Sorry to change the subject, but Craig, where and how are you going about learning the lingo, and how effective is it. I've thought about doing it myself... cant bear the thought of growing old in this country!!

Cheers mate!

Hi Leevtr, if it's any help in 1989 I returned from 3 years down under and went straight to Germany. I couldn't say more than about 40 words. I got a job anyway and a flat to live in. I went to a book shop and bought a book and dictionary. The first book was a waste of money as it was for a teacher. I didn't read German. I bought a correct book and spent 60 minutes in a supermarket getting the basic food for a few days. I had to look in the dictionary for milk. There were seemingly hundreds of milks! OK later I learnt some were yoghurts but you get the idea I was lost! I studied at home and got better rapidly. I first learnt how to ask ( in German!) "What is that in German please? I went to the adult evening classes that are available in ALL towns to help visitors learn the Sprache. I lived in Germany for 2 1/2 years and proved that it can be done. Loneliness was the biggest problem. It helps if you're outgoing. Work mates get together and drink, tease and joke after work and being unable to understand ithem is accepted and not a problem. Now with internet etc it must be even easier. Germans love to help a visitor trying to learn. It's a gold standard ice breaker with girls too.

So: Volkshochschule : adult evening classes.

Books and tapes from bookshops.

Library for books and to bump into someone for advice.

Go to pubs and read all the free magazines and papers.

Join clubs: motorcycle, gym whatever--drinking club?

Socialize and get out there and mix.

I worked in Germany and had no instruction other than some VHS
classes each week and met other visitors which helped keep off the
lonliness.

To move there you need 1 month's rent in cash, one month's rent in
advance and a deposit. You'll need cash to cover water, electricity and
gas. That's quite a slice. It's no bad idea to rent a stationary caravan
on a long term rate. Try zypresse in Freiburg for ads and an idea of
costs. Zypresse is a weekly free paper of ads. I don't know of any in
other areas. Regards, Linzi.

Cheers for the great reply Linzi. I've been going now every year at least a couple of times for about 4 years. Got a bit addicted to the Nurburgring you know!! I was in Baden Baden twice this year and loved it, although someone did say that Freiburg is better, more lively. I think i may well have to do some homework on this matter.
Cheers again,
Lee.

Hi, yes Freiburg is beautiful but as a slightly introverted and prone to melancholy person who needs only one person to relate to I found Freiburg soulless. I stress that's me. I was alone which didn't help. I only stress that each of us is unique and I picked the wrong part of Germany for me. I must say Freiburg has LOADS to offer though. Check out google earth west, over the Rhine to hills north east of the city of Mulhausen. this is a wonderful place to just chill out. In German it's Die Vogesen, in French les vosges. Rip roaring roads for a supermoto! Keeps your licence clean with your local Polizei! Now the gems of roads in the black forest east of Freiburg is no longer welcoming noisy, fast bikes. Disturbs the peace needed to make money from the other activities! The INCREDIBLE Schauinsland road near Freiburg is now closed to bikes on Sundays. Grr! Check out THAT snaking beauty on G Earth! The road is south east of the town leaving from a leafy suburb and as the hairpins rise up the hill the blood goes to the head and nether regions as the engine screams. After 20 turns and 250 metres higher the road shoots off for 6oom then snakes among the pines towards Switzerland. Twenty minutes later you'll dive down towards Lorrach and the crossing to the Confederation Helvetica or in English Biker Heaven! The Alps were created for turning petrol into extacy! Monday to Friday, no matter what the job entails the Alps are there. The only thing that is less good over there than here is that English is my mother tongue. I didn't have the emotional makeup or whatever to make it happen. Some people win the lottery and blow it all. That's what I did. ps the VHS classes are really cheap! Mit freundlichen Gruessen, Linzi.

What does ' freundlichen Gruessen, ' mean?

Sorry to everyone else, but this seems to be turning into a personal chit chat!!

Hi Leevtr, literally "with friendly greetings" but actually it's the standard sign off. So it is yours faithfully/sincerely. Easier than English for once. It has to be said that Germans in writing are still more old fashioned than we are. I deal with Germans on ebay.de and often meet the official side but it's not to be misunderstood. It's just protocol. Some sign off Mit Guzzi Gruessen and they are particularly easy going. As anywhere, some are serious, some less so but Germans still lumber themselves with some stilted writing style. I once asked a young German woman how a German would begin an e-mail to a 10 person specialist bike dealer and was surprised that the full official letter version would be used! In other words "Guten Tag". Always begin with Sie until you are invited to use du. That is unless she is young, gorgeous and your chatting her up! Other bikers too if not old. Bikers means not at work, so chilling out. We dropped the equivalent thou and thee years ago but it was just the same. The French is vous and tu of course. Mit Biker Gruessen, Linzi.

Think i might have to think about selling my road bike now, as i just purchased a nice shiny XR650R. Next for that big trip of a lifetime.
Oh my god what have i done!!

I did German at school (D-grade GCSE so not too good) then again at college as part of my engineering studies. However, if you've got some basic knowledge of the language, going there on your own for 2-3 weeks will improve your German more than a 1 night a week college course.

Was last there in May this year. Spent my first night on a campsite in Punderich on the Mosel. The guy that runs the place will tell you exactly the same as above. He lived in Edinburgh for a few years and basically taught himself as he had no knowledge of our language. He also did the same in Spain and also in Russia (Siberia) before resettling in Germany. He actually said he had to relearn some German as he'd lived away for so long. The second time I stayed there was on my way home after 2 weeks. An elderly couple from Dusseldorf, saw I was on my own and invited me to have breakfast with them. They spoke no English and I surprised myself how much my German had improved so I'm convinced that going there is the best way to learn.

The Germans are great people if you make the effort. At least try to speak some German and if they speak English, they will humour you at least. So many people make the mistake of thinking they'll offend people with their attempts so they don't bother trying which couldn't be further from the truth. For example, I spoke to a guy running a little food stall in Konigsee and I got a totally different response to the American tourists, who seemed to think if they just shouted very slowly in pigeon English, that somehow he'll understand .

BTW, I also have a Nurburgring addiction and need to get my next fix. Can't honestly say where I'd like to live in Germany. The Mosel has great people, great roads and the 'Ring is never too far away. The Black Forest is stunning. Didn't visit Freiburg, just passed through Baden-Baden but I quite liked Freudenstadt. The B500 from Baden-Baden to Freudenstadt is biking heaven. Drop your gear off in Freudenstadt and spend a day enjoying it. Some great roads around Fussen heading into Austria and also the Alpenstrasse. Berchtesgaden and the surrounding area is very nice but it's too "touristy" for all the wrong reasons. In all honesty though, I'd probably choose the Eifel for it's cheap property and as it's easily within 3-4 hours of the ferry in Holland, probably a little further to Calais.

Hi mate,
You dont need to to me about the 500. Rode it 3 times this year, the last time like a scalded cat. The local sportsbibe riders had trouble keeping up and i was on a CB 1300 naked. Fabulous road!!