Regarding dehydration (much less severe than heat stroke which befell the two brothers), if planning on riding in Morocco at this time of year it's worthwhile mentioning that there are two types of powders that deal with it.

• the relatively expensive Dioralyte/Rehydrat/[+Supermarket versions] which I'd classify as 'medicinal' for when you're losing it as Tim describes above. About 50p a shot (200ml). Also good if you have the runs and are losing water that way.

• the less expensive 'preventative' tablets like High5 Zero or Nuun tablets, or 'isotonic' tubs of powder like Gatorade sold for sports activities. Tabs about 60p/litre.

Dioralyte/Rehydrat especially are much more than just sugar and salt, though that mixed at 8:1 is better than nothing if you're feeling crook. They include a specific ratio of other key minerals to rebalance your body's electrolyte levels, the medium through which signals are transmitted back to the brain and why your senses (eyes, balance, touch, etc) all start to go when the electrolyte balance is off as you lose minerals in your 'salty' sweat. I've watched a person staggering around and seeing double come round in minutes after taking a Rehydrat.

I always carry a few Tesco-branded 'Dioralytes' on my travels but rarely use them these days unless I get the runs. I think that's partly because I now regularly use Zero tablets when doing energetic stuff in warm places.

And if i'm in a hot place (as we were in AZ/Utah a month ago when temps hit seasonal records), I'd buy it in powder form by the tub. We got through a kilo in ten days but had no headaches or other dehydration symptoms walking 5 hours at up to 40C.
On ebay High5 Isotonic Energy Drink 2kg (not quite the same as sugar-free Zero) goes for 23 quid and they say makes 24 litres @ up to 40°C, maybe twice that if it's less hot.
When I do my camel walks (Alg winter, <30C) I take one tube of H5s per four days, plus plenty of Rehydrats to dish out as needed.

Riding one time in southern Algeria in September (a big mistake...) I was having to stop and drink every 30 mins (10 litres a day and another couple at night trying to keep up). So that tub would have lasted me two days. I appeciated then how, without water or shade but not exerting yourself in any way (like the puncture example given above) you'd be too far gone to help yourself within just a few hours.

Just drinking water was not enough. After a few days I came over all groggy, realised what was happening, did the 8:1 thing and recovered.

btw, plain salt tablets are not the same, and are now discredited AFAIK. The one time I tried them after a long day on the sands in Mori with the runs, I threw up (normal reaction when ingesting too much salt at once). 8:1 is better.

So if you're riding in Mk in summertime I'd strongly recommend drinking something like Zeros regularly (along with taking all the other usual precautions to reduce water loss which others have described).

Ch

PS:
That did not look right to me so seeing as we're all having a go at Tim's stats, I'd suggest this may not be accurate.
A quick Google to a health site came up with:
4-5% = mild dehydration.
'Severe dehydration (>/= 7%)'
So 10% down and you're collapsing or worse.
I'd guess thirst kicks in at 2-3% - the first symptom of gradual dehydration that I experience. Which is another good thing with those tablets: the fruity flavours make you want to drink them more than plain water.

There's been even more unseasonably hot weather in Morocco. Yesterday Marrakech airport recorded a high of 46ºC and low of 29ºC . The 'low' illustrates JetJackson's point about the body not having a chance to recover.

The high of 46ºC is only a few degrees off the all-time high for Morocco of 49.1ºC recorded at Agadir's Al Massia airport. Higher temperatures might well have happened elsewhere but official records can only be recognised when taken with properly calibrated instruments.

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You're undoubtedly right, Chris, on the percentage issue. It was something Si Pavey was trying to drill into my head on a particularly hot day and I obviously haven't remembered it correctly. Maybe I was dehydrated

Though I'm pretty sure the 5% bit was right...

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and enlarges the world in which you live," Irving Mather (1892-1966)

Bump.

Because:-
1. It's that time of year, again (comes around every year, strangely).

2. Some folks never learn, so reminders are valuable. Others never knew.

3. It is pretty hot across most of Europe, not even considering other bits of the northern hemisphere - it's your turn next, in the south, by the way.

4. The news in the UK has this subject as a topic at present.



This thread should be a sticky???? (maybe in the health/safety on the road forum).

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Dave

with 23 years in the Army medical services, heatstroke, heat exhaustion and dehydration are things I know a bit about and have seen many many times. I have worked in temperatures upto 65degrees for short periods and 45 degrees for sustained periods.

I have seen a soldier collapse from dehydration and heat exhaustion in the snow. He was wearing too much clothing whilst undertaking strenuous activity and wasn't drinking enough because of the cold - he didn't feel thirsty.

You can become dangerously overheated in a lot less than 40 minutes.

