In Der Spiegel interview German finance minister rules out Britain’s chances of enjoying bloc benefits from outside EU

This is a really interesting point - as mentioned previously, if Britain were to vote Brexit and it would not be tenable for the UK to have further access to the common market, given if it did, like Norway, it would have to uncontionlaly accept most of the EU rules and regulations. Otherwise it would not be democratic. Why are people voting Brexit again?

Seems to be a common theme of spamming the HuBB with irrelevant posts and links.

Anyway everyones forgotten the 3rd option

I considered posting that about a week ago, but desisted.
I recall that someone or other is looking for the culprits with a sense of humour.

Of course, men (young ones anyway) are always looking out for the beaver.

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Dave

I'm enjoying some of the posts on this thread, even though it's outside of the normal non-political remit of HUBB, but it's important that when you disagree with something you 'play the ball, not the player'. By all means politely disagree with a post and present an alternative view but calling fellow HUBBers rude names is just not on.

__________________
"For sheer delight there is nothing like altitude; it gives one the thrill of adventure
and enlarges the world in which you live," Irving Mather (1892-1966)

Back on the economic tack, "well, he would say that wouldn't he" but he is also quoted, separately, to the effect that Germany would cut a trade deal with the UK asap after a Brexit vote so as to protect the German car manuf industry.

This is him, by the way:-
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wolfgang_Sch%C3%A4uble
I referenced a day or two ago what the German (lack of) balance of payments is doing to the rest of Europe, and the Eurozone in particular.
Here is the more technical description:-
https://ineteconomics.org/ideas-pape...cing-conundrum

As it happens, Herr S is ignoring international treaties of the WTO.

The broad theme contained above is known as "moral hazard" - well worth a bit of research for anyone who is interested and has the time.

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Dave

None of the graffiti artists round here could spell that. I blame the politicians or the immigrants or the EU or....

Andy

Definitely the immigrants....they come over here and steal all our jobs and write on all our signs

............ there were 4 elections in the UK yesterday.
The Conservatives just got wiped out in four elections overnight (IMAGE) | The Canary

The times they are a changing.
Just another protest vote, probably - nothing to do with the ref in two weeks or so.

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Dave

Originally posted by Walkabout:
"What struck me are the similarities between the individual US States, their relationships with the federal government and the situation between the EU and it's current 28 members.
Fundamentally, Germany does not want to carry the debts of the southern European countries, such as Greece, any more than the central government of the USA, which does have a common currency, wants to bail out Puerto Rico."

Wallkabout, I have been wrestling with your post mentioning Puerto Rico's need for a bailout - although Puerto Rico is not one of the fifty United States, Puerto Ricans are American citizens as pointed out here on the floor of the House of Representatives by Speaker of the House Paul Ryan. Hours ago....

House passes Puerto Rico rescue | TheHill

"Ryan made a moral case for the bill, arguing that the island's 3.5 million residents — who are American citizens — need Congress's support. "
"The Puerto Rican people are our fellow Americans. They pay our taxes. They fight in our wars," he said. "We cannot allow this to happen."

Needless to say, the Puerto Rican bailout bill passed the House of Respresentatives yesterday because Puerto Rico faces default on 2 billion dollars of debt payments on July 1.

Could, or would representatives of the E U ever make a moral case for, let's say bailout loans to Greece because the citizens of Greece are our fellow citizens of the European Union, they pay our taxes and they fight our wars?

Interesting to consider either way. Based on many years living and traveling within the European Union ..... I have heard a Spaniard complaining that "the French are prejudice against us, the French don't like the people of Spain.. We, the Spanish are not prejudice against the French." And then when the same Spaniard was asked "what about the people of Morocco," his answer was "a blank stare."

It would not be fair to characterize the majority of the Spanish as above, my point is that the EU is also facing prejudice of nationalities.
xfiltrate

The Week in Review.


Gosh – what a busy old week it has been and what weak week it has been for the poor, desperate REMAINIACS and their Project Fear. Let's see, where to start…


How about today and work backwards.


this is how they view democracy

Tory Peer and REMAINIAC Ros Altman sent out this twitter today:



Majority of MPs in all 3parties want to stay in EU. They're your democratically elected leaders. Voting Brexit overrules your own MPs

Majority of MPs in all 3parties want to stay in EU. They're your democratically elected leaders. Voting Brexit overrules your own MPs
— Ros Altmann (@rosaltmann) June 9, 2016

In her world our vote in a referendum does not count, it is MP's anyway who should decide this for us. Oh - Rosalind Miriam Altmann, Baroness Altmann, CBE appointed by Vichy Dave as "pensions expert" wasn't elected to her lofty position. A true example of a "europhile" with obvious ambitions to be an EU commisioner. Remainiacs are the gift that keeps on giving.

Do as you're told by your betters – or show her who leads whom on June 23rd and Vote Leave




from yesterday

Nine Out of Ten Economists...

Remember the oft repeated "nine out of ten economists" oppose BREXIT? We found out this week how they arrived at that figure:-

The figure was based on a self-selecting Ipsos MORI survey of economists from the Royal Economic Society and the Society of Business Economists.

