I contend ,, that Garmin in the past ,, using out dated software,, shoddy workmanship on the units,,mediocre after service and greedy propriety exercise of maps,, have enjoyed many years of monopolistic share of the market. We beat them by using OSM,, now new challenge is on the horizon.

With the advent of the smart phones, which is indeed getting smarter,,,provides many choices of free maps and online resources at our finger tips, without connecting usbs or using their exclusive software ,, can enjoy ,, what is out there on open ,, free and available, for any one. Garmin in general
is becoming less in demand and their financials will hurt as time progresses.

On that note ,, I think as we,, a special breed of riders,, who travel the globe ,, shoud discuss in ernest the merits of the new technology vs old ,,

Software ,,
Hardware ,,
Pros and cons ,,
User experiences ,,
Service problems ,,
The cost ,,

I use and have used Garmin ,, but I am totally committed to Smart Phones.
So you know where I stand.
Please feel free to offer us your insights.

One major reason is this Locus APP ,, tried many ,, this is the best IMHO

Locus

https://www.google.com/webhp?hl=en#h...iw=925&bih=623

The choices of maps are truly mind blowing,, With SP,, you can actually go on a hike,, knowing that you have many many hours of battery life,, has GPS tracking ,, such as Latitute APP by Google,, where your loved ones will know ,, exactly where you are in the middle of the Sahara desert. If you don't move a ft for a day,, they will know you are in trouble.

With Galaxy Asia version ,, you can watch local TV for free and host of radio station ,, I usually listen to BBC news, when I am on the road. Or have family go to whereismydroid.com ,, register your SP ,, again exact location ,, even initiate a video from their end.

Durability,,, Can Garmin survive this?
Crash test iPhone 4S vs Samsung Galaxy S II - YouTube

Water Proof comes at 12 bucks
Amazon.com: iOttie Waterproof Skin Case Cover Pouch for Samsung AT&T Sprint Galaxy S2 Multi Purpose Protective Skin for Underwater Activity, Fishing, Ski, Snowboarding, Dustproof: Cell Phones & Accessories

Luxury Water Proof at 28 bucks
Amazon.com: Waterproof Tough Hard Phone Case for the Samsung Galaxy S2 i9100 SII European Version: Electronics

Another Water Proof 20 bucks
Samsung Galaxy S2 Waterproof Case - The Beachbuoy from Proporta

Very Sexy Water Proof
http://brandnewthings.com/

I am eagerly standing on the sidelines of this thread to see what the collective wisdom is. i.e. I don't have a smart phone but these gadgets seem to be all pervasive.
I think your list, below, covers it for now at least because this technology is moving on so very fast.


I have looked back through this forum for approximately the past 12 months and there are very few threads that discuss smart phones.
Of those which do there has been only a small response, apart from this
http://www.horizonsunlimited.com/hub...-gps-nav-57025
In there are one or two other recommended apps for the software side of things, and OSMAnd gets a few honourable mentions.

One point made in that earlier thread is that the mapping needs to be available offline; my guess is that all "good" mapping apps have this capability.

But, dumb question of the day, does a smart phone need to have online connectivity for its' GPS to be active?

ps to a moderator; this subject is worth being a sticky

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Dave

Not a dumb question at all.
Nope ,, Nada ,, it is entirely separate from internet. Works just like Tom and Gar.

This is a really interesting thread - thanks for starting it.

For me it boils down to the right tool for the right job. The main difference between dedicated GPS units and Smartphones boil down to the underlying tech.

Smartphones will poll the satellite about once a second, dedicated units do it several times per second - this gives a significantly more accurate position amongst other things. Smartphones have batteries that are designed for phone calls etc, a dedicated GPS unit generally has a much longer battery life as it's designed to do just that.

Dedicated units can display maps from multiple sources - paid for and free - and can, via bluetooth, share and connect to a phone in order to share position and updates online via a GSM/GPRS connection. Smartphones can display maps from free and paid sources as well as online sources 'live' - such as google maps. But given the cost of data connectivity outside of your native country I'm not sure about the value of a 'live' map. Certainly an up to date map would be useful.

So for me - a dedicated unit, that is waterproof, hardy (my Garmin Zumo has bounced down the road at 70+ MPH several times and is fine - I dropped my iPhone from my desk onto a tiled floor and it smashed). So why would I want a smartphone, that requires lots of additional software (paid and free) and addition hardware (to make it waterproof)?

Incidentally Garmin are doing very very well at the moment - mainly because they understand that people want the right tool for the right job - there's units for motorbikes, cars, boats, walkers, skiers, airplanes..... all designed specifically to do the job.

I'll put my Garmin Zumo against any Smartphone any day - and it'll win on every score!

