout problem.

Fullsynth is better for high temperatures, and it degrades slower than semi synth and dino oil.

Its a religion, luckily the xt ist fuzzy about using a specific oil.

Semi-synthetic
 

I concurr with Mark. Do not use Fully synthetic oil, use semi.

Synthetic buggers up the clutch.

When I couldn't get hold of a motorcycle oil abroad I used car multigrade on my XT. As long as its got the right numbers and letters it'll be fine.

Any old oil is better than none at all!

Dan

My reason for using semi, not synth, is that the synth is known to cause clutch slip in some bikes, with some oils, and the semi isn't.

If you know your bike has no problems running on any synth, or on a particular synth which you can always get you hands on, then there's no reason not to use it.

If you don't know that and you're in a place with a limited choice, then a semi is the safe choice.

If the only bike shop in town only has synth in stock, then use it. It will probably be fine, but if it does cause clutch slip that is nothing you can't live with for a few days until you find another oil.

Semi does degrade quicker, but so long as you change the oil at the correct intervals, this shouldn't be an issue.

The point of this post is to assist the OP in making a decision, the OP is never going to get universal agreement and a firm answer from a forum, but if people post their reasoning, at least then the OP can read it and decide for themselves what they agree with.

You know that semi synth is a mix of "real" synth and dino oil right? For me that would be like taking my favorite beer, and mix a cupful of bud light in it :nono:

Google "oil myth" or something like that. Fullsynth is better on the paper. If youre bike dont like, fine. But that doesnt meen everybody else cant use it.

As to the clutch, I've got over 96.000km on totally stock and unopened engine, so it cant be totally bad, huh? :)

The main reason for me to run what i consider "the best" type of oil, is that I know its the most capable of handling high heat, which you can/will find in an aircooled engine. The 2nd most important thing for me, is that it takes longer to degrade.

I still change often, oil is cheap. A few extra bucks at the end of the year, saved by using what I consider a lesser oil, do me no good if my engine is blown. It would really suck for me to have any type of engine malfuction, it would have me wondering if a better oil could have done something about it.

I use the bike as my dayly commute, and for enduro-ish type of riding. I need it to be reliable.

Yes I am aware that semi-synthetic oil is basically mineral oil with additives.

I can only speak from experience and from others whom I know personally, who have a vast experience of bikes and particularly XT's, and who I trust and respect have told me.

Synthetic oil can penetrate the clutch plates and cause them to slip.

Semi-synthetic oil has been treated to give the molecules longer chains so that they take longer to break down.

Mineral oil is fine but you have to change it more often.

I have worked as a Motorcycle courier in London, quite hard word for an engine and I used bog standard mineral M/c oil but changed it every 500 miles.

When I couldn't get hold of bike oil I have used car multigrade.

My bikes are all fine. If you find that your bike runs on Synthetic oil then use it, but I wouldn't put it in mine. Unless there was nothing else! Any oil is better than none.

Dan

Good post, I think we agree that its religion, and not every bike likes the same oil.

We should just make a poll, and refer to this thread for future use =)

I agree do NOT waste money on expensive synthetic oil. ANY good quality MOTORCYCLE oil is just fine including plain mineral oil. What is most important is regular oil changes - the more the better for the engine.

Mine get oil changes at 1,000 miles. Oil is quite cheap compared to fuel...

I put Semi-Synthetic in mine because I got a good deal. It was German made stuff. If it's good enough for the krouts it's good enough for me bearing in mind they are by far (in my opinion anyway) the worlds best engineers.

I have known of people who put car engine oil into their bikes with dire consequences - Don't do this unless in an emergency to get out of a temporary fix. Put the right stuff in at the earliest opertunity afterwards.

With an XT is always best to keep it simple - just like the bike.

Heh a friend of mine runss car oil in his suped up 1980-something xt600, with high compression piston,another camshaft and pumper carb. It pulls like no other xt. So, it can be done (I wouldnt, but still, some have had no problems)

The manual calls for oilchange at 6000km (4000 miles ish) and that was in 1990, with whatever oil was on the market back then, a good 20 years ago.

It seems funny that fullsynth is "too good" but then you change oil at 4 times the rate :confused1: If you have full confidence using the oil you use, why change it so often, what do you expect to gain?

One would think that with the interval they wrote in the manual, they would be übercautios about the intervals, to avoid lawsuits and broken down bikes all over the world.

I know that my bike doesnt set the example of every bike out there, but its closing in on 100k km. If I vere to change oil at every 1000miles I could have bought a spare bike by now, if I instead changed at 6000km.

I do hovever change the oil at smaller intervals that the manual calls for, but not anywhere 1000miles, seems crazy to me.

For comparison: KTM 450exc have 15 hours serveinterval at race conditions, thats 15 hours of just over 100km/h. So youre close to ktm race engine serviceintervals, and they only have around 1,2ltr of oil, and puts out way more power than our engines.

I know I know, we agree to disagree, would just love to hear some of the thoughts behind the obsessive oilchanges.

Thx for a good dialog so far to everyone. :thumbup1:

I'm sure you're right, 1000 mile oil changes aren't really needed at all.

For someone without much technical knowledge of engines in general I remember my regular trusted bike mechanic (my best mate) telling me "the more often you change the oil, the better it is for the engine and it's likely to last longer". I have never forget that and therefore this is the reason why I do an oil change at 1,000 miles.

Personally I'd imagine it mainly depends on the environment the bike is ridden and the manner in which it's ridden.

I just err on the side of caution (plus I can afford to waste a bit of money). My XT's are afterall my babies and I love to pamper them. Neither gets much mud on it now and I never ride them when it's raining. I use the XBR500 in the winter months (when it's not too cold and my back allows).

Yes I know I'm a bit delicate these days.... My days of touring are at an end following a serious spinal injuy in 2003. My last long (medium) distance tour was Spain in 2002. I did once ride to Moscow in the 1990's and I have ridden throughout Africa too (most countries there). I dream of touring Russia on my XT's every night.... It's better than taking Propofol. :smartass: and not so ruinous to your health...

I'm 48 year old "armchair expert" now (knackered/worn out ex bike cop) and freely admit to it..... lol

All the very best Jens. I always enjoy reading your posts...

Cheers guys!

Im now in Bamako, Mali, 3100miles down the road from Rabat and about to do my 2nd oil change. There is a limited choice here, the Total garage has 3 options:

1. Total Quartz 5000 20w50
2. Total Quartz 7000 15w50
3. Total Quartz 9000 5w40

I am leaning towards option 2 (7000). A fellow rider said the oil must say JASO MA on the bottle as this implies no clutch slip. None of these options has that code. Is this an issue or is that non-slip code rubbish?

Thanks for the prior discussion

Ah....JASO =Japanese Automotive Standards Ogranisation while API = American Petroleum Institute, so just different ratings. API have the S.. (sl) rating which is for Petrol engines and the C..(ce) which are for diesel engines. JASO break theirs into MA for a wet clutch and MB which is for dry clutch.

How do I know on the API rating whether my clutch will slip or not, or is it basically there is more chance of my clutch slipping on synthetic oil than semi synthetic and least possibility on Mineral?

Thanks again.

Well you've said it already in your post above and the religion hasn't changed since the posts of the last 3 weeks. Personally, I don't use synthetic oil in bike engines, for the reasons given in the earlier posts.

Anyway, what did you put in the engine last time around?
For the numbers either side of the "w" in the oil designation, the lower numbers are suited to colder weather, including freezing conditions, and the higher range of numbers are for hot conditions. So, your inclination to use your option 2 looks like a good bet.

If you have no alternatives this stuff will have to suffice.

I did a bit of research here -

http://www.lubadmin.com/upload/produ...ng_29/5483.pdf
http://www.lubadmin.com/upload/produ...ang_1/1170.pdf

http://www.lubadmin.com/upload/produ...ng_29/5487.pdf
http://www.lubadmin.com/upload/produ...ang_1/1172.pdf

Seems this stuff is Premium high performance multigrade oil for passenger CAR engines. I suppose it's better using this car oil than dirty knackered worn out proper bike oil.

I'd change it as soon as you can but in the meantime I'd imagine it will work OK. In a high temperture environment you will need a higher rating.

Stay safe.

4PT XT600E & XT500E engine oil. From Owners Manual
 

I think most of this has been covered in the posts above. However I thought I might post this from a 2002 4PT-28199-E7, XT600E & XT500E Owners manual. Hope this helps :thumbup1:

–20° –10° 0° 10° 20° 30° 40° 50°C
___________
Engine oil type
SAE 10W/30 = -10C to 30C+
_______________
SAE 10W/40 = -10C to 40C+
_____________
SAE 15W/40 _= 0C to 40C+
____________
SAE 20W/40 = 0/10C to 40C+
__________________
SAE 20W/50 = 0/10C to 50C+


API Service SE, SF, SG type or higher

Recommended engine oil classification
CAUTION

Be sure to use motor oils that do not contain anti-friction
modifiers. Passenger car motor oils (often labeled
“ENERGY CONSERVING II”) contain anti-friction additives
which will cause clutch and/or starter clutch slippage, resulting
in reduced component life and poor engine performance.
Capacity
Without oil filter element
replacement 2.7 L
With oil filter element
replaced 2.8 L
Total amount (dry engine) 3.3 L



Engine oil • Change. EVERY X1,000 = 10, 20, 30Km and or every year, if below recomended oil change period.
• Check oil level and vehicle for oil leakage.

