A new page entry has been added:

[drupal=2123]Carnet de Passages en Douanes - List of countries where it is Required[/drupal]

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Cheers,
Peter.

Europe to NZ 2006-10

Thanks Beddhist

I think this is an excellent initiative, but the African section will definately be extremely controversial! I expect there will be much heated debate on this thread shortly.

I can confirm from personal experience that it is possible to enter Burundi, Gambia, Ghana, Kenya, Malawi, Senegal (vehicle over 5 years), Tanzania, Togo and Uganda without a carnet.

There are also reports that most of the other African countries on the list (with the possible exceptions of Egypt and the South African Customs Union) can also be crossed without a carnet.

cheers

Ok, just to add to the confusion.

As far as i know, East Timor is not part of the Carnet system, however f you do what i did and try and enter the country without a Carnet (by shipping from Darwin) then you will spend days getting access to your bike and i ended up paying a deposit to the customs office of about $350US (in the form of a Timorese bank cheque). This was because i was effectively importing and exporting the bike ... i got the deposit back once i was back in Australia with the bike.

So, the reason is that East Timor was under occupation by Indonesia, which is part of the Carnet system. So if you go to East Timor and you have a Carnet then no problem.

I think it is similar is many places where the Carnet might just smooth the way ... sure you might get through with out it ... but it could take days of negotiation.

A little post-script to this story is that i recently went back for a visit ... and the customs building had been burnt down in the last period of riots and unrest ... so i took a photo of the pigs living in the ruins.

Hope it is useful to someone.

Zephyr

New Zealand - Not required, but recomended. You could pay duties otherwise (which will be refunded when you leave).

Cheers.

fire up the discussion i say...
You don't NEED a carnet in south africa (union)
Also, Sudan is split. South sudan does not use the carnet, northern sudan does.

Good idea with the list and of course there will be guys like me writing in saying otherwise, not disputting it just giving my experience, I went to these countries without a carnet, recently.
South Africa, Botswanna, Mozambique, Malawi, Tanzania, Burundi, Rwanda, Uganda, Kenya, Ethiopia, Djibouti, Yemen, Oman, UAE, Iran. So thats all WITHOUT carnet. Again just for info.

Cheers

Robbo

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www.hardwayhome.blogspot.com

NZ: we can discuss whether or not to recommend a carnet until the cows come home. There is no import duty any more, only GST (currently 13% ? on current value plus shipping). The procedure is said to be simple and efficient. I would say to recommend a carnet would have to mean a justification for spending the money on obtaining one just for NZ and I don't see that, given that you have to deposit even more money for the carnet plus you have the paperwork and expense. If you already have one, of course you would use it.

Sudan: very interesting. What happens then if you enter in the South without getting the carnet stamped and want to leave in the North? If your carnet got stamped in the North, can you get it stamped out in the South?

Robbo: consensus seems to be that Iran is impossible without carnet. How did you get in? Do you think anybody could do it at any border point? We entered Yemen at two different border crossings from Oman and the carnet was demanded at both. How did you get in without?

I've never been to Africa (apart from Maroc). Can others shed more light on the situation, especially SA customs union?

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Cheers,
Peter.

Europe to NZ 2006-10

Hi Guys, 2 years ago I rode from Scotland to SA and a carnet was asked for at the borders of Syria, Jordan, Egypt, Sudan, Ethiopia, Kenya, Tanzania, Malawi, Zambia and Zimbabwe. In Mozambique you have to buy a government issued permit and also local insurance as they do not recognise foreign issued carnets or a yellow card. SA, Botswana and Namibia, 1 stamp in and 1 out of their economic zone. I am sure that it may have been possible to fiddle the system but I am also sure that buying a carnet made life a lot easier and I suspect a lot cheaper than trying to bribe your way across borders. Ride safe, Mike.

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Mike
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Mike is riding the twisty road in the sky

We`ve just ridden the length of the Americas without a carnet, no probs. In New Zealand customs would`nt let me have the bike for five days! I had to have an interview to sort out the value, and therefore work out how much gst they would charge me. I got the money to them straight away but did`nt get it back for one and half months after we`d left!!!
I had the Carnet posted to me for Ozz, which was a breeze and now in Malaysia, again easy with it.
Broken down again, engine management sensor, 11150gs, beautiful place to be stuck thought!
www.pooleglobaltrek.com
Regards Pooley.

I'm not sure I'd travel without one any more. The carnet insurance doesn't have to cost the earth and the only tricky bit is getting the bank guarantee, mostly because it sometimes takes time to find out which department of your bank deals with them.

Senegal requires it. I hear it's possible to get a three day pass, but also hear that this can be mega hassle if customs are in the mood for 'fun'. Once at Diama, I came across a camper van which had been waiting for two days for customs to relent on the three day pass - they were determined not to.

Mauritania has its own local 'carnet' system, which is not expensive. They want to see yours if you have it.

Gambia asks for it, partly due to pique at Senegal's strong carnet policy. I don't think it's strictly required though. But given that The Gambia is surrounded by Senegal, you'll probably have one anyway.

Bissau asks for it. Don't know if you can get away without one.

I don't know the Mali status, I just used mine anyway and ripped through cutoms and police in about ten minutes.

Get a carnet unless you are on the tightest budget. Travel to see countries, not to sit on borders for days on end in extreme circumstances, arguing the toss and getting ripped off.

Going by the various tales that are around, on a major trip it could in extreme circumstances, coupled with a lot of bad luck, end up more cost effective to get a carnet than spending loads on paying 'fees' to get around not having one. Much depends on who is on duty at a given border on the day you turn up.

Borders often take minutes if you have a carnet and don't arrive at a busy time.

Just my view, neither right or wrong, just a view.

Craig

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www.motorcycleoutreach.org
www.globebusters.com

Thought the African section might get some comment!

Being Africa, there are no right or wrong answers here, but for West Africa, I am not really sure a carnet is worth the hassle. I have made it down to Togo to date (heading south) without a carnet. Whilst some border crossings initially ask you for a carnet, they will generally give in and allow you in with only a laissez passer or temporary permit.

The only real concern re the west coast route is South Africa, as there are reports that every other country (including Senegal) will let you in without one.

Agreed it might be a little more hassle, but if you consider the slight additional hassle at the border against the cost of the deposit or carnet insurance, I think it will generally work out much cheaper without a carnet.

Only my 2c worth.

cheers

Does the age of your bike make any difference for needing a carnet? I'm planning to go through Syria and Jordan next year on a 28 year old suzuki wich is only worth a lot to me.

Groeten

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What are you gona do about it?

I entered both Jordan and Syria in Dec 05 without a carnet. I understand that this is still possible, however I did see Maja's post a little earlier on this thread that suggests they may now require a carnet. If anyone has been in recently can you please confirm this?

cheers

Englishman traveling on a Belgium registered bike, 17 year old Honda AT

Just back from Syria, Jordan and Northern Cyprus (Nov 08) and I DIDNT need a carnet, however I did need to pay local customs temporary import tax and buy local insurance. Funny enough Cyprus was the most frustrating and complicated, simply because the customs girl didn’t know what to do…

I can look up the costs if required…

Great countries and I fully recommend them… very bike friendly even though they don’t have a bike culture.

Salut
Matt

Hello Matt,

It sounds like you enjoyed yourself.

I'm interested in what the costs for entering Syria and Jordan without a carnet are.
I'm also curious how you got to and from Cyprus, as I have a hard time accepting to pay €500 getting out of Israel.

Rinus

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What are you gona do about it?