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Hi, sorry no answers just questions, i have never owned at sat nav and have only recently bought a smart phone (samsung galaxy ace). can i access my maps riding from UK to Morocco at no cost? i was considering the option of buying a Spanish sim card but i will also be in France, Portugal, Morocco and Italy.
Any advice appreciated. Andy

Have a look at the Motorola Defy -it's survived my better half for over a year now and that includes me driving over it and her ringing me when she's in the shower (don't ask why please).

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Chris
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"Never have a stupid argument with an idiot - he gets a lot more practice than you"
there I go again
not too hard really

So far, here we have a Motorola Defy and a Samsung Galaxy (not long ago this G word to this UK user was either a chocolate bar or something in outer space).
But, reading webpages tells me that there are loads of these gadgets on sale with lots of model names from a range of manufacturers - are there any others in use by HUBBers that can be recommended for travelling?


Matt,
+1, It is a most useful thread!

I am not sure how much accuracy is necessary; I used to be involved in surveying, yep, using GPS (to some extent when it was just becoming available), and that goes well beyond the requirements of navigation. As I understand things, the extra pings of the system will refine the precision achieved - not the same thing as accuracy.
Without precision, accuracy becomes an illusion, but navigators don't necessarily need high order accuracy in order to locate where abouts they are.

The availability of "dead" maps for smart phones seems to be mushrooming and I can see the attraction here.
Could Garmin (I pick on them because no one here seems to talk about Tom Tom et al, so far anyway) be running scared of this? My impression from reading this forum and a few other places is that their software is not friendly to the average end-user who just wants to get the result without playing about with the software.
Then, I assume the dead map version can be updated anytime the smart phone is near a free wifi outlet?

This thread evolved from another one specifically about Garmin and I have been put off, to some extent, by their marketing of GPS for such applications as navigation of golf courses. I surmise that Garmin have seen the threat from smart phones and have segmented their marketing to compete.

I still have an open mind about this and I am hoping for a load more feedback.

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Dave

Just closing the loop from earlier times.

It seems to me that it remains a case of horses for courses.
Everyone owns a smart phone nowadays (don't they?) but not everyone needs a dedicated GPS unit, or even wants one.

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Dave

I see that this thread has stood the test of time with multi-thousands of viewings and hundreds of replies even though it never did make it to become one of the exalted "stickies".

It's been running strongly for over 2 1/2 years.

Speaks for itself.

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Dave

It was your bloody idea ,, that got us all into this madness! :confused1:

Hey, you've made the grade as a sticky thread sometime in the last 24 hours.
Congratulations - fame at last.
Just watch the viewing figures for your thread snowball now!

Besides, Madness are a great band.

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Dave

Smart phones are smart and stupid depending on the mapping app you installed. On my KTM I use PN60 Delorme exclusively. It turns on and works flawlessly every time without fail. It sees it all; heavy dust, rain, hail, snow, heat, cold, you name it it works and it gives directions. However it does have a tiny view screen.
When I need to find a gas station or other POI, I use my smart phone with Sygic application. This app runs off the GPS exclusively and no need for phone service. My smart phone stays in a sealed bag in my tank bag to protect it. I would not even consider a Nexus 7 on a bike. The 7 would be a great off road GPS for in-vehicle use. However it's new operating system may not accommodate all the great mapping apps available.

Personnaly I would not like to put all my eggs into one basket, A smartphone is for communicating and listening to music. My Iphone eats battery power when running any APP so the phone will die and then you have lost communicatins as well.
Smartphones are not water or dust proof
Smartphones cannot be used with gloves on
Smartphone mapping software is eons behind the GPS companies
Smartphones cannot be easily viewed in bright sunlight
Smartphones are not as accurate as GPS as they track very few satelites
Smartphones require a network connection for the APP to run which can be expensive when travelling through different countries
Smartphones usualy switch off the screens after a preset time to safe battery life so no road map.
Smartphones are not designed for the high frequency vibrations on a bike so it will damage it after a short time.

Keep the GPS seperate to mitigate against breakage, theft, failure, battery life.

I have a Zumo 660 its built to last in all weathers and it works with clear instructions and maps. I have my Iphone linked via bluetooth to the Zumo and then linked to my Interphone F5 headset. This si the best set up you can get its totaly safe and reliable.

You pay your money and throw the dice!!!

Replace the word "Smartphone" with the word "iPhone" and all of the above may be true, but an Android phone doesn't suffer from any of those software shortcomings, wire in a waterproof USB socket to your bike and you can keep it charged. What it can't get round might be some of the hardware problems. That said I ride everywhere with my Galaxy mounted on the bike and it hasn't been shaken apart yet.

As an aside comparing Garmin to Google I notice if I'm using turn by turn navigation and go off route Garmin will recalculate to try to get me back to its initial planned route often wanting me to "perform a U-turn", Google will recalculate the whole route afresh meaning I can generally keep on riding forwards. In one recent instance, missing one turn on the Garmin would have lead me to ride a circle (take the next right, then the next, then the next etc.) of 24 miles to get back to the original route, whereas Google recalculated the whole thing, and told me to take the next left.

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