i could never find out either & from a mate who used to work in a specialist there isnt seem to be any rule except most post 96 were ok.
if they have the fault its a full gearbox rebuild to sort as the input shaft for the T-box is the output shaft from the mainbox.

the landy engine to avoid is the older turbo diesel. its basicly the NA diesel with a turbo strapped on, cooling is best called marginal. they are ok when looked after but if used then they crack pistons for fun.

Yes I know it is too short, but it is not exactly the first time I go to Africa, it is more a ´see again´ of some places and people after many years, although I have never been to Angola as that wasn´t possible in ´my time´ (1982 -2000)

Indeed I have been thinking of a Combi as well, but Moremi and Chobe will be too much fun for me with a Combi I am afraid (unless the ´roads´ were improved). And what I found on the internet they seem overpriced to me as well.
A pickup is not what I am looking for, otherwise the Nissan Hardbody would be a good choice indeed.

See that there is a Toyota Condor 4x4 in RSA, at reasonable secondhand prices. Never heard of that car before. Anyone experience with it?

Hey Ollie,

I travelled for a while in Namibia together with your car when it was still called Biggles, (or was it Giggles? and with another white LR, I believe it was called Kate. Me being a Toyo man I was amazed that almost every evening when we got to our destination, the LR guys had to open the hood and fumble around or dove under the cars. Leaking fuel tanks, leaking radiators, electrical shortcircuits etc, one of them even dropped a valve and they had to rebuild the engine completely (not your car!). I had a couple of broken leafspring (which where not original Toyota) during our trip of 60.000 km. Obviously Toyota´s break down as well but not as often. You still have to start your trip and i hope all goes well but be shure you master the mecanics of the LR because you´ll need it.

Cheers,
Noel
exploreafrica.web-log.nl

Absolutely amazing!
Here is a guy asking a genuine question about a LR and the LC people cannot leave him alone - get out of it! - **** off, just go to your own pissing little contest of a thread and leave the LR people alone to talk LRs - what is wrong with that!
By the way, Merry Christmas, what is left of it.

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Dave

I agree! I even started another thread so people could go an do the p1ssing competition elsewhere ....

It is strange how they can't let it go.

And yes my LR may break down, but I don't care! That will be the fun. Please don't reply, because I know all the risks, and it just makes happy people miserable when you try and convince us life is terrible unless we do it your way!

PS Merry Christmas to all too

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Ollie

www.jollyfollies.com

Land's End to Sydney 2009

Hey Cornish, and the original poster,

Don't be too alarmed at the anti LR comments.

My Discovery I had 141,000 miles on the clock when I bought it in 2002, almost seven years later 220,000 miles, it's a '93, 200Tdi. Of course over that time it has been serviced regularly and had quite a lot of maintenance work done on it.
Up to 171,000 I had done little work on the car other than servicing, as we were now prepping the car for our first trip to Tunisia in 2004, so at this point the car is eleven years old.
I rebuilt all four of the axle ends, new bearings, seals, swivel bearings, discs, pads, etc.
I had the cam belt changed this would have been the third belt change I guess, this was when the new water pump was fitted. I had a re-con gear and transfer box fitted by Ashcroft's and bought five new tyres. Apart from a thorough check over by LR and changing all of the oils and filters, that was it.

My LR is not just a "school bus" it get's used. It has been to the desert in Tunisia three times, bounced around the dunes with all the others. Yes, it did let me down in the desert in Tunisia, the waterpump failed, it was only five months old. and since the water pump failed it has never let me down to the extent of needing to be recovered. Even with a failed pump I continued driving it for four more days, with the 300 the head would have warped due to the water pump being higher up on the block. Following this it had an overheating problem that was solved by renewing the radiator.

50,000 miles since the prep work was done the car is still running on the same parts, even down to the Britpart replacement water pump that I fitted outside the Novotel in Marsielle. AFAIK the engine, and all ancilleries are the originals, nothing has been replaced, other than those parts mentioned above, so I guess the engine had done 220,000 miles and still not had the head removed. Let's not forget that the car is now sixteen years old, yes it is suffering from rust, and lots of it, but mechanically it has been very, very reliable.

And finally, no, I do not spend every weekend tinkering.

Best of luck with the big trip BTW,

Kevin

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www.4x4-travel.co.uk

Marker,
the Toyota Condor would be a good choice - they don't have much clearance but at least are available 4x4. Like a Subaru a lot of people would probably be surprised at where they can go. I have never driven one so I cannot really comment further, but a good few of the big Gold mines here in Ghana use them as lighter duty troop carrier alternatives, therefore it is a forgone conclusion that if miners drive them then they are pretty tough. I camped next to some guys from South Africa in one once and it struck me as a roomy, practical vehicle to camp and travel with. The rest Peter said very well, although I have to admit not being a big fan of South African built D22 Hardbodies, but that is only because they tend to fall apart very quickly with extremely heavy duty use - but that has nothing to do with overlanding or touring South Africa and anyway you indicated that a pickup is not your choice! My vote for Condor or VW combi.
Gil

The only Land Rover manufactured product I'd avoid would be the early Efi Range Rovers. Main problem is the engine ECU(mainly part number PRC9610E or PRC9601E can't quite remember) is obsolete and even the aftermarket repair bods were struggling to provide a suitable alternative.

Otherwise they're all worth using but nature of the beast is they are maintenance heavy but preventative maintenance and a morning check routine never goes amiss whether it's a solihull product or something from the land of the rising sun.

Dear Ollie,

Sorry that you picked it up this way. It wasn´t intended this way. Off course your LR will make it. Hell, you can even make it to Cape Town in a Citroen 2CV as the Belgian guys demonstrated. You just need different preparations depending on the vehicle! In a way I admire the LR drivers beause they stick to their ideals where as I sold out to "security". I think that is also a personality thing. All the LC drivers I know are sort of "control freaks" whereas the LR guys seem to be more of the "take it as it comes" type of people which is a very good thing when your travelling. I still think the LC is stronger than the LR but that does not say anything about the quality of your travels!!! I am sure you would not enjoy your trip as much in a LC as you will in your LR, because our heart is in it. All LR drivers seem to give their cars a name while you hardly ever see that with LC´s. A LR is a family member while the LC is only a vehicle.

Enjoy,

Noel

Hi Noel,

Thanks for that. I re-read my post and it looked a little like I was throwing my toys out of the pram, which wasn't what I intended. More that of course you should advice a land rover driver of the other options, but once they had taken note politely, let them carry on with their slightly crazy adventure.

I think you explained it correctly. Another way I had been thinking about it is the much talked about LRW guys. They, I think went the next step on - backup vehicles and fixers. You can take the guarantee of making it to whatever lengths you wish, and only you can know what you are happy with, and what would make a successful trip. For them it is having a team available to fix any problem. For the Toyota driver it is having a vehicle that will make it all the way (percentage wise).

Me and the wife have discussed what happens if Dino, our faithful but not necessarily reliable land rover breaks down for good. Well, we are just going to continue another way. No doubt about it. Whether by another car, train, bus, back packing etc. To us the adventure will still continue and it will be one hell of a trip.

So, going back to me throwing my toys out of the pram (car). I hope this explains why we and a lot of other land rover owners don't need to be continually told of the dangers in driving a land rover - a bit like my mum saying 'Driving to Australia, you don't want to do that, something might happen!'.

Peace and Love to all Toyota/Land Rover/2CV drivers in the world

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Ollie

www.jollyfollies.com

Land's End to Sydney 2009

I'm sorry to keep prodding the hornet's nets, but....

Most overlanders I know do give their LC's a name and do treat them as family members.

This is more down to individuals, not the vehicles. I do know of some LC owners that haven't named their trucks, but then they didn't name the LRs they had previously either.

__________________
Cheers,

Julian Voelcker
Overland Cruisers - Specialising in Land Cruiser preparation and servicing.

Gentlemen

please keep it calm.

Welldone Ollie and Gil for trying to reduce the heat from this 'arguement', this is a forum where many people enjoy spending their free time discussing trips, overlanding, vehicles, camping etc, etc, etc.
We are all individuals and all have our personal opinions, whether that be biased one way or another it is an opinion no more no less. Please do not diss or insult someone for their choice or opinion, however, a little constructive criticism never hurt any one!
So please enjoy, respect others opinions, choices and comments - you do not have to agree, but you certainly do not have to insult anyone.


While we are at it, comments like this below do not prove anything:

Quote:
"If you want more reasons than character though, come green laning with me in Shropshire and Wales and draw your own conclusions.
Then perhaps the next day I could take my canvas off and have half a ton of gravel dropped in the back by a JCB at the garden centre (did that in the summer), doesn't matter if it gets dirty 'cos I can hose it out.
Then the next day I could fit a 8 seater dining table and chairs in it (did that yesterday!) .
Then the same motor can be taking me to the Libyan desert, pulling big lardy toyotas out of the dunes.
I can also cook pasties and croque monsieur on the engine, use my front bumper like an anvil, open bottles with my doors, and if I bend a panel I can hit it back out with the bottom of a shoe. On top of all that, the more battered it gets the cooler it looks, it's worth more now than when I bought it six years ago, is 22 years old and will still be around in another 22.
I've got more if you want me to go on"


A Toyota 70 series pick up could do exactly the same - infact I saw a number in Africa that were used and abused, but still going 100's of ?,000's of miles later.
I met farmers, tour operators, miners, etc who swore by Toyota, Land Rover and/or Nissan/, but these were all opinions, one doesn't make another right or wrong just different.
Enjoy!!

Hope you all had a Merry Christmas and have a Happy and Prosperous New Year

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ChrisC

Back to the original question. I would personally avoid any pre. 300TDi and go for a non molested, standard vehicle. Difficult to find in the LR world but they do exist.

In the UK people seem to like ex. Utility Defenders. They are well serviced but could have led a hard life. Towing mini diggers/heavy plant and used by inconsiderate people can put huge stress on drive trains etc. Ex. BT or Water Utilities could be OK though.

Maybe a completely standard and pampered Discovery that’s never been used in anger?

We have TD5’s and apart ECU to injector wiring loom problems and cracked inlet manifolds they seem to last pretty well.

New Ford engined ones don’t seem to have a good reputation but I don’t have any personal knowledge.

The basic difference between Japanese and LR is that the former is far easier to find second hand in an unmodified and un-abused state. There’s a huge amount of after market junk available for LR’s which owners seem compelled to bolt on with little or no knowledge. (if you want proof, there’s a recent court case in the UK where some guy has been sent to prison after he killed his passengers when his bodged LR left the road and ended up in a river). Sorry UK rather than SA based opinion’s but the same principles must apply.

So IMHO go for the youngest / standard LR and they are OK.

I know, thats why my post was deliberately silly - this my cars better than yours stuff should have been left behind in the playground and is just distracting.



Mind you, my 90 is still better than a 70.
With knobs on.

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www.simba4x4.com

Marker,

Is this in your price range http://www.horizonsunlimited.com/hub...762#post220624

__________________
Cheers,

Julian Voelcker
Overland Cruisers - Specialising in Land Cruiser preparation and servicing.