I'm sorry to say that attitudes/approaches such as you describe encourage the view of tourists as walking free supermarkets, with all the accompanying corruption of values in the local people. Kids run out screaming "Donnez-moi" this, that, and the other. You cause the people to think we are idiots whose sole function is to give stuff away. How would you feel if your kids ran after tourists in the street, begging? You'd be ashamed, I hope.

You CANNOT become a substitute for failings in a country's education policy. It is naive sentimentality to think you can.

There's plenty of child poverty in your own country. But it's not so exciting to address that, as handing out pens in Morocco, causing problems for locals and visitors alike.

I have to agree with Caminando on that one.

On some of my various travels in the past I have been inclined to give "gifts" to people who have been particularly helpful to me. Though I'm developing the opinion that it's not generally a good idea. When people voluntarily help others, it's usually for the sake of helping, not to get rewarded, and it would be a shame to corrupt that frame of mind.

It's also a shame that more and more places I go to, I seem to get constantly pestered by local folk because they think that foreigners are a sure thing for a dollar or two.

If you want to help, I think it's better to do so through a charity such as UNICEF or similar, where your donation can be well managed and part of a bigger plan to help. Also there's the benefit that from the point of view of the locals, the donation is comming from the richer world as a whole, represented by the charity organisation. In this way, the locals get some aid and support, you get a clear conscience, and travellers could be free of hassles.

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BD.

If the guy had said he was giving the stuff to kids in the street,that would have pissed me off because that would be encouraging kids to beg in stead of going to school.Never give anything to kids in the street as their miserable parents send them out to work and they stay home drunk,drugged out or whatever.
But I fail to see why going to a school with a contact you,ve picked up on the Hubb is wrong.
In most of our work in rural communities the first thing we do is hand out backpacks,books,pens etc just as a little gift to make the kids smile that day.
So lets leave thing to huge bureaucratic charities,you,ll never see them in real life.
So lets be clear here all you selfish and brainless guys can take books,pens etc to any third world schools and hand them out to the kids yourself,make them all smile and laugh for 5 minutes and not be the cause of any national or economic strife.
SO WELL DONE LINZI
Al theturtleshead

[quote=Ekke;210409]I had started a thread in the Sub-Saharan Africa forum lamenting the fact that all the challenging routes from Cairo to Cape Town were in the process of being paved. Bye bye adventure!

Uganduro piped up with the friendly quote above insulting anyone who would think of doing the Cairo - Cape Town for the adventure. You "filthy rich overlanding types"!

So, are we all being selfish and brainless if we are sad to see the end of the adventure?[/quote]


Lets just leave Uganduro to save the planet, eh, Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

Hi Al,

Fair one mate - agreed.

Good for you

Never see what in real life? :confused1: The charity, local people, donations or the benefits of donations? Because it's easy as to witness everything especially if you directly donate your time and/or money on site in a community. I've done it.

That sounds like a conscience quick fix to me. What about the long run?
"Huge bureacratic charities" have their place.

__________________
BD.

There is no quick fix.All there will be is some smiling kids with a happy memory!!!
Al theturtleshead

Done the time and money thing for charities here in South America and generally not come away happy.
Al theturtleshead

I meant a conscience quick fix for whoever's taking the stuff - not the kiddies.

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BD.

That's a shame mate. I know, perhaps, a dozen people who have done it and all felt (myself included) it was a very positive experience for both sides. But then, not everyone will have such a good time.

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BD.

If everybody,s happy where,s the problem?
Al theturtleshead

Another fair one, mate. I guess it's all good if the folk doing the giving are doing it for the right reasons, and I suppose it isn't a bad thing even if they're not. If those who can, help those who need it then, as you say, it can't be bad.

__________________
BD.

Having both traveled in and worked in Africa (TZ) I can say is that for people who like to ride we have at least another century of places to visit on this continent. We just have to look at Africa, the only countries that really have infrastructure is Namibia, south Africa etc. That in it self says something.

Try the 80 km stretch North East of Livingstone, Zambia to see what the major highways are like. Ok there is a Chinese company building a new road there now because the money they kept donating for it to be done kept going missing?? Anyway another year and it should be complete.

Has anyone ever rode on the major highways in Mongolia?? They are all 100 mts wide all over the country, people just drive anywhere and this is what damages the environment more so than a major highway.

Africa does need a major road system so they can move produce and freight around and across the continent. So I say yes let the large companies do this. We don't have to ride on them do we? Or if we need to get somewhere in a hurry use them. Everywhere changes, it must. Maybe its not for the better for some but it is progress and that happens everywhere.

Personally I love to ride around Africa, it thrills me to see how this place works, or doesn't work! I am happy at present that they have not made many places "World Heritage" there yet as they have in Australia. Just try and go into the rain forest in North Queensland now!!

We all know that the majority of us aren't filthy rich, ok maybe there were 2 riders and camera crew and back up cars that did the ride that were but over all most of us only own the bike and whats on it when they do this trip.

Anyway, I say enjoy while you can.

Cheers

Well I have to explain a little. I have thought through all the pros and cons of aid and I feel it right to help some people in two tiny, Saharan oases. I am taking the things to the teachers to distribute so I am not in the picture. Personally I'd rather run over the scum in UK who need help. There's supposed to be a system in what's supposed to be a democracy. Funny Al we're both Scots. Linzi.

On second thoughts. While I live on the south coast of England and find the people unfriendly and selfish not by any means all English are so. It's just concentrated down south and especially in London. On the problems of charity I agree it is a mine field. But in contacting one of the teachers I learnt of their own association set up to help the people of a really remote oasis. Two Singer sewing machines were donated by some Belgians. This is to, "help the women earn some money". I am a bit taken aback at the apparent sexism but I am just a visitor and neither critic nor changer. There are only 10 children and the school is seemingly a shaded wall or room with no roof. I wish to help them and decided to do so. If others don't want to that's fair enough. Criiticize this and I'd say something rude which I'll hold back from saying. Linzi. Live and let live.

On third thoughts. If anyone's interested in an advanced, well thought through aproach to helping in a poor country it's worth checking out a site set up by a Dutch woman. Sahara Roots - Home She wrote a booklet for the children in a Moroccan village. The village suffers from thrown away rubbish and encroaching sand dunes "desertifiction". The beauty of her idea was to return after a few months and question the children on their understanding of the story. The best answer recieved a prize. The idea to show that nothing comes as a freebie. I am still using my limited IQ to try and apply the same to my trip--seriously any ideas would be welcome. I can give the teachers useful materials but the toys/ activities side of it has been worrying me for a week or two now. Who wouldn't want a football as a six year old? All the things I am taking will be the responsibilty of the teacher so I don't upset any of the social structure. And I don't know if I can match numbers of items to numbers of kids. A little research into Morocoo will show that there's racism, prejudice and lack of Government help in these areas. In one the Government in 1971 built a dam to "better distribute the water from the Atlas mountains" to the towns at the foot of said mountains. This stopped the flow of the water 400 km south towards the Sahara. Nothing short of disastrous for the people living along what had been a river. In this case some of those people are trying to help each other. So I shall "lend a hand". Then I'll go tearing around destroying the peace and quiet and endangering the locals as I normally do. Linzi. Loud pipes save lives!