Drink little and often. small sips regularly. You should not feel thirsty. If you do you are already dangerously overheated and will struggle to make up the deficit. You are drinking to stay alive, not because you are thirsty.

be careful how you cool down. wet rags on areas where the areties come close to the surface help. namely in the groins, around the neck and under the armpits. Also wet the head. DO NOT throw cold water over some one or soak their clothes with water. You will cause the skin to chill, this causes the peripheral circulation to shut down and the body core to super heat.

Paracetamol and ibuprofen can help the body reduce it's temperatures.

If someone collapses from heat exhaustion/heat stroke they must seek medical advice. they will need blood tests to monitor their vital organ functions. The test should be repeated after 3-4 days. Death is from multiple organ failure. This can have a delayed onset after the person appears to have recovered.

damage to your pituitary gland means if you have had heat strok once you are more likely to have it again.

watch your pee!! The old adage was pee clear twice a day. However, early on in Iraq the army ran into problems with guys knackering their renal(kidney) function trying to achieve this. You will not pee clear in hot conditions. You should aim to pee straw coloured AT LEAST twice a day, preferably more.

If you have diarrhoea and vomiting for other reasons (i.e. food poisoning) seek cool conditions and do not exert yourself, you are at significantly higher risk as you are already dehydrated. even if you are vomiting, continue to take small sips of water. some will be absorbed even if you vom it back up.

watch each other, and monitor each others water intake and toileting habits! If you think someone hasn't had a pee today, ask them!

we had bottled water with electrolytes added, diorolyte is ok, but tastes horrible I think. Energy drinks are pretty much as good, but of course more bulky to carry than a few sachets of Dioroylite added to water bought as you go.

Don't drink caffeine containing drinks or alcohol. They will dehydrate you more. Also, because they increase urine output, they give a false idea as to your true state of hydration. They make you pee clearer than you would otherwise because of the additional diuresis so you may think you are ok when you aren't.

Working hard in those conditions could easily require a water intake of 10 litres a day, maybe more. It sounds like these guys weren't carrying enough with them.

Sorry, long post, but hopefully useful

Extremely useful, rest assured.

Thanks a lot for taking the time to write such a detailed post. I'm sure we all learnt something we didn't know about this crucial issue. Really appreciated.

Esteban

Thanks Moggy good stuff
only part I didn't understand or would disagree on would be
What I heard is that ice water or water below 15 degrees shouldn't be used as it can impede peripheral blood circulation. 15-18 is optimal, the more the better.

Not being a biker I am less exposed in my 4x4 (but no AC or fridge).
Being in Algeria and Mali in May was a new experience to me.
I've spent years in the tropics but here we had 40-50 daytime and not below 28 at night. There was no respite, and limited water supply.
When your drinking water is too warm to drink and the nearest shower is days away it gets interesting.
Usually I get by just with soaking my beret - helps a lot!
Now I had to soak my shirt too and let it evaporate. Thankfully it was windy every day.
Strangely, I felt really great all the time.

Definitely!
When travelling in veeery hot weather by car with no AC, my wife and I carry our "sissy summer kit": we spray water all over us and move our Spanish "abanico". It cools you down inmediately, feeling great relief from the heat. In our experience, it works much better if all items are pink...

I would advise against soaking with water at all. More than once I've seen soldiers who have been soaked in water from peoples water bottles, so reasonably warm. On one occasion he went unconscious and started to fit (end of career by the way), almost certainly as a result. On all occasions the soldiers concerned were more poorly than they probably would have otherwise been (compared to others at similar times on the same exercise and in similar weather conditions)

We used to be issued sweat rags. It's a lightweight fabric square, basically a large hanky, that you wrap loosely round your neck and keep wet. Also stops your collar rubbing

I should perhaps add that soaking will only work well if there is a wind, as when you are in/on a moving vehicle.

Still not a sticky.

Since this thread was started there has been a case of hyperthermia that occured during the making of a documentary TV programme (for the Brits, channel 4's "Walking the Nile").
The events leading up to the event, including the final hours of the life of the deceased, were broadcast as part of the first of the four episodes.

The Adventure Blog: Journalist Dies While Walking The Nile With Levison Wood

As an aside, after the broadcast an amount of shock and horror was expressed from some quarters at being exposed to death on documentary TV, rather than via the more usual, everyday, news outlets.
But, perhaps some people, even just one or two, learnt a thing or two from that extra publicity?

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Dave

Thank you for the recommendation. Was in the desert last month near Mhamid, and boy was it hot. I managed to get tubes of them for £2.50 each from wiggle. Bargain. However, I put them in the bike luggage and they turned to powder, the ones stored in my rucksak didn't! Cautionary words, although I could still use the powder, what was left of the tablets didn't want to come out. They did when I smashed them with a tyre lever. :-)

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Have had the same prob but powder is powder - easier to snort ;-)
Got 3 tubes to last me this week: warm and getting warmer.
Don't normally come here this early.