Visa Registration Help Needed - Russia

[strimstrum]

We are two UK guys on a RTW with UK passports and 6 month multi entry business visas and we have arrived in Vladivostok and are staying here in the Hotel Vladivostok until our bikes arrive from Seattle.

The notes from the visa agency say that if we are staying longer than 3 days we have to register our visa with the UFMS

I asked our hotel reception to register for us and they say not needed. We have a customs clearing agent booked (Yuri Melnikov) to help us clear our bikes and we went to see him this morning and he said the same - not needed. He said that it used to be the case but not now. He has taken travellers to the UFMS offices but they are not interested anymore.

Can anyone recently through Vladivostok advise us then if it really is necessary to register when everyone we ask here in Vladivostok says no.

Thanks

Martin

[Tony P]

Everyone, Russians and Visitors alike, must be Registered somewhere.

The Registration time requirement for Visitors changed in March 2011, although the news has not reached everyone yet.

The new requirement is that Visitors should Register within "7 working days" of arrival. In theory this could be as much as 12 days including weekends and public holidays - like this coming Monday.

Hotels should do this for you. Yours may be not bothering if you have not/will not be staying for the required minimum. Just a guess.

Further rules, ignored by most Russians, is that everyone must re-register within 3 working days of moving/visiting another area.

When I have been 'touring' on Visas I got Registrations as and where I could and kept them. Apart from one occasion in 7 years, no-one has asked to see my Registration(s). This is more likely in 'tourist' hotspots, like Red Square, where opportunist police used to look for bribes from unsuspecting, unregistered Visitors. Maybe they still do - I havn't been there for years!

A couple of weeks ago I completed my Residency Application at my local FMS office. Not only did they want a photocopy of my Registration but they compared it with information on the nationwide computor.

[strimstrum]

Thanks for the heads up Tony.

We will be in Vladivostok for at least 10 days so we will have to register - we do not intend to exit Russia until around mid July when we enter Mongolia (subject to getting a visa at Ulan Ude) and then we will re-enter about 2-3 weeks later. We have to exit Russia by 30th August anyway as our visa expires then and we will be close to the 90 days.

Do you know the penalty for not registering ? Is it something that border control will be interested in - we obviously have our immigration card stamped already.

Thanks

Martin

[Tony P]

Border controls on exit are only interested in your Passport and Migration Card.
Once you had to surrender your Registration to them on exit like you still do with the Migration Card. But no more.

Quite recently on exit I absentmindedly gave them my Registration slip as it was still inside my Passport (I normally keep both papers in my Pasport) but they immediatly gave it back to me without even looking at it. Their interest is that you are still within your Visa dates and taking back the Migration Card.

Registration is more a matter for the Militsia Police but they are not bothered as they think it is a matter for FMS - who have no police! The Road Police (ДПС) have no right to look at anything other than your Driving and Vehicle documents - but they try it on in the hope of persuading you to part with money!

I know of people who have crossed all of Russia without a Registration (eg. camping).

Dont worry - but pick them up where you can just to have something.

[ilesmark]

Will it cause problems? Depends on who you meet.

I inadvertently fell foul of this when I entered Russia through Vlad. In my case I'd asked the hotel where I stayed the first night to register me, as the book told me to do and then, as the book told me they would do, they said OK and took my passport. When it was given back to me the next morning it didn't have the second stamp on the immigration card but I didn't become aware the lack of one was a problem until I found myself getting turned away from hotels in Khabarovsk.

The British Embassy in moscow told me to expect hassle because of this at the border when leaving Russia, but I didn't get any.

On my second entry to Russia, I was wise to this and got my visa registered in the textbook way AND kept receipts from all the restaurants/filling stations I'd visited afterwards to prove I hadn't stopped anywhere subsequently for more than 3 working days. This wad of receipts was checked twice - Moscow and then the Pskov border with Latvia.

Hope this helps

Mark

overlandcruiser.net

[strimstrum]

Mark

Thanks for the information - Really helpful and now has me heading for the UFMS office on Tuesday (Monday is Russia Day here and a public holiday).

Martin

[strimstrum]

Didn't need to go to the UFMS office after all.

I read up a bit more and found out that our host (the hotel) is legally obliged to register us so I went back to reception and they (grudgingly) agreed to issue a registration card and if by miracle one appeared just half hour later all stamped up.

Mark/Tony P - Do you know if we have to get a hotel stamp on our immigration card as well ? We have the orange stamp put on by immigration at the airport, Mark - are you saying in your post that the hotel should stamp the departure immigration card as well ?

Apologies if this question sounds dumb.

Martin

[Tony P]

Originally Posted by strimstrum

Do you know if we have to get a hotel stamp on our immigration card as well ?

No.
They should not stamp the Migration Card at all but only take a photocopy of both it and your Passport. The Migration Card will eventually have be handed in at Immigration when you exit RUS.

The hotel should give you the Registration slip. A grey piece of paper about 22x10cm (or in old money 8"x4"). They should have completed it on one side with your passport details and their address. And the other side has their name and stamp/signatures.

It has an validity date which should be the duration of your stay at the hotel. If you are lucky they may have put the final date from the Migration Card.