The survey was sent out to 3,818 economists. Only 639 (or 16.7%) replied, of which 561 said Brexit would be bad for the economy. That’s just 14.7% of the total number of economists contacted. So rather than nine out of ten economists warning against Brexit, it was actually closer one in seven. Quite a lie from Gideon “Haw Haw” Osborne and Vichy Dave don't you think?


Clearly they think you are a mug. If you think you are not a mug – Vote Leave


from the day before:


Let's dig a great big hole and bury the EU in it..


and use this man's fine diggers with which to do it





earlier in the week


Just saying Good Bye:


Nigel's departing speech to the EU parliament:-

__________________

the week began with News From our Danish Cousins

Coming to a Town Near You
Daham Al Hasan fled from Syria to Denmark, leaving behind his three wives and 20 children. Under the Danish rules of family unification, one of his wives and eight of his children have joined him in Denmark. But Al Hasan wants all his children with him, as well as all his wives. Lawyers estimate that the remaining wives will be able to join their children in Denmark. The case has caused a shock not only because of what it will cost the Danish state just in child allowance, but because Al Hassan claims that he is too ill to work or even learn Danish. "I don't only have mental problems, but also physical problems..." He has admitted that his "mental illness" consists of missing the children he voluntarily left behind.
We all have rough weekends...

Pissed up Junker - again
This clown is the top EU man – head of the Comission no less. You can't sack him as you didn't elect him. The irony is He calls Hungary’s PM Viktor Orbán “the dictator” - at least he was ELECTED


In a rare sober moment this clown has threatened our country with severe retaliation should we vote to leave his rancid EU. The British people have stepped over better men to get to a fight. If you agree – Vote Leave


Monday Morning Blues

The “trougher” panicks
Acknowledging the inevitability of defeat, we see trougher Stephen Kinnock MP on the news sensing the end to his family's £12m serial looting and plundering spree of EU' taxpayers money. He's saying he is already organising a majority in parliament in a vote to maintain the single market and mass migration that goes with it when we vote BREXIT .

When we talk about the contempt for democracy amongst the EU oligarchs, here is a prime example. Leave means LEAVE.
Vote Leave.

From the same day
Have Mercy On Me
Johny Mercer MP who came out as a remainiac yesterday. He too ran a poll in his Plymouth constituency - they came out 74.1% for BREXIT with 400 respondents. His majority in the last election was 1,000. Doh!


After Brexit, Frexit? Poll Shows French Want a Referendum Too

Interesting research from Edinburgh University shows that 53 percent of French would like to hold their own vote on EU membership, and in Spain, Germany and Sweden more people are in favour of doing so than are opposed.

The report says the outcome of such a referendum in Germany and Spain would likely be “a firm affirmation of EU membership.” But the researchers found that in France and Sweden, less than 50 percent of respondents would vote to remain in the EU.

read the piece here on Newsweek:
After Brexit, Frexit? Poll Shows French Want a Referendum Too


Cameron on Turkey

Vichy Dave in the last few days as we all know says that Turkey "will not become a member of the EU until the year 3,000 AT THE EARLIEST and I would veto it" and that in no way should Turkey's accession influence how you vote in the referendum.

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A few posts have arrived since I started typing - this is a reply to Xfiltrate's earlier question.

"Could, or would representatives of the E U ever make a moral case for, let's say bailout loans to Greece because the citizens of Greece are our fellow citizens of the European Union, they pay our taxes and they fight our wars?"

Probably not, but I would like to hear of other views on the question.

As I understand things, it is the case that the ECB is not equipped to deal with fiscal inequality across the EU; that is the crux of the sovereign currency "problem" that I highlighted = the Euro is not sovereign, because it is a mere monetary union and not a full blown equivalent of, say, the US $.

But, the ECB has indulged itself in a few shenanigans that some commentators consider to have been illegal.
As I read things, because the ECB have stepped outside of their remit or have juggled monies between EU accounts without the authority to do such.

This was known as the Euro crisis of a few years ago - around 2010/11 or thereabouts. Now that "crisis" is not as acute - the private banks, many of them German because of the earlier loans to buy armaments and Mercedes Benz cars, have been paid off from their earlier exposure to Greek debt and the Greeks have generations of accumulated, rolling, further debt owed to the ECB and the IMF and to be paid in perpetuity; hence why would another nation pick up the Greek bill for membership of the Euro club?

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Dave

Vote on the poll that is just below the main headlines in the link to see the result at present (I voted "don't know").
EU referendum: latest news and guides

+
30K+ sample:-
http://www.moneysavingexpert.com/pol...-39dont-know39

__________________
Dave

I've never voted in my life....until now.....
I am no longer a 'ballot box virgin' and I have to say it feels rather good.

Here's the formula for my decision and it's based on my favourite hobby just to try to bring the whole topic into some sense in the bike world:

The total number of fingers in my gloves = 10
multiplied by
The number of wheels on my bike = 2
divided by
The number of years I have been riding bikes = 12
minus
The number of people who have told me I should not ride bikes = 100
multiplied by
The number of people who told me I should ride bikes = 3

Answer...-298.333

Had it been a positive number I'd have voted to leave. But it wasn't so that means I'm in.

And to me this formula makes about as much sense as any of the clowns who stand on a soap box and tell us what to do.

Sounds like bollox, but why not simpy toss a coin, double headed or otherwise?

__________________
Dave