Due to all the criticism and the fact that the top gear team have been subject of all kinds of what they say are false claims and mis-doings of stirring things up as well as also pressure from the Argentinians to apologise Top gear have decided to let their 350 million regular viewers from 170 countries across the world make up there own minds as to what happened.
So we can all see for ourselves - the Argentinian Christmas special will after all now be transmitted and shown in two parts on 27 and 28 December.

Jake.

I think Clarkson is a arrogant tosser myself, i only watch the show for the power laps & more often i do that on Youtube now, the adventures they started doing are pretty childish & hardly entertaining.

Each to their own i guess.

Mezo.

good, some people take things too seriously.

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1990 Landcruiser H60. Full rebuild completed 2014

Clarkson himself states in his weekly rants in the press they are simply enterainment for the mass - more like scenes from the silly antics of the ''Last of the summer wine'' crew (A tv program set in Yorkshire for those that do not know it) - i don't think he with his massive road crew and back up cl;aim to be real adventurists. He openly admits having local guides and fixers for everything to make the programs work. Top gear and Clarkson are not really try to claim this to be real adventures - not like the knarlly stuff everyone gets so uperty and protective about.

Its tv entertainment nothing more.

What you think of him or anyone else is obviously your own view - nothing wrong with that.

However some people do take the show and the protection of Adventure stuff far too seriously. I remember when we used to call it touring - back in the day before it became trendy to be an adventurist.

Jake.

I'm still not sure when I stopped motorcycle touring and started adventure biking. Probably the first time I went out of the country on a set of knobblies rather than road tyres. Or maybe it was when I started using MX boots rather than regular shoes. Either way, none of that old fashioned stuff for me nowadays - unless it's a retro tour where I set off in an ironic way, deliberately using that inferior 70's or 80's stuff to remind myself how far the bike world has come.

Unlike many of the contributors to this thread (and other similar topics elsewhere) I quite like Clarkson. I don't know him, have never met him (and given my lifestyle these days I'm unlikely ever to do so) so I can't make a judgement on what he's actually like but I find most of his TV stuff amusing in a lightweight comedic way and most of his written stuff well constructed and interesting to read even if it is deliberately hyperbolic and occasionally provocative. Most of the time, both on tv and on the page I can see the joins, and I find that endearing as well. As was said it's all very "last of the summer wine" with all three of them playing their parts close to perfection. Top Gear really is the bastard love child of Dad's Army, That's Life and Whicker's World (sorry to anyone not UK based ), weaned on a diet of petrol and tyre rubber, and with Clarkson the perfect inheritor of Captain Mainwaring's bluff, bluster and pomposity. It really wouldn't work if he (or any of them) were Mr Bland (see Top Gear USA as an example). The show is OTT fantasy so they have to be larger than life as well.

I'm impressed that they've managed to keep the format going for so long and a lot of hard work obviously goes on behind the scenes. As a moneyspinner for the BBC I just hope they don't push Clarkson too hard. It looks like he has a substantial workload, he doesn't look like the fittest of blokes and he's getting on a bit these days as well.

As for bikes, well, who cares. Clarkson's comments on them are in much the same vein as his comments on everything else from politicians to pots and pans. - something to be admired more for the delivery style than in the substance of what was said, more Leonard Sachs than high court judge (again sorry to non UKers). If bikes were an integral part of the show they'd need a seriously good 2 wheel stig to stunt ride for the cameras and there's not really much visual impact in just riding fast with the wheels in line. Other than the occasional hot climate comedy trip (Vietnam) it's logistically a lot harder to do some wacky project on bikes than in cars / boats etc. Not only that but bikes are almost all cheap enough for them to be affordable (more or less). Most of the cars are all wet dream fantasy stuff subsequently shown to be useless as actual transport. I'm happy they stick to four wheels and leave the bikes to us.

I remember very well my first big tour i went alone - (Adventure as they are now known) 1978 - bmw r65 road bike - uk / spain / morocco i was wearing a Lewis leather jacket (bad choice far to hot), levi jeans and some semi leather ankle high trainers and an open face helmet. The bike shod in road tyres on cast wheels of the time managed to cover everything that morocco could throw at it and me from dirt tracks to avoiding massive badly driven lorries. It was my first experience and to be honest i initially hated it - I was too hot and out of my depth in a culture i did not understand, nor feel very comfortable with, i suffered terrible with the trots and generally felt unwell - I loved a few places i saw Bhalil and its cave type houses, FEZ was intriguing both come to mind along with one or two other places along the way - but some places felt hostile and seemed dangerous - which they were not but it all was new to me and felt that way. I I was helped by and met some very friendly people but all said and done i was glad to get back to the UK on that occasion.

Oh bye the way i like clarkson - some of his writing and anedotes are both funny and pointed, he tries within the constraints of the BBC and the huge weight of the press industry that he writes for to raise matters in a comical and light hearted way often contrasting with the political correctness big brothers, along with the liberal extremism that has raised its head and controls thought and opinion by calling everyone , Homophobic, racist, sexist or whatever other ist's they want to label people with.
Jake.

Cleland you have taken a snippet of my quote and it seems conveniently left off the bit where i mention i thought many of the Argentinian servicemen were fine upstanding people - maybe that does not fit your argument.

