61 Series Sahara Manual with the 12HT motor!

It is easier to keep a vehicle with minimum electronics running for longer. All the electronic gizmos fail over time due to corrosion, gradual breakdown and increasing fragility of PVC or other plastic parts including the coating on all the (MILES) of wires themselves.
After all that, there remain all the mechanical failures that a vehicle with no electronics can also have. People seem to forget that, even with 5000 sensors, your chassis can still crack or a radiator hose can still burst etc etc.

If you buy a structurally and mechanically sound base vehicle such as an 80 series (running well and not rotten with rust, NOT necessarily mint) and throw 10k at restoring it, you will have a very tight vehicle indeed. 15k for a 100 series that cost 50k+ new means someone else already got 35K of use out of it, its far from new.

Its beyond me how you could spend 40k prepping a vehicle. Where are these people going, the moon??

With an 80 for example;
replace the rad, hoses, water pump and flush the cooling.
service the front and rear axles and the drive line.
service the engine.
put decent suspension on it.
put decent new tyres on it.
stick on some form of a bullbar (in case you hit wildlife/livestock).
throw a few jerrycans in the back for diesel and water.
Total cost of doing all this with proper Toyota parts except for the suspension, tyres and Bullbar, 5-7k. Labour, I would guess another 2/3k; but make sure whoever does it knows what they are doing.

Everything else is only toys: roof tents, shower systems, fridges, split charge systems, on board dvd player, built in hot tub!! ........
If you were on a bike you wouldn't have any of the above and you wouldn't die for the lack of them

When you look at these 40k spent vehicles, you wonder where the money was spent.... toys usually..... and then you wonder how much of the worthwhile stuff was done properly (use Toyota parts, NEVER rubbish pattern partsfor essential stuff, they are cheap for a reason usually)

Instead of paying someone to do all this, learn to do it yourself, even if you have to pay someone to teach you a bit of it. The factory service manuals are available for free in .pdf online, more basic manuals can be bought on amazon etc which will be easier for those with a non mechanical background (the FSM's assume you have a reasonable basic knowledge of mechanics). That way you'll know it was done right and if anything does break you;ll be able to diagnose the problem and most likely be confident fixing it.

All the above applies if you buy a 60 series and 80 series or even a 100 series. bi er

Oh and diesel, manual all the way.

Manual is one less thing to go wrong, diesel is cheaper to run.

But the 100 and I think the 105 have a weaker gearbox than the 80.

That is what I'm thinking at the moment....

Only concern is there's not many of the manuals out there in decent condition. Rarer than hen's teeth from what I can see.

Also interested in figuring out if petrol has any advantages over diesel either from the dirty/high-sulphur fuel in Asia/Africa perspective, or for owning it as a lifetime vehicle in Australia.

Understand it's more expensive in fuel costs, although also cheaper to buy, but what's the reality like in terms of reliability, fuel availability in remote areas, etc?

Manual, auto, or both?

And also, do any of the Aussie members have experience of running a UK sourced land cruiser? As that's where it'll be ending up for the rest of it's life after these trips.

I know Toyota have different specs for different markets.

Is there anything that's critically different?

What about insuring an import?

Parts availability/cost, etc?

Overseas I travel on 2 wheels, although a good friend in France sourced a 61 Series locally with the factory 12HT last year for 5000 Euro or so, he's one very happy boy.

Be ready to travel and wait to find the right car and know what you're looking at or have someone who knows look at the car before you buy. The least amount of electric accessories the less will go wrong. Find one with a bull bar and spotties if your lucky some of the 61 series came out with a factory PTO winch, nice ;-) Buy from an owner not a dealer if possible. Or importing a car from Japan is easy enough there a plenty of dealers in the UK doing it, MOT'd the lot. You will find the cars from Japan are mostly very well looked after, un abused, often fully optioned and with low K's / miles.

Look at, a car that is proven and will stand up to some punishment, the 61 series Turbo Diesel and the 80 series Turbo Diesel are awesome 4X4's. Simply add 33 inch tyres and alloy mags and go ;-) Regarding the 80 Series, I'd recommend putting free wheeling hubs in to save some fuel, tyres and transmission.

Auto is not my choice although there are plenty out there and I have not heard of many issues with the boxes. Mind you it will depend on what you tow and they are not quite as fuel efficient.

One thing with all of the Toyota diesels is the oil, it must be changed every 5000 Kilometres or so without fail, easy to do albeit expensive at 9 litres or so.

Parts are easy enough to source given the net these days, generic oil, fuel and air filters and plentiful and cheap, anything else just order online or source through you local 4X4 clubs or wreckers.

The 2 models or variations I'd look at are;

1990 Toyota Landcruiser Sahara HJ61RG

1992 Toyota Landcruiser Sahara HDJ80R

Good luck, Cheers Dave

Hi,

Permanently importing any Land Cruiser made after 1988 into Australia is virtually impossible unless you can prove you have owned it for more than a year overseas and you have Australian residency granted before it arrives. However, with the impending death of the Australian car industry we might see the import laws relaxing. (Here's hoping!)

Imports are usually more expensive to insure in Australia and some of the mainstream companies refuse to offer agreed value on them. You might be stuck with market value and it can be a pittance.