The main thing is you have a Registration. If you are travelling that will suffice, but if using a hotel later in your trip get another Registration from them too.



Mark Hi.
We've told you before "Never bother with the Embassy" !!
They don't know anything, don't do anything and don't care.
Find out on HUBB instead.

[strimstrum]

Thanks Tony

The slip of paper is indeed grey and 8 x 4 in old money and it has a blue stamp on it which if I have read the cyrillic right says something like "Dlya Registration PR" across the middle (PR being this region) and another square box has been stamped with the hotel stamp and signed and dated. It shows the date of our departure from the hotel. This may have to be extended as we will probably have to add a couple more days for customs clearance etc but I assume that all we need to do is to either re-register if more than 3 days or just get a receipt for the extra days and move on asap.

Tony, your help in putting our virgin minds at rest is much appreciated.

Thanks

Martin

[colebatch]

If you stay longer, get a new registration doc, and ask them to put the final date as being the one on your migration card, or 3 months, whichever is the sooner. If you smile nicely, and they do it, it will save you having to worry about registration again.

Originally Posted by strimstrum

Thanks Tony

The slip of paper is indeed grey and 8 x 4 in old money and it has a blue stamp on it which if I have read the cyrillic right says something like "Dlya Registration PR" across the middle (PR being this region) and another square box has been stamped with the hotel stamp and signed and dated. It shows the date of our departure from the hotel. This may have to be extended as we will probably have to add a couple more days for customs clearance etc but I assume that all we need to do is to either re-register if more than 3 days or just get a receipt for the extra days and move on asap.

Tony, your help in putting our virgin minds at rest is much appreciated.

Thanks

Martin

[strimstrum]

Thanks for that Walter. We will definitely be spending a bit longer here so will have to get a new registration so I will try the smile technique but there is a strong possibilty it won't work as I have a face for radio.

Martin

[T.REX63]

Originally Posted by strimstrum

...I will try the smile technique but there is a strong possibilty it won't work as I have a face for radio.

Martin

...Hey Martin, don't be so hard on yourself, Pia said you are cute.

Would you mind taking a pic of the registration documents and post it? Of course, don't do it if it contains any information not meant for the "world wide web" or could lead to identity theft for years to follow...

[Tony P]

Originally Posted by strimstrum

The slip of paper is indeed grey and 8 x 4 in old money and it has a blue stamp on it which if I have read the cyrillic right says something like "Dlya Registration PR" across the middle (PR being this region) and another square box has been stamped with the hotel stamp and signed and dated. It shows the date of our departure from the hotel. This may have to be extended as we will probably have to add a couple more days for customs clearance etc but I assume that all we need to do is to either re-register if more than 3 days or just get a receipt for the extra days and move on asap.

As Colebatch says - if still at the hotel when the Registration runs outr they will give a new one.

The 3 day rule was changed to 7 working days (excluding W/ends and Public Holidays - like today, Monday) in March this year. This is certainly for a first Registration after Entering - I am unclear if this also applies to subsequent Registrations, but I will enquire of those here who know far more than I on a local Website Forum.

If you can manage a smile so much the better. It always works for Colebatch!

[Tony P]

Originally Posted by colebatch

If you stay longer, get a new registration doc, and ask them to put the final date as being the one on your migration card, or 3 months, whichever is the sooner.

An interesting general follow-on regarding this point that I recently experienced :-

I re-entered RUS recently and got a new Registration to the end of my current Visa. (no problem - it is for at 'her' home and for the full 90 days limit imposed by my Visa and Migration Card!).
Within days I had to return to London for a few days and then came back.

A couple of days after returning I went to my local FMS office regarding my Residency Permit Application and they consulted "Deep Thought" (Google it, if in doubt !!) and they told me I did not have a current registration.
I then produced my Registration but they said "This one is no longer valid as you left Russia on xxx".

I had not yet told them or given them my new Migration Card or Passport - but they knew!

SO
Exiting RUS, automatically cancels the validity of any Registrations still current - even though you may re-enter later and continue to carry one with a later date.

A smart Police or Border chappie will know from your Passport stamps and current Migration Card that you exited and have no valid Registration.

In my view the chances of having your collar felt are very, very small, but there is always a risk - considerably increased if having already stopped you the official has not warmed to one's charm.

A cash penalty can easily be paid, but the real problem penalty for some is being banned from entering RUS for up to 5 years.

Don't underestimate the power of their computor systems and their ability to access it in very remote regions.
(I was once stopped far along a dead end gravel track, high in the Caucuses mountains, tens of Kms from any town, or even tarmac. They asked to take my Passport and Registration to check with the computor and within a couple of minutes returned from their car with my documents saying all was OK. Bluff? Who knows!)

[strimstrum]

Thanks Tony P

That is useful info because if we get visas for Mongolia in Ulan Ude and exit Russia at the eastern Mongolian international border we will have to reapply for registration papers when we re-enter Russia at the western border.

Glad to have you and Walter as mentors on this one - hopefully we won't fall foul of the registration laws. I am keeping all my receipts anyway.

Thanks

Martin