Yes i have to agree i have not travelled in Argentina so maybe that part of my rant would be without grounds but i do not claim to have travelled there it was simply an answer to a question put to me.

In the world that i have experienced and lived in i am afraid not all people are nice nor are they all bad but i have met people from both sides of that coin some very nice and some wickedly bad.

I passed comment on some of the things i saw some of the bad guys had done - so i judged those guys yes, but not the Argentinian nation as a whole.

If we do not make assessments or judgement's based on our own experience or perceptions of events that happen in our lives or those around us - whether that is good or bad then what is the point - in travel, or any life experience. ?

Did i bash rtw sorry if i did - I did not mean too - its just an open discussion and he - i believe misquoted me.

I like to have debate its healthy to get things out in the open i also believe it is good to hear other peoples opinions/ views and experiences and have often had my opinion changed by listening and learning to other folks point of view and experiences on this forum or at travellers meetings.

If i have upset anyone at all i really am sorry for that.

jake.

ps

My rants and views are not personal or anything - maybe at worst a clash of opinion - but then again that might also need to be banned along with politics.

For once I see there are other's that see Crapson as the person he is. A player out of dad's Army, was well put. The problem is, some people believe what he say's or write's.
John933

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To buy petrol in Europe. Pull up at station. Wait. Get out a 20 Euro note, then ask someone to fill up the bike. Give person money. Ride away. Simple.

4. Gross Hypocrisy given your above post

5. Frankly, the whole thing is ridiculous. Getting so wound up over a car number plate on a car show because of some obscure and irrelevant connection to an event that took place 32 years ago on a show that any idiot knows shouldn't be taken too seriously is just ridiculous. Clarkson is just as capable of being rude about certain types of British people!!

6. Get a grip, there are more important things in life

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1990 Landcruiser H60. Full rebuild completed 2014

I think you need to research the home guard a little more carefully, because that statement is extraordinarily offensive to the memory of the brave men, many of them first world war veterans who knew only too well the devastation of war, who were prepared to take extraordinary (sometimes suicidal) risks to try and halt the German advance if it came.

Incidentally, Clarkson has done exceptional work for forces charities and is a fantastic supporter of the British military

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1990 Landcruiser H60. Full rebuild completed 2014

Dad`s Army is an English TV comedy.



EDIT: The picture is Captain Mainwaring from the aforementioned TV comedy quoting his favourite saying.

Mezo.

Discussion of the many points of view applicable to the Falklands/Malvinas is entirely relevant to travel in Argentina (and, by extension, to travel elsewhere in the world). Insults and name-calling directed at others posting here is not.

I'm too weary to start sifting through the posts above, editing out offensive content. Please take it upon yourselves to self-edit, or I (or other moderators) will feel compelled to remove whole posts or the entire thread.

Thanks much, and have a merry, friendly, mutually-supportive holiday!

Mark

yes, I am aware of that thank you

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1990 Landcruiser H60. Full rebuild completed 2014

Well, yet again, a selective bit of quoting from yourself to try and change the meaning of a post. You should go into journalism.

I don't believe thousands died during the making of top gear, which is what the get a grip statement was about, which I think is fairly obvious.

The separate statement to read a good book related to your request for a history lesson on the Falklands so to quote the 2 as though they are together is somewhat disingenious and missleading.

Try and read the posts properly, and not then take sections out of context to try and prove your own point, there's a good chap.

I presume your rather hysterical and missleading rant about thousands dying is in reference to the Falklands conflict, which as I say wasn't what I was referring to when I said there are more important things in life, but I suspect your knew that and your probably just being obtuse.

Thousands didn't die in the Falklands conflict, the official death toll is 907, but never let fact get in the way of a good bit of hysterical journalism eh!!

It's a debatable point that in Argentina the war actually saved lives. It meant a probably bloody conflict with Chile was avoided, while it removed a military Junta that had been in place for some years and had murdered many of their own civilians. Some estimates put this number at up to 30000 people killed between 1976 and 1983. Who knows how many more would have been murdered had the Junta not been topled by the war. A controversial point I know, but worth mentioning all the same.

I don't really see that the time of year has much relevance to the discussion, although the fact that the program in question is due to be aired in 2 days time probably does.

I spent 23 years serving as a member of the Army medical services, so spare me a lecture about the effects of war, I already know thanks.

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1990 Landcruiser H60. Full rebuild completed 2014

It appears to me that cultural differences between our nations - that is the people taking part in this discussion have formulated very different perspective,approaches and viewpoints to a country way down in the south Atlantic along with Argentina and inded Mr clarkson.
Maybe the British have a deep set loyalty to the Falklands these day because of the will of the Falkland people, the war and the losses of life - on both sides.
Maybe we can see the irony and humour of Clarkson that maybe is lost on other nations senses of humour.
Maybe the British having had a history being from ''old europe'' and not from the new worlds like America and Australia (Please note I say that with no offence to anyone). Then our perspective and reading into history (and Clarkson for that matter) differs from those other nations.

Lets all ''calm down and carry on''as they say - over here. So on that note I would like to say a veritable merry Christmas and a calm and pleasant new year to all of you wherever you are or whatever your views - that very much includes our good friends in Argentina.

Jake