Ok then. A few of us are out in Iraq at the minute and the daily subject seems to be what ride a few of us can do summer next year. This got us thinking about a few routes.

Initially it was through Spain to Morocco - Algeria - Tunisia - Sicily etc. But I then found out that you can not cross the border between Morocco and Algerian. We physically would not have time to head further south into Mauritania so that meant Africa at the moment is ruled out.

So today we came up with this.

Countries Travelled. England/ Belgium/ Holland/ Germany/ Czech repub/ Austria/ Slovakia/ Hungary/ Romania/ Bulgaria/ Turkey/ Kos/ Greece/ Italy/ Switzerland/ Germany/ Holland/ Belgium/ England

Numbers relate to days.

1. London - Gutersloh 397 miles
2. Gutersloh - Berlin - Prague 422 Miles
3. Prague - Vienna - Bratislava 243 miles
4. Bratislava - Budapest - Arad 297 Miles
5. Arad - Bucharest 337 Miles
6. Bucharest - Burgas 264 Miles
7. Burgas - Istanbul 220 Miles
8. istanbul - Bodrum :confused1: 516 miles
9. Bodrum - Kos - Athens Mainly ferry
10. Athans - Patras - Brindisy 132
11. Brindisy - Rome 335 Miles
12. Rome - Lake Como 410 Miles
13. Lake Como - San Benardino Pass - Stelvio Pass - 174
14. Stelvio - Frankfurt 384 Miles
15. Frankfurt - London 439 miles

There are some huge mileage days. to start with though London to Gutersloh. all motorway. Nothing To see really passing through. Gutersloh to Prague via Berlin. Again a fair old day but mainly motorway with good roads. Berlin is planned for a bit to eat and a few photos. The day that really concerns us the most is Istanbul to Bodrum although we could push on furthur than Istanbul. What are the roads like? Would this mileage be possible in Turkey? There is nothing we really want to see in Turkey. Its just a case of being that close we might as well cross the border.

Are there any problems getting into Turkey? How long does it usually take and are any extra documents required in relation to the bike?

If anyone has any pointers of roads. or places to go in any of the transiting countries then let me know. Any advice appreciated. As you can see this is mainly going to be a city tour although there will be some pretty spectacular roads coming through the north of Italy.

Furture rides will involve Africa - Sacndinava & Russia. Dont know why but there is just something that appeals to me in riding to Moscow. the strange thing is I had hardly any interest in travel before obtaining my licence. Now I cant get enough mile in.

Anyway enough waffle over to the pros

Hi Tomo

That's quite an ambitious schedule you have there. This is however the sort of planning I am always doing myself. I have toured Eastern Europe several times, and have just returned from a bike trip to Turkey, Greece and the Balkans. 4600 miles is do-able in 15 days but you'll be a bit knackered at the end of it. I typically have done 3500 to 4500 miles in 20 days on my previous tours.

North Africa: I should mention that, while I think the Moroccan-Algerian border is indeed closed, there is a ferry from Spain to Algeria (Almeria to Ghazouet? Can't remember). More research would be needed on carnets, ferries, visas and the like for Algeria. I worked in Algeria from 1996-99, and it isn't the safest place in the world, but I personally would be prepared to ride across the country, given a carefully chosen route and perhaps some, er, "tactical" riding. The remainder of a round-the-western Med route via Tuniusia, Sicily etc would not be a problem.

Back to your route. First, Berlin is quite a detour form your Gutersloh-Prague route. Might be better off going via Erfurt, Thuringer Wald and/or the western Czech spa towns instead? I think Berlin is a great place, but it's a long detour with lots of Autobahn.

I think the next part of your route from Prague to Bucharest is certainly do-able. Roads in Hungary are good, and they are not bad on the main routes in Romania, although there are too many psychopaths on the Romanian roads for my liking (they currently top my list of the worst drivers in Europe).

I haven't biked through Bulgaria (we went through the country a month ago on the "Serbian Prison Motorail Train", and I won't be doing that again...) However your Bulgarian mileages are not huge so I reckon you'll be OK. Road quality is however an unknown...

Turkish border: allow an hour or so to cross. You will need your original V5 for the bike. You can buy insurance at the border for I think 15 Euros (although my Carole Nash green card covered me), and you need to buy a visa for about 10 Euros, easily got at the border.

The motorway to Istanbul is a toll road but smooth & fast. Istanbul is now a HUGE city (bigger than London, it has over 11m people...) with HUGE traffic, so allow time to get through. Roads in Asian Turkey are relatively uncrowded, and we followed mainly dual carriageways around the south side of Marmara. There were no potholes but the roads were a bit "lumpy", you wouldn't want to do more than 70 mph, and I was glad I was on a GS and not a sportsbike. One thing to bear in mind is that Turkey, Greece and Albania are HOT in July/August; you would be tortured in full leathers (I wore Cordura), and I personally will only go biking down there again outside the high summer months. Note, fuel is currently expensive in Turkey, as are hotels in Istanbul.

