Rather strangely, the subject matter tends to crop up in various threads.

With the good advice given over the past few days and the real-world anecdotes to reinforce the message, this thread deserves to be a sticky in a "better", i.e. more appropriate, location such as:-

"Staying Healthy on the Road

Medical info, e.g. malaria, vaccinations, travel medical tips, medical insurance, where to find a doctor."

Then there might be more attention paid to this form of insurance alongside the legal requirement (in most countries) for motor vehicle insurance to indemnify third parties involved in accidents.

Maybe a mod or 3 could oblige?

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Dave

Motocross is entirely different.. Classed as "competitive" off road motorcycling rather than simply off road motorcycling..


BTW
Alpha covered me including an historic heart surgery a few years ago

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Mark
http://chasingdreams2014.blogspot.co.uk/

if travel a lot then u need travel insurance. ur actually meeting different people, various cultures and of course u are having a great time traveling but u should have at least some protection if anything untoward thing happens.

Have you read the policy conditions thoroughly?

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Tony
Click here for Travel Photos & Travel Map

probably not!! because they won't be covered for the reasons I gave above

Incidentally, we have just had a case rejected by the insurers for someone who is seriously ill in Asia. they decided to extend their holiday so bought a new policy online. However, the policy requires that you must be in the UK at the time of taking it out, they weren't, they were already in country, so the insurance is invalid and they are faced with the possibility of having to pay themselves for an air ambulance that will cost in the region £70000, not including the medical expenses they have already racked up in hospital.

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1990 Landcruiser H60. Full rebuild completed 2014

Perhaps the real beauty/raison d'etre of the HUBB is best portrayed by Moggy 1968. Here we have an insider willing to share his experiences and expertise in the field of international medical care coverage.

This is what the HUBB offers overlanders, not only in terms of medical care, but in virtually every aspect of overlanding by all means of transportation.

There always exists a percentage of any population who, on a downward spiral continually make decisions that hasten their demise. These are the poor souls who neglect to even consider purchasing insurances, have no concern for those who they trample on their fast track to the bottom.

No matter what logic or common sense dictates, those who impose unnecessary risks upon themselves and others might never be stopped, until reality itself stops them.

All those who post here like moggy 1968 are survivors and want to help others survive. We should listen. We should certainly use this valuable and free of charge resource. People usually pay for the same advice moggy 1968 shares freely for no other reason than to help others survive.

I have always advocated insurance for overlanders and have sorted out a relatively inexpensive medical plan that covers "motorcycles" on or off road, but not while being in a structured competitive event.

We, (Elisa - from Spain and I from USA) are permanent residents of Argentina, and therefore purchased a local plan offered for expats via one of the numerous expat organizations here. Unlike U S policies there is no upper age limit or limit on amount paid, and no deductibles. I am well over the 65 year old cut off and enjoy full coverage for about $175.00 US/month. Elisa pays much less as she is younger. A book of the company's own hospitals and accepted doctors etc is provided and since we purchased the high end coverage includes the best specialists in the the country. Our medical care has been exemplary - including yearly physicals etc etc and limited dental. Prescriptions are paid on a percentage basis - about 80% is covered.

Our policies cover us outside of Argentina for a period of two months with a $50,000 dollar limit on care and a repatriation clause that gets us back to Buenos Aires, Argentina, in the event of life threatening injury or illness and once we cross the border into Argentina, our regular policy picks up all medical expenses as described above.

Since we travel to Spain every couple years, I also purchased, prior to turning 65, an expat policy similar to what I have in Argentina from a company in Spain. This policy covers me outside of Spain for three months with repatriation to Spain included. My cost is about $250.00 US /month and Elisa has a less expensive policy offered to Spanish citizens.

So, we are covered on the two continents we travel to frequently and limit our visits to the United States, where we own a ranch, to two months if we depart from Argentina and three months if we depart from Spain.

