Forums are indeed an easier to search, repository for information. But as we've seen here over the years more and more people have switched to social media from forums.

Private well moderated groups, have significant advantages over the public groups in that the content is kept on topic and the scam accounts and spam is kept to a minimum. Use of hastags helps search within the group but many users don't add them to posts.

Private groups also keep out the people who don't contribute but harvest information to repost on their own websites/blogs etc without crediting the sources in an effort to make the owners of those websites look knowledgeable and informed. Something that is a bit underhand.

Along with the regional facebook groups the Overlanding Associations WhatsApp group provide a constant feed of valuable upto date and verified information. They als do a huge amount of work behind the scenes working with governments etc to resolve situations such as the border issues in Ethiopia providing, assistance to travellers in difficulty etc. During COVID lockdowns the global safe havens network they instigated was a big help to many people stuck with closed borders. There is no "trapping of information in mudholes" rather its the opposite.

And of course much like the HuBB its all not for profit and run by volunteers who give their time freely to help the overlanding community.

I dont see that value. Specially not in that group(s) you did mention. It is even more dangerous, to let travellers start without the helpful informations.

Let me bring an example: panamtravelers

The most valuable group on FB for the panamericana did show, how good it can work, with to be "open" too for the public for readers. They shows too, how FB Groups should or can be used in a better way.

- listed at google
- Any FB User can read the group (but have to had a FB Account)
(have to be member to write or give comments)
- The Files Sections in well maintained
- The featured Section shows Articles from special interets
- Lead people into the use of specific travel Apps (public) not Whatsapp

It is like it is since years. Works... All the travellers keep it alive.

But anyway - it is not my job to judge over the work of others they did for the community. But your arguments was unfortunately very old-fashioned and short-sighted, and did ask for a comment.

Probably the discussion also shows, that the overlanding assocciation is looking to get more attention, but didnt find their place jet. That they talk with the gouverment is nice. But is too not very important, in comparison with the regular diplomatic way of handle such topics.

That there are TIP / Carnet in most country`s of the world isnt the outcome of the "overlanding assocciation", if my memories are right.

So probably it would be more helpful, when the travellers would talk to their embassys. Better than hoping that the "overlanding assocciation" will be able to solve anything. It's well intentioned. Doesn't hurt either, as long as the travelers ALSO involve their embassy.

But that are just my thoughts. that being said, we should all be happy that there are people out there who want to help other travelers in their free time!

Surfy

__________________
About Overlanding, Travelogues, Equipment
Trans-Africa over the west coast

To join a private group you just need to meet the criteria for eligibility and you get access to a wealth of valuable information.

Its quite simple to compare the original Overlanding Africa with the Fake one a see the difference in the quality of the information. The original group has valuable up to date information, well documented files section and isn't swamped with local businesses and want-to-be influencers trying to drive traffic to their campsite/restaurant or instagram account.

Throughout the COVID restrictions the Overlanding Association groups provided the most reliable and accurate information about border restrictions and lockdowns available anywhere, regularly before government travel advise was updated, information that was often copied and reposted elsewhere by some individuals

WhatsApp group are kept private for security of the members as often people are travelling in the more dangerous parts of the world sharing real time information and locations which is best not to be available to people outside of the group. You might not agree with that approach, but the group members requested that the group is private and moderated.

Individual travellers approaching embassies to resolve issues at borders isnt very effective (although sometimes depends or the embassy in question as we saw earlier in the year with travellers in Algeria) But an someone representing several hundred travellers liaising directly with contacts they have in a particular government can achieve more effective results.

Certainly UK citizens trapped in Morocco during 2020 knew only too well that speaking directly the embassy gained nothing. As one of those stuck there for a few months, I acted as the contact for between a group of 30people and the embassy. The embassy staff and the group both found it much easier to have a single point of contact.

With over 110 000 members across the world the groups work very well in that format. Certainly not looking for attention, its not needed.

TheWarden: are you really really serious about that topic?

Yes - and any traveller without FB and knowing about that specific group - should run into trouble at the etiopia border? All those travellers will thank you for that excellent service!

That is something what does NOT happen at the group I did mention (panamtravelers). The Group is moderated, violations lead to a ban (read only anymore).

Just while there is a non-or-less moderated group for africa, this argument dont gets better!

And you dont have to explain me, why the "Overlanding Association" are using public groups for other destinations (like north america). Are they more or less capable to handle it? If they would have a principle out of a (stupid) reason, it is one thing, when they use different rules per area - their own "reasons"....

When Members have to be Member to get informations, well.. And when the panamtravelers Group for just the Panam has 51.480 Members, then is 110`000 for the world probably less as it may sound in your ears. Specially because some groups (like for the american continent) - dont are able to be "very" useful for us travellers.

But anyway, probably we should help here in this thread with updated and new informations for other travellers about the topic, not a discussion about the requirement of a international "overlanding association".

Surfy

__________________
About Overlanding, Travelogues, Equipment
Trans-Africa over the west coast

I really cant work out why you have such an issue with private groups? and particularly the Overlanding Association, as seen in your post yesterday about them trapping information in mudholes. When I tried to clarify the situation about how the groups are operated, you decide to try and provoke an argument.

You also seemed to get very touchy when, after mentioning the proposed solution put forward by an Ethiopian tour guide, I reported that the comments indicated that most people don't see paying for a tour guide as a solution to the problem. After all, the Ethiopian government could simply reinstate the old system or use the Carnet system, a solution that is currently being pushed for by people who support the overlanding community.

Panam travellers or any other regional group has no relation to this thread about Ethiopia and the current border restrictions.