Would love to, but:

1. I don't want to carry a laptop. How do I upload gpx information and POIs to OpenStreetMap? (remember OSM accepts timestamped GPXs only, which means only the active log gpx can be accepted. I cannot find this in my memory card (using Garmin 60CSx), and obviously installing MapSource in every Internet Cafe I go to is not an option.

2. Say I find an Internet Cafe twice a week. The track log will have recorded hundreds/thousands of km of routes, of different types, from highways to dirt tracks. Am I polluting the data of OSM if I just upload the entire track and tell it to auto-convert it to "ways"? Or do I have to do the impossible and re-trace every part of the track and manually tag it per highway/road/path type?

I am using the free OSM maps (have got SmellyBikers with me as well but haven't used them yet) and I'm going through a lot of uncharted territory and it bothers me that I can't add this data to OSM... but I don't know the solutions to the two issues above. Any suggestions appreciated!

Alexandros

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2011-2012: 5 months in Chile
2009-2010: 5 months in Turkey-Iran-Pakistan-India

When I put my Garmin 60Cx into Mass Storage mode (which might require the USB drivers being installed) I get a gpx file per day which look like:

<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8" standalone="no" ?>
<gpx xmlns="http://www.topografix.com/GPX/1/1" creator="" version="1.1" xmlns:xsi="http://www.w3.org/2001/XMLSchema-instance" xsi:schemaLocation="http://www.topografix.com/GPX/1/1 http://www.topografix.com/GPX/1/1/gpx.xsd">
<trk>
<name>ACTIVE LOG154431</name>
<trkseg>
<trkpt lat="50.956967" lon="2.230920">
<ele>4.356</ele>
<time>2009-09-16T13:44:29Z</time>
</trkpt>
</trkseg>
</trk>
<trk>
<name>ACTIVE LOG155220</name>
<trkseg>
<trkpt lat="50.956921" lon="2.230905">
<ele>0.857</ele>
<time>2009-09-16T13:52:18Z</time>
</trkpt>


which seems to be perfectly well timestamped.

Other than via MapSource, I'm not sure how you access the "active" log or even what the active log represents. It seems to be the last few entries/days.

The quote from the OSM FAQ is

Your GPX should consist of trackpoints with valid timestamps. The ele(vation) tag is optional and will default to 0. Note if using a Garmin GPS device: Many of these units have the facility to save the track that strips out the timestamps.

I seem to have timestamps in mine -- though I've not tried uploading them to OSM. The proof is in the pudding.

It would be best if you go back an relabel things but knowing the track exists at all when you're in the boonies is a good thing (thinking back to the R704 across the Atlas mountains).

How often you would have to upload these files depends on how big the data card in your GPS is. I've had a couple of months worths of logs with no signs of the card becoming full (despite having large tracts of street level Europe mapping on it).

Cheers,

Ian

The active logs are stored in the unit's internal memory, so you won't see them on the mem card. Go to the main menu, then Tracks > Setup > Data Card Setup > check box "Log Track to Data Card". Go back to the previous screen and set Interval to "Most often". Also, you must turn off locking to roads: Setup > Map > General > "Lock On Road" > Off. Now you will have one .gpx file per day on your card.

An alternative to Mapsource is EasyGPS. It won't display any maps, but does allow you to edit your tracks. You install it to a USB stick and you can run it from there, or even from your GPS (either from the card plugged into a reader or from mass storage mode).

You can upload your GPS tracks to OSM any which way you like, but of course it's nicer to edit them as much as possible before. You shouldn't, however, just convert them to ways. Leave that to people who edit the maps. You should only convert tracks that have been properly edited.

You should try the Wanderlust maps, I think you will find quite a lot of detail there. You can also contribute to that project and Bob tells me he is about to launch some cool stuff to make it easier for people.

Bob has travelled in your area and probably has mapped a lot of places where you want to go.

Cheers,
Peter.

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Cheers,
Peter.

Europe to NZ 2006-10

I have had a Magellan Crossover for over 2 years and found it great for "Downunder" but I am finding it difficult to find SE Asia maps or anywhere else other than the US, Can or Alaska. Has anyone else got maps for a Magellan for SE Asia?