We were on the road for the full year 2014, so our Argentine company sold us a "travel policy" good for a year with multiple discounts based on our expat coverage with the same company and I paid about $600.00 US
for the year and Elisa paid $400.00 US. This policy, as the other two policies covered injury, illness, limited dental and riding motorcycles.

There could be a catch. If you or I was operating the motorcycle or vehicle illegally - without a drivers license valid in country of accident without 3rd party insurance, expired registration or plates, illegal or even questionable title transfer etc your insurance could be declared null and void - just read the small print on literally every medical insurance policy.

As for the United States, although spending the most on healthcare, is now ranked #37 by the World Health Organization when compared worldwide, Spain is ranked #7 and Argentina #75.... but with access to the finest care available in Argentina, the U S is the last place I would like to return to for medical care. Medical malpractice in the U S is the third leading cause of death.

During the past ten years all of my medical has been excellent and paid for by the local insurance companies covering me as a expat in Argentina and Spain. And when Elisa fractured three toes in southern Colombia - she slipped on a muddy trail, all expenses were quickly reimbursed once we returned to Buenos Aires.

Comments and questions welcome

Eat, Drink and buy insurance

xfiltrate

Fantastic thread and great information.

US citizen here pondering longer term travel as well - and highly agree with the sentiment of carrying insurance full time. We do indeed spend the most on med care here - at least in terms of %GDP - without carrying the best care necessarily. I know folks who are struggling through medical crisis (s) WITH insurance - and they are still being slowly depreciated financially. Not headed in a good direction.

I'm after travel medical/repatriation/emergency evac as well and have only begun my investigations. One that's renewable and works in concert (transition) with purchased policies in the states. Figuring out who covers what and when is a real chore, and only starting to become clear.

I'll be paying attention to this thread for sure!

Thanks for the kind words

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1990 Landcruiser H60. Full rebuild completed 2014

Good morning everyone.
Ok time to return to this topic as I am now back in England preparing for the next stage. My last years insurance with Campbell Irvine has run its course, time for a new quote.

Next years travel is set to be South and Central America. Same plan, travel by motorcycle as the primary means of transport. A phone call to Vanessa at Campbell has produced a quote of £883. Now my plan is to go through the thread contacting each company mentioned and seeing how it pans out. the aim is to ensure I get an appropriate level of cover for myself, not cheap insurance. the price war issue is something else. I want to be safe and adequately covered not paying for a worthless piece of paper. To this end I ask some very specific questions of each company.

So as I go through it I will post results back up here. as usual any comments and questions are welcome.

First company, Alpha Travel insurance. They are unable to quote as to qualify the insured must have lived in the UK for at least 6 of the last 12 months. As I have been away for a year I am excluded.

Next is 1 Stop Travel insurance. At 46 I am unable to use the backpackers policy and have to take out a single trip policy. Cover for the bike ( 950cc ) is ok. I questioned their wording as it stated " incidental use " within the wording of the policy. I explained that the bike was my home and principle mode of transport. I gave last years mileage of 20,000 as a guide to the use I expected. The gentlemen checked and confirmed this would be acceptable. I questioned their definition of a road due to the off road nature of overland travel. Again this was checked and the consensus is that if it is shown as a road on a map it's a road. I have the policy document to look at. But, for me there are 2 sticking points. First the quote is almost half that of Campbell Irvine. this makes me question the level of cover hence getting the document to read. And secondly I cannot return to England whilst traveling for a visit, to do so ends the policy as it is a single trip. I always hope to return for my daughters birthday, this means two policies over the year.

Lots more to do. Not as much fun as the travel but important stuff.

The UK travel insurance industry is a rip-off like most things. Many just won't cover you on a motorcycle, so you're fine unless you are in a bike accident. Holidaysafe (who I used for Morocco) do cover bikes which is good as it applies even to their their longstay policies as well as their bike specific ones.

Now things get interesting when talking about an extended trip. Sure many companies do long-stay insurance, but often they require proof of a return ticket (which man overlanders won't have) or proof of intent to return to the UK. What counts as proof will be up to the varying insurance companies.