The intervals given in the periodic
maintenance and lubrication chart
should be simply considered as a
general guide under normal riding
conditions. However, DEPENDING
ON THE WEATHER, TERRAIN,
GEOGRAPHICAL LOCATION, AND
INDIVIDUAL USE, THE MAINTENANCE
INTERVALS MAY NEED TO
BE SHORTENED.

Engine oil and oil filter
element
Engine oil and oil filter element
The engine oil level should be
checked before each ride. In addition,
the oil must be changed and the oil
filter element replaced at the intervals
specified in the periodic maintenance
and lubrication chart.
To check the engine oil level
1. Place the motorcycle on a level
surface and hold it in an upright
position.

NOTE:
Make sure that the motorcycle is
positioned straight up when checking
the oil level. A slight tilt to the side
can result in a false reading.

2. Remove the oil filler cap cover by
removing the screw.

3. Start the engine, warm it up for
at least 10 seconds, and then
turn it off.

4. Wait a few minutes until the oil
settles, remove the oil filler cap,
wipe the dipstick clean, insert it
back into the oil filler hole (without
screwing it in), and then
remove it again to check the oil
level.


NOTE:
The engine oil should be between the
minimum and maximum level marks.


CAUTION
Do not operate the motorcycle
until you know that the engine oil
level is sufficient.


WARNING
Never remove the engine oil tank
cap after high-speed operation,
otherwise hot engine oil could
spout out and cause damage or
injury. Always let the engine oil
cool down sufficiently before
removing the oil tank cap.


5. If the engine oil is below the minimum
level mark, add sufficient
oil of the recommended type to
raise it to the correct level.


6. Install the oil filler cap and the oil
filler cap cover.


To change the engine oil (with or
without oil filter element replacement)

1. Start the engine, warm it up for
several minutes, and then turn it
off.

2. Place an oil pan under the
engine to collect the used oil.

3. Remove the oil filler cap cover,
the oil filler cap and the drain
bolts to drain the oil from the
crankcase and oil tank.

4. Check the washers for damage
and replace them if necessary.


NOTE:
Skip steps 5–8 if the oil filter element
is not being replaced.


5. Remove the oil filter element
cover by removing the bolts.

NOTE:
The oil filter element cover is secured
by two bolts and a drain bolt. First,
remove the drain bolt to drain the oil
filter element cavity.

6. Remove and replace the oil filter
element.


7. Check the O-rings for damage
and replace them if necessary.


8. Install the oil filter element cover
by installing the bolts, then tightening
them to the specified torque.

NOTE:
Make sure that the O-ring is properly
seated.
Tightening torque:
Oil filter element cover bolt:
10 Nm (1.0 m0kgf)


9. Install the engine oil drain bolts,
and then tighten them to the
specified torques.


Tightening torques:
Engine oil drain bolt
(crankcase):
30 Nm (3.0 m0kgf)
Engine oil drain bolt (oil tank):
18 Nm (1.8 m0kgf)


10. Add the specified amount of the
recommended engine oil, install
and tighten the oil filler cap, and
then install the oil filler cap cover.

Caution
* In order to prevent clutch slippage
(since the engine oil also
lubricates the clutch), do not
mix any chemical additives
with the oil or use oils of grade
“CD” or higher. In addition, do
not use oils labeled “ENERGY
CONSERVING II” or higher.
* Make sure that no foreign
material enters the crankcase.

Recommended engine oil:
See above.
Oil quantity:
Without oil filter element
replacement:
2.7 L
With oil filter element
replacement:
2.8 L
Total amount (dry engine):
3.3 L

11. Remove the air bleed screw, and
then start the engine. If oil does
not seep out of the hole after a
few minutes, immediately stop
the engine and have a Yamaha
dealer check for the cause. If oil
seeps out of the hole, turn the

engine off and install the air bleed screw.

12. Start the engine, and then let it
idle for several minutes while
checking it for oil leakage. If oil is
leaking, immediately turn the
engine off and check for the
cause.
13. Turn the engine off, and then
check the oil level and correct it if

necessary.

Oil done, if this is your XT (4PT oil quantitys included here) Check quantites for your model.

Go ride! :mchappy:

PS not sure if a mod would prefer this in another section!?