Garmin 60Csx - it's robust, long battery life (you can run out of electricity in the middle of nowhere), a lot of commercial and free maps, useful electronic compass and barometric sensor (speed and distance is measured more precisely and you can check your route profile back home). Polish Mountain Rescue Service uses this model.

I tested it in India and SE Asia. Maps were good. 60Csx looks like an old mobile so you do not have to worry about thieves

I think Zumo for Europe, USA and Japan & 60csx for the rest.

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Cheers!
Arthur

Dont count on getting much utility (usefullness) from Smelly Bikers maps. Its VERY inaccurate, and you are just as well off with Garmin world map. None of the roads and tracks on Smelly Bikers maps in areas I went thru last year (central Asia, Mongolia and Siberia) were even CLOSE to being accurate, nor were they any more detailed than Garmin World Map that I also had with me. At maximum resolution, the only stuff i could see that was more detailed than Garmins world map, was the rivers. Smelly Bikers had much more watercourse detail, and curiously, identical road details. The additional river detail added nothing to my navigation and was often an annoying distraction dominating my screen.

I have recently discovered the OSM stuff and have contributed a couple of tracks. I think this is much more useful because they are real tracks people have made. The Smelly Biker stuff is just scanned maps from what I can tell. Even the main highway across Siberia is nowhere near accurate and hundreds of people record that track every year. So you would think it should be spot on.

I was quite disillusioned with the maps to be honest. In fact, I would have been disappointed if they were free. I had wrongly assumed they were collated tracks of peoples travels, but they arent. ...and OSM actually is.

I will use OSM in future.

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Hard to go past Garmin ... they are the most compatible with various forms of customised data, and the easiest to find maps for.

I like to see the maps while riding so small screens like the 60CSx are no good for me. Fine if you are on foot, but doing 100km/h down a dusty bumpy road, you will not be able to read it. I have ridden with guys who have a 60csx and they always have to stop or slow right down to read it and manouevre the small buttons and controls on it with riding gloves. A bigger screen and bigger buttons comes in very handy - so you can read the maps, town names and control the unit while riding. Similarly a touchscreen allows you to scroll thru maps more easily while riding. Thats at least what the Zumo does. The 400, 450, 500 and 550 all have a screen twice as large and with twice as many pixels as the 60CSx, large buttons for gloved fingers and a touchscreen. The flipside is the Zumos are 25% heavier and more expensive.

I dont have any experience with the new 660 Zumo, but they have a considerably larger screen yet are lighter than the 400-550 Zumos.

I was surprised what the Garmin units still cant do. They have a very limited ability to plot predetermined routes into the unit. They have pitiful internal memories, and in many ways I have been disappointed with how they perform. But they are much more durable and rugged than any other brand out there and on a long bike trip, that counts for a lot. If there is one thing I was impressed with the Zumos, its how durable they are.

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ive got a zumo and its excellent, i use it all the time.

saying that, since ive been using it my sense of direction is rubbish and i dont know where i am half the time. im not sure all these routable maps are needed, we did ok with paper not so long ago? and who doesnt agree its more fun to use a paper map or atlas when planning/dreaming a trip?

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dave

What would be wrong in using a Garmin NUVI 765wt inside a tank bag and connecting it to a headset? would this work because if so it would be very Cost effective ( leastwise for Europe)

+1

Only times I use a GPS without feeling like a wuss are:

1) Exploring off-road - if it all goes pear-shaped I need to know exactly how to get back to civilization. Now I just turn on track logging and I'm off, having a "just in case" safeguard.

2) In big cities (eg Mumbai) where you're looking for a needle in a haystack. Without a GPS and maps with street-level information one can waste hours going round and round in dangerous traffic.

In general I also find the GPS useful for note-keeping, recording POIs you don't want to spend hours finding next time etc. And contributing back to the OSM maps that have gotten me out of a pickle many times.

For regular traveling (cross-country open roads), it's not bad to stop and ask if in doubt - also helps you meet the locals which is invariably a positive experience.

-A

__________________
2011-2012: 5 months in Chile
2009-2010: 5 months in Turkey-Iran-Pakistan-India

Colebatch, You're assuming someone has already sent Bob those tracks- but what if they have not and he has no data?
Bob works hard on his Wanderlust world-wide map compiling project- you must rememeber that it is dependant on individuals sending him their own tracks-
In some places there is a huge amount of information, right down to street level details (such as in B. Ayres etc) and in others, where no one has either been/and/ or sent their tracks in, there will be little or no information. It is a very big planet!

I am guessing that the areas you mention are more off the beaten track Colebatch than others.

I hope you will not mind my making a constructive suggestion? could you get in touch with Bob and send him your tracks-- From what you say, you are obviously very knowledgeable about those areas and many Hubbers and others would benefit from your tracks contribution.

Thanks in advance in the hope that you will be willing to share and do so

The reason why Wanderlust, Garmin, Google and others have identical data is that it's freely available somewhere.

You've got a point there, but so has Bert: just with OSM, Wanderlust needs people to contribute their data, so new maps can be made. This way, over time, these maps can be better and more up-to-date than anything that Garmin et al. can produce commercially (because they have to pay for the data).

Bob is working hard behind the scenes and there will be some very good maps coming out of that project (Wanderlust) very soon. I know, because I spent a year mapping Thailand for it.

Cheers,
Peter.

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Cheers,
Peter.

Europe to NZ 2006-10

guys, your points are well taken and i am happy to contribute to better and more accurate mapping. As mentioned I have contributed several tracks in mongolia to OSM where there didnt have any data, and I will be contributing more Siberian data in the coming months

But it remains an major issue that the OSM project offers a lot more detail at least in the areas that i have good knowledge of, pretty much 100% accuracy (since its all contributed tracks) and is free.

Being constructive, Bob should incorporate the OSM data into his own maps, amending his own routes where necessary (though this raises ethical questions whether he is entitled to take OSMs free data and then resell it.) There needs to be much better discrimination on Smelly Biker maps between major roads, middle roads and minor roads, and same discrimination with towns.

As much as i would like the smelly biker project to work, being by a fellow bike traveller and all, I found it unuseable and inaccurate, and it appears the OSM project is a long way ahead of bobs ... and as i said, is free.

I previously used Garmin World map, then bought Bobs maps, and took V1.60 and 2.03 with me on the last trip, tried one, tried the other, wasn't happy with either of his maps and went back to the Garmin product. So having paid $50, you might be able to understand I feel disappointed.

Bear in mind guys that the people who are disappointed here are not people whinging from the sidelines, they are people who have paid for the product. Its not like a KTM owner slagging off BMWs without ever having ridden one. Its people who believed in the product enough to shell out the money in the first place, who wanted to support a fellow biker, and then having got the product, find its not as good as (a) they felt it should be and (b) the competition ... when you combine that with the fact the competition is free ... its not a pretty overall picture.

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Wanderlust:
+ Purpose: To create maps for overlanders.
+ Editors: One
+ Map data contributors: A dozen?
+ Result: A proprietary product. It costs money, is only provided in one format, is only licensed for a single purpose and a single use.
+ Project viability: Dubious in the long term. It all depends on Bob being able & inclined to work on it. At some point someone will have to be found to continue his work.

(please correct me if I'm wrong on the above, this is just my understanding based on the information published on the Wanderlust website and threads on the HUBB)

OpenStreetMap:
+ Purpose: To map everything on the planet
+ Editors: Hundreds/thousands (everyone can be an editor, tools freely available)
+ Map data contributors: Thousands
+ Result: Free. It costs nothing, is provided in many formats, you can do ANYTHING you want with it.
+ Project viability: Good chances of long-term survival due to distributed nature. Not dependent on a single person.

http://www.openstreetmap.org/stats/data_stats.html for OSM statistics.

To me, OpenStreetMap.org is the wikipedia of mapping. It already offers excellent value to its users and is constantly being improved. I see no reason to spend time and effort working on* anything else.

Alexandros

* "working on": using, contributing to, paying for

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2011-2012: 5 months in Chile
2009-2010: 5 months in Turkey-Iran-Pakistan-India

Good man Colebatch I am sure Bob & many others will appreciate your sharing.

Apapadop - it's Bob's rice bowl and he does work on it daily just as HU is Grant's rice bowl. It's only fair they get paid for their hard work. I don't recall bmw offering free servicing! I understand your point of view; perhaps you should get in touch with Bob to discuss- I believe certain of your assumptions are incorrect - Bob is best placed to clarify. I've p.m'ed him.