Longstay insurance form most companies is up to 12-24 months. So after two years maximum you need a new policy, which in a lot of instances you can't buy if you're already out of the UK. Those that do allow you to purchase insurance when already abroad, hike up the charge. I've seen this be up to four times as much as the initial policy.

Another thing to note is, don't rely on travel insurance for anything other than medical cover. The values and excesses on property and items are pitiful, you'll need separate cover for those if you're worried. On the subject of medical cover, don't be fooled by the big numbers e.g. £5m, £10m, £20m cover. In the history of the earth there has never been a medical expense claim on a travel insurance policy over £2m, so don't pay extra for cover you don't need.

@Zedsded - I don't know your circumstance, but your quotes so far seem pretty high. Make sure you are only covering what you need to. I'm expecting to pay around £75 for 6 months in South America, but then I'm only treating the insurance as health cover so not concerned with lost baggage, stolen phones, additional payouts for injury etc..

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My blog about touring and adv riding

Ok, Monday morning and back on the trail. Lessons learnt so far; It would seem that I cannot get a policy that will allow me to return to England during the year for a visit. Multiple trip policies have time restrictions on travel and single trip is exactly that, a single trip. I can pay for six months, return and then renew the policy on leaving again. Not the best scenario financially.

So for now I am asking for two quotes. One for a year and then another for six months.

So far;
Trailfinders. No problems with covering the bike, it is a 50% loading on the premium. One year is £733 and six months is £444. Policy documentation is on the website for me to read and confirm.

World Nomads. Cannot over cover if you are motorcycle touring, or the motorcycle is your main means of transport.

1 stop. Well I checked this out again this morning. £270 for a year cover on their standard policy, again asked the question about the bike on the phone and was told it is covered on the standard policy, they do not make an additional loading. Also interestingly when I explained the difference in the prices between themselves and other companies the young lady said that I should make a note of the time and number I have called from. She explained that all calls are recorded and I should be confident that the cover for the bike is included. Any questions after the event the call could be referred back to.

So at this point I am going to read through the policies I have received and see what I make of them. Starting with 1 stop!

zed, I've taken out numerous policies with 1Stop over the last few years - at least 10 times on different occasions since July 2008 - BUT never had to make a claim, therefore I can't really vouch for the company's integrity if you ever get into trouble.

Prior to July 2008, I used to always insure my travels through the Post Office. I forget who the underwriters were at the time. The PO was comparitively expensive back then - probably still is, I don't know, because I've never bought from them since that time. I thought prior to July '08, that insuring through a trusted high street organisation, such as the PO, that was (and maybe still is) prepared to include travel by MC without engine size limits .. then you would be in safe hands if anything went wrong.

More Background
In July 2008, returning from Toronto to Gatwick airports, on reclaiming my baggage from the carousel, I notice that my then expensive (£1K) laptop, plus all my software discs and other peripherals, had been nicked from my checked-in bag by some thieving b@stard baggage handler 'air side' at either YYZ or LGW. All my photos, diary notes etc, on the hard drive and back-up discs .. gone!

I reported the incident to the police at both airports, and attempted to make a claim from the PO for the stolen items .. only to be told that computers + accessories and software are defined as 'Valuables' by the insurer, and should not have been packed within my checked-in bag; I should have carted these items in my carry-on bag instead. The policy wording confirmed this .. and therefore I had no choice but to abandon the claim.

I've checked all the independent [so-called] reviews I can find from the various consumers sites about 1Stop. Mostly okay opinons .. a few disgruntled customers. Very typical stuff really.

Upshot is, from July 2008 onwards I have thought, 'why bother with expensive crap insurance, for instance, the PO's offering .. when you can just as easily buy cheap potential crap?' Hence I've been effecting cover with 1Stop most of the time since July 2008.

Anyway, good luck with your insurance decision. I hope you never need to use it, claim-wise, whatever you end-up buying into.

