carnt beat good old oil on a chain !

My guess is someone bought the rights to use the method. It turned out not to work so well on the cam shafts and now they're looking for other ways to have some return on that investment. It might work on chains, who knows?


But I'll just keep pushing the primer bulb once in a while on my home made chain oiler system, thank you very much.

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Belgium to Nordkapp via Iran | Discover Overland | Destination World

modern o-rings chains are internally lubricated so no need to extra lub aside from protecting chain from rust in wet conditions if stationary.

Almost never lub my dirt bikes and chain is fine and last long,
adventure bikes only after rain or wash.

I lough at those ideas people buy into like e.g. automatic chain lubricators.
They do more damage to the chain actually as too much lub and dirt, sand etc is sticking to chain wears it out.

But hey, business myst go on LOL

I use chainsaw oil as it is very effective at cleaning the chain, not so much for actual lubrication.

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Belgium to Nordkapp via Iran | Discover Overland | Destination World

I used DID-X-ring chains which I found excellent- they do indeed have internal lubrification and the 'X' principle is that the tiny amount of lube is kept inside as the 'X' forms the 4 sealed contact points. However this does not reduce the friction between the chain links and sprokets and this is where some oil- there many to chose from- reduce wear and tear.
I also had fitted a vacuum-driven Scott-oiler which deposited a small amount of oil each time the throttle is closed and which has served me well in all sorts of terrain- and yes, I did turn it off and cleaned the chain before venturing into sand.

How patronising and dismissive of you 'mister' tremens to read that you 'lough' or rather 'laugh' at so many of us whom you don't know and who may actually know better- A response such as yours is not in keeping with the general spirit of exchanging practical and truthful informat ion on the Hubb without attempting to ridicule others- No bun fight- just factual. : very disappointing.

Guess who just got struck off my Xmas card list...

so no lube mr tremens !
Not only does oil on your chain keep it in much better condition , but also makes a smoother and more economical and quieter ....... fact after a lot of miles on bikes !!

How many miles do you ride in a year ?

Laugh all you like but that’s prime nonsense.

I have a comfortable quarter million miles of riding under my belt on various bikes: all them chain driven bar 2.

I’ve used those laughable automatic oilers you mentioned.

The times I have the chain has been clean when it would have been dirty and remained well-tensioned long after normally being slack.

So I don’t know which oilers you’re thinking about but it’s none of the ones I have had.

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Adventure: it's an experience, not a style!
(so ride what you like, but ride it somewhere new!)

So what's the payback period?

Total up the cost of the oiler, oil, fitting if not DIY then spread the cost over the chains saved, any spray lube not used.

My calculation based on a vacuum driven Scot-Oiler spraying used engine oil 20 years ago was 11 chains to be ahead. The POS was leaking, making a mess and dropping to bits after three. Using proprietary oil payback would be negative . Chains have certainly got better since then, I have barely followed oil sprayer development.

I'm sure it varies with types of oiler and bike spec (*) but a £50-£150 component to extend the life of a £60-75 one has to last years in a very hostile environment.

*My 11 year payback was based on an F650, a bike where the Italo-Austrian-Bavarian muppetry moonlighting as engineers specced a chain for a 48HP single Honda use on 21 HP twins.

I find it suspicious no sprayer maker can present data on payback.

There is also the matter of weight and the potential for failure of accessory level items to fail. The Scot-oiler leaking over the back wheel put the bike out of action for the time it took to remove it and clean up. I was lucky it wasn't a work day. I wonder how many people were stranded by cracked carb bodies from idiots tapping for Scot-oiler lines back then? I assume electric can blow fuses.

Why does no bike manufacturer offer one when they could sell you chain oil at £200 a gallon? They have no qualms about selling cooking spray at similar prices when their manuals don't mention it.

Andy

My oil fitting cost me nothing !
A used 20 ml syringe and a bit of plastic tube !
Placed in the right place on the bike !
never replaced a chain on a road bike yet , after 35 years of experiance .
So who is right then ?

Oh, mine was so much more expensive!
- €1.0 240ml Plastic bottle
- €0.5 primer bulb
- €1.5 silicon tubing
a bit of work and some tie wraps for mounting

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Belgium to Nordkapp via Iran | Discover Overland | Destination World

Sounds fair - lets face it, it isn't exactly rocket science - but it is a test of your memory unless you do it at the start of every journey.

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You will have to do without pocket handkerchiefs, and a great many other things, before we reach our journey's end, Bilbo Baggins. You were born to the rolling hills and little rivers of the Shire, but home is now behind you. The world is ahead.

I can see you've taken the time to work out a cost-benefit ratio to assess value.

Two aspects I'd add to it: one is the costs of cans of lube not bought, because I think all the longevigy claims I've read have been for chains lubed conventionally.

The second is harder to put a price on: peace of mind and a lack of hassle.

For me the figure is reasonable. I know how to tension a chain but don't particularly relish it as it involves putting an hour aside when all the walking a kilometer to my garage, faffing in the somewhat cramped space, and the walk back.

For my dad, when he still had a bike, that figure was much higher. He avoided chain-driven bikes and when he couldn't: scottoiler!

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Adventure: it's an experience, not a style!
(so ride what you like, but ride it somewhere new!)

I believe the issue is more physcological than mechanical.

Do you check the tyre pressures every ride? The manual does tell you to.
Do you inspect spark plugs? That's in there too.
How about removing brake pads to clean the dust out or going round the electrics with contact cleaner? Its beneficial.

The cavemen who set the ball rolling were dealing with totally different technology. I have had a chain snap, an original unsealed one on an Enfield. The other six unmushroomed heads just prove the quality is awful. The replacement had to be unsealed because they still limit themselves by a primary outside the secondary. That was Made in England, so rivets actually peened over, but still went slack every couple of hundred miles and did benefit from removal and soaking in oil. If this was the only technology all the faffing might be necessary and you'd hope someone would adopt the MZ solution or a Honda style shaft (no Bavarian cheese metal splines allowed in my garage after last time).

This is not current technology though. The O-ring chain on my CB500X has been adjusted once, 9000 miles ago when I binned the OE tyres. The dealers mechanic had set it bow string tight as a job creation scheme, but along with crap tyres and a total lack of grease is just one of those jobs you get with a new bike. My CB500F went through one chain in the time I had it. I'd have spent more time fitting an oiler and removing it to sell the bike. I should probably have eeked the original chain out to sale day, but it was a snap decision to sell and the new chain gave the dealer something to talk about.

To me they are consumables and the fact they are metal and mechanical doesn't change that. Run them slack, wipe with an oily rag to keep cosmic stuff happy, forget your Grandad and his tales of people having legs taken off, setting points at the roadside with fag packets, peeing in the tank to get the acetylene lights going etc.

Andy

I’ve ridden shaft bikes for more than 30 years but, through my wife, I have experience of chain bikes over a period of 16 years - 3 bikes, 1 with a Scottoiler fitted from new and 2 without - she now has a shaftie

As we all know, everyone is different, with a different lifestyle. But a couple of things I noticed.
1 - The Scottoiler made the chain and sprocket last longer - not a huge amount:
Without = 24K miles
With = 32K miles - TBO it still had some life in it but we were going off on a months holiday so she had it changed.
2 - Peace of mind. If you ride a lot, it’s 1 less thing to worry about (don’t forget everyone is different). When I say a lot, I don’t necessarily mean a lot of miles - a short commute every day, a ride out with the lads at the weekend, a month long summer holiday = an average of 6K miles a year in this case.

So, as always, you cut your cloth to fit