Should Britain leave the E.U. ???
"White UK-born people"
What's your point there Tim? You seem to use that statistic rather liberally and with a negative spin without really saying why you find it a nuisance? Are you referring to the non-UK born but "white" people, i.e. The hundreds of thousands of Irish and Americans, (though many of them could be "non-White"). I'm a quarter Black though you'd never know it from me being a ginger- where would I fit in? Should we differentiate between pure white and mostly white? I never understood these sorts of classifications and to be honest I think they are as abused as they are arbitrary. Maybe you could expand on that?
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Originally Posted by Endurodude
One of the main problems is, as a result of the bungled way both Iraq 'wars' were handled, none in the West are at all keen to get involved in Syria. If the international community had LEGALLY stepped in when the civil war began, then much of what's now happening would not be happening. The problem with many of our leaders is they cannot think beyond their next election, irrespective as to whether it would be best globally or not.
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A short read about the FSA is quite revealing, who was funding it and how it was politically supported, etc. You're emphasis on legally was noted. The west have been after Assad for a while and I believe the 3 million or so refugees are a direct result of western intervention. NATO et al and whoever is running the show behind it are allowed to destroy counties and cause untold death, misery and suffering, the political frontmen are reshuffled and the war machine rumbles on.
Before the funding and arming of the FSA Syria was one of the most developed and progressive counties in the Middle East. It will take generations to overcome the destruction. Now it's just the latest stage in an absurd and unnecessary theatre of war between Iran, Russia and the West and Gulf States.
For whose benefit and interest does this new model of boarder less and never ending war suit? Iraq, Libya, Afghanistan, Yemen (note the near total media black out!) and now Syria. It's totally depressing, and yet after decades of bombing the Middle East the newest and best solution is more of the same. All for resources which we can no longer afford to use.
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Originally Posted by Endurodude
As to Ted's earlier point, I too began this thread thinking that we should not leave. I still hold this basic tenant, but I'd like some changes. Riding a motorbike, as many of us do, we are often at the sharp end of beaurocrats who make decisions arbitrarily, us having no recourse through elections to remove idiots who 'know best'. Although I'd like beaurocratic changes, I'm still a believer that we're stronger together.
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For me there is a lot of hyperbole and simple bias dressed up as intellectual debate - little in the way of facts or analysis. It's mostly as simple as EU is bad and must go. But why? The reason is mostly because it 'doesn't work', though it's not said why. Will the UK, Europe or the world be a better place without the EU? If so why? It's all strawman - attacks on the EU itself as an institution and little about the actual policies, laws or regulation which it enacts.
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