Highlights of our trip were: Gallipoli battlefield tour; Lake Ohrid in Macedonia; Kotor and the huge cloverleaf-shaped fjord in Montenegro; Dubrovnik; Plitvicka lakes park in Croatia, and high passes in the Italian Alps. There are some pretty good roads in Macedonia, Slovenia and Croatia (away from the busy Adriatic coast road).

I am actually thinking of doing one of the following next summer in an attempt to do some touring without the extreme heat of the South:
(1) Scandinavia and the Baltic States, with a nip into Russia at St Petersburg and also Kaliningrad. I went round the Baltic back in 1994, it would be interesting to see how things haver changed. A Visa is required for Russia, a minor hassle.
(2) UK-Romania-Moldova (er, and Transdnistria) then into Ukraine hopefully as far as the Crimea, possibly returning via Belarus (if the Belarus visa is not too much hassle). I biked to Ukraine in 2005 and have been itching to get back since.

Cheers
Nigel

__________________
Moto ergo sum

it is about 328 miles per days. it is doable, however you wouldn't have time for sightseeing. you will just ride, find a hotel eat and sleep

have fun

__________________
ozhan u.
website under construction

I agree with ozhanu, it's possible, but you will be driving all the time. If that's want you want - fine!

You will be riding approx 1400 km in Turkey (870 mils), be aware that the top speed for motorbikes in Greece and Turkey is 70 km/h (80 km/h on Motorways)! Yes, it's km/h and not mls/h! If this is too slow for you, reserve some of your budget for the police in Turkey, because they will get you sooner or later.

You can do Istanbul-Bodrum in one day, getting up early. I spent a couple of days crossing Turkey and riding 800 -1100 km per day, but that's from dusk till dawn. However, I could not respect the speed limits, riding at 120/130 km/h .
If you enter Turkey at Edirne, this should be quick. I think you will need a green insurance card for the bike, but check this at your national automobile club.

Plan also some buffer for bad weather.
If some unforseen things happen, have a plan B ready. My suggestion is to carry along the departure schedule and telephone numbers of the ferries from Cesme-Ancona (Marmara Lines) and Greece to upper Italy, as well the timetable of the car trains from upper Italy to Western Germany (DB Autozug - Startseite). In case you would be in a massive hurry, you could speed up a bit.

Have fun!

Robert

I'd say i'm pretty similar to what others are saying. Is it do-able? Absolutely. I did right on 4000 over 17 days or so this summer. Did I get to somewhere I really wanted to get to (Romania) yes...

It's a hard call. A lot of people will say you are just going to ride all day, which is pretty much true, but if you REALLY want to see the place (e.g. Turkey), then maybe it's worthwhile. My trip paid off, as whilst I would have loved to spend more time in Crotaia, Montenegro, Bosnia, Serbia etc. I really did relish Romania and what I saw there. So if you are desparate for Turkey, that's your option, but beware that everywhere you go, you will probably wish you could stay longer (and you can't), and freeway riding does get very very boring after a few days. We limited to about 4 days on the trip where we did significant miles on freeways, and they were the least fun days by a long mile.

As others said as well, if you are going to places off motorway, cut your estimates in half. Lot's of traffic, low speed limits, lot's of crooked cops. It took about twice as long for us to cover our 'short' days (<150 miles) out in E. Europe than we expected.

We did a 500 mile day too, it was not fun!!!! Although the tasted great after that one

I agree with Graham. MRS.X and i did a huge mile trip over 20 days this summer. we did 2.5 days to Romania from the uk midlands and 3 on the way back and then low miles while in Romania.. But this was the plan. Suffer and see nothing to get to the "new" place. Enjoy as much as possible while there.

If you just want to ride and much and as far as possible.. i would say go for it. but remember you will see nothing and pay premium for hotels (as you will have little time to look and will be so tired that you will take the first one with good parking).

__________________
2000 Africa Twin
http://two-up-ona-twin.blogspot.com

Hi Tomo,
the roads in Bulgarian vary a great deal If you stick to the main roads, ie Ruse - Burgas - Lesovo, you will be ok. If you wander onto smaller roads you won't. The road out of the crossing area from Romania at Ruse is bad, but once you get out of the town it gets better. Beware of Bulgarian police with radar guns on their cars, hiding under bridges and in the shade of trees.
I would advise you to allow more time for crossing the border into Turkey. It is not unusual for it to take 2 - 3 hours.
If you want a different route through Romania, and who wouldn't, you could cut south-east across the country from Timisoara to Ruse, or go south from Timisoara to Calafat, where there is a ferry across the Danube, and then travel east across Bulgaria instead of Romania. Roads are better and much less traffic.
Finally, in answer to your comment about not wanting to stop and see anything in Turkey, just wait till you get there, you might change your mind. It's a great country.
Have a great time,
Regards,
Martin T. Jeffes
Sakar Hills Touring Park. (Home)
Harmanli
South Bulgaria

Hi UKTomo and assoc., has the proposed route changed at all? Just curious...