Keith

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Right Way Round ...

One problem is, the world is now ruled by mediocrity. If you don't fit into the majority, i.e. 2.4 kids, mondeo, estate house and 2 weeks in spain each year, then the computer has trouble recognising you as human. That then means you have to go for a specialist, which means more overheads, so more expensive, and less competition, so more expensive.

The fact that someone didn't read their policy wording and so wasn't covered doesn't mean the insurance is crap, it means you didn't do your homework. Personally, I would never check something as valuable as a laptop with all my travel pictures into the hold, it's asking for trouble, which is why it wasn't covered, your expected to take 'reasonable care' to mitigate risk. I've had a few 'discussions' with some of our flight staff recently about checking their medical bags into the hold on their way out to a job, it's ridiculous. We have had drugs go missing that way and we've now made it a disciplinary offence to check your drug bag into the hold. I really wouldn't have thought it was necessary to take that step, these are supposed to be intelligent people, but we have!

That of course is before we get onto the matter of how baggage handlers treat your bags, I really wouldn't put anything more fragile than a brick in there!!

The reality, whether you like it or not, is motorcycling brings a higher level of risk, as does being older, as does being away for longer. Thats why sub £100 policies cover you for 30 days and don't let you ride anything bigger than a moped, won't cover you for America etc etc!! It doesn't mean insurance is a rip off, it means your a high risk! It takes a lot of £200 policies to cover a million dollar claim.

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1990 Landcruiser H60. Full rebuild completed 2014

By the way, check the size of bike covered on your policy. We had 2 in 2 days declined last week because the bikes were over the covered size. Fortunately they were in Europe so treatment was covered under EHIC, although one was in Spain so he still had to stump up £3k and they won't get the repatriation they really need without having to pay.

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1990 Landcruiser H60. Full rebuild completed 2014

Ok, firstly thanks for the replies. Moggy I know exactly what you mean about ruled by mediocrity! Just asking some questions of the insurers has stumped a few of them.

On each occasion I state the bike is a British registered 950cc motorcycle and is to be my primary means of transport. My mileage last year was 20,000 and I expect a similar amount this year.
As for the returning issue. Well I am still not fully decided on that, however for financial reasons it may well be impossible anyway. Extra flights have to be included as well. So to keep things simple I am just getting the single trip quotes at present.

Currently;
1 Stop. I have read the policy and motorcycle use is covered with the wording stating incidental use. Their definition of incidental being occasional or casual use. They insist my usage is acceptable and that the recording of their saying so is proof. I have asked them to confirm the acceptance in writing and this is where it has been left. I will wait and see. The gentleman on the phone didn't like being pushed into a written response and said I could buy the policy and then ask for the written confirmation. So for me one stop is probably not the place.

Trailfinders. I asked again about the bike and was put through to the bespoke team. I have a clearly worded email to confirm cover for the bike is acceptable; " We are able to provide cover for a 12 month trip where your primary mode of transport is a motorcycle, for a 50% additional premium. This would not cover you for liability or the bike itself as this should be covered under your motor insurance. There are no mileage restrictions but the cover would be under the condition that you wear the appropriate safety gear including a helmet. " This is the same loading Campbell Irvine are imposing. Cost, £733.

So far Trailfinders are in the running. More calls to make over the next few days.

I should also point out that for me in all this it is really only the medical cover I am concerned over. I travel alone and want to know that if the worst happens I am covered. It may sound a little flippant but losing my stuff is of no issue. I have in my mind written off all my gear anyway. I live on the bike, all I own is there but it is just stuff. I am not precious about a few hundred pounds worth of tent, cooker and gear. However if I am unconscious and in a foreign hospital I do not want my family to be arguing with the insurance company about the level of cover, 20 years in the emergency services has maybe given me this approach. I also believe in you get what you pay for. I Stop's cheaper quote but reluctance to provide clear wording is a case in point, but I will await their response.