Parts should not be an issue. Most Toyota dealers will now order parts for imports although you might have to wait for them to arrive and pay a bit more.

In the unlikely event you find an ex-Australian car with the Australia compliance plate still attached under the bonnet, then re-importing again is no problem.

Cheers,
Brett.

__________________
May 2015 - Canberra to Townsville via the Birdsville Track in a 1969 Mini Van.
http://www.facebook.com/TeamBMCAdventures

Yes, it'll be a personal import, the one-year rule and residency won't be a problem.

I'll need to investigate the insurance issues, but had already assumed there would be a cost implication.

Thanks for that, very helpful.

Sorry, the manual box is weaker. But it can easily be changed for an 80 one.
Quite a common mod.

Low octane petrol is a problem too, same as diesel. I'm not as familiar with petrols to know how much of a problem though.

I'm pretty certain the manual in the 100 series is the same as an 80, but the manual in the lower powered 1HZ engined 105 is weaker (although appropriate for the engine).

__________________
Cheers,

Julian Voelcker
Overland Cruisers - Specialising in Land Cruiser preparation and servicing.

Yes, there's certainly a lot of logic in that argument, and it's been repeated often enough by people that have 'been there and done it' that I'm seriously considering that option.

On the flip side however, I'm also not averse in theory to newer 100/200 series. Yes, there is more to go wrong, but they're also newer and lower miles..... there are still plenty of people using them for overlanding without seemingly any major issues cropping up so far.

That's essentially the main decision really.

Which is the better option..... I see the arguments on both sides.

The main factor for me though is as close to bulletproof reliability as I can get.

Ease of fixing it in the wilderness is second to that, as although I'm pretty much mechanically illiterate (despite a fair bit of previous motorsport involvement) so would be reliant on getting it to a repair facility, I do see the argument that finding someone able to work on an 80 series might be easier than finding someone able to competently repair a newer one.

In a previous life I managed a big corporate's involvement in both a rally raid team and international group N campaign, and we never spent that much on preparing one. Although to be fair, we didn't expect them to last beyond a few races before rebuild either.

But you still see the ads.... Hence why I'm here and asking questions.


All good advice.

I'd be planning to try and get someone like Julian Voelcker to overhaul the truck completely. His reputation seems to be spot on and I see he's a mod on here as well, so hopefully he'll be along shortly to offer advice.

LOL

I don't mind toys if they help with comfort at my age....

Been there and done that on the bike front, and spent more than enough time sleeping in tents in the desert on raids and getting woken by the bikes at 5:00 am....

But it's not just me now, and the wife requires a certain level of creature comforts these days. Especially if we're living in it for a couple of years.

Absolutely.

My mantra is to keep the mechanicals as close to factory spec as possible, and rebuild anything needing it using only original Toyota parts.

Toyota spends hundreds of millions developing and testing these vehicles to try and keep their reputation for reliability and ability to go anywhere.... It's very unlikely many aftermarket suppliers can equal that.

Thanks, good advice.

Can't emphasise enough how mechanically ungifted I am though, so while I'm certainly happy to try and learn, I'll still be trying to buy reliability as a primary objective.

I have seen looms on older cars start to degrade after 30 years, especially if a little water gets in from a dozed windscreen seal etc.

You are talking about keeping the vehicle for a good few years, even if you buy a 5 year old LC today, it will still be 25 years old in 20 years time. Its at that point that the electrical gremlins will REALLY show their head.

Mercedes, Toyota and a few more were knocking out simple diesel engined cars/trucks that could comfortably do 500k miles in the 1970s, think mercedes OM617 engine, Toyota 2H etc. Then they realised their mistake and needed to start making cars less reliable in order to sell more new ones and make a bigger profit. Cue endless fiddly little gadgets, nonsense and this is where we are today.

I would never buy a common rail diesel engined anything, on simple principle; any engine failure has to be catastrophic and leave you stranded and in need of a new engine.

Totally get that line of argument, and there's a lot going for it.

On the other hand however, my real worry is not 30 years from now, it's the next 5 years and 50,000 miles.

And I've spent enough of my life in stripped down rally cars, on bikes, camping in deserts, etc, to appreciate a bit more comfort and civilised performance than perhaps a 20 year old vehicle can give. Albeit, I'm not willing to trade reliability for comfort either....

It'll be an interesting journey this I feel, trying to find the right tool for the job.

Thanks for your input.

I drove a brand new petrol Dacia Duster for 2000kms last year in Romania, top spec, was no nicer than my 1991 80 series, just shinier. I'd take the 80 over it anyday.

A 100 is a little less bumpy, and looks more up to date inside and out, but it isn't that much nicer. It also feels flimsier, not badly built, just not as rugged.

Drive a few of each, see which YOU prefer and why, remember mileage is like age, its only a number on these.

Fair enough.

I currently drive a 4 year old Audi diesel with 120K miles on it, and recently had to drive a brand new vauxhall hire car for a week.... it was horrible.... cheap, tinny, underpowered.

But I also suspect that had a lot to do with what I'm used to rather than the merits of the vehicle itself.

I suppose I'm wondering if a lot of the 60 vs 80 vs 100 vs 200 series arguments online have as much to do with the owners opinions as the actual performance of the vehicles?