Go Back   Horizons Unlimited - The HUBB > Planning, Trip > Trip Paperwork
Trip Paperwork Covers all documentation, carnets, customs and country requirements, how to deal with insurance etc.
Photo by Hendi Kaf, in Cambodia

I haven't been everywhere...
but it's on my list!


Photo by Hendi Kaf,
in Cambodia



Like Tree5Likes

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #16  
Old 12 Nov 2016
HUBB Advertiser
Veteran HUBBer
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Buenos Aires, Argentina
Posts: 957
Still interested in discovering if there is a Central American country that does not require minimum liability insurance for a foreign tourist's motorcycle/vehicle. Please, Tommytrojan - keep us advised if you find one.

All tourist auto/moto insurance policies have a clause stating that the insured vehicle must be "legal" indicating a valid TVIP for the country, a valid title and registration, plates etc. Not having any of these is cause for the insurance company not to pay liabilities or bail you out of jail. And, yes in the event of serious personal injury, death or substantial property damage the insurance companies do investigate - before paying liabilities, while you sit in a foreign jail.

I may be one of the very few posting here who has - while working for the IRC, actually visited foreigners in foreign jails because of vehicle accidents. It is not a pleasant experience!

Without valid insurance a foreign tourist could remain in jail for months, even years while waiting for a judge to decide fault. The local police, even federal police generally arrest everyone involved in a serious accident and let the insurance companies and a judge sort out fault. And, most people will more readily blame a foreigner than a neighbor.

Hiring a foreign attorney after an accident - without having valid insurance - is a nightmare.
Just as in every country it is very difficult to determine which attorney to trust . So, please do not risk riding a motorcycle in a foreign country without a valid TVIP, legal title, registration, plates, and valid insurance.

It has been my experience - that other than suggesting an "attorney," your embassy may not be of much assistance. The IRC is very under funded and understaffed but does try to keep tract of foreigners in foreign jails, a very difficult task as some arrests are never officially reported as required by international law.

xfiltrate

Last edited by xfiltrate; 14 Nov 2016 at 16:43.
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 13 Nov 2016
Registered Users
Veteran HUBBer
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Zagreb, Croatia
Posts: 427
I am very often quite blown away how people travel through some countries without paying the policy. In my experience, if my mind is pressured by thinking if I'm travelling and being not covered that the shit will hit the fence for sure. I am calling for a problem and probably will get one.
Not here advocating for this or that, just implying that there are cheaper places to safe the money instead of not getting the minimum insurance coverage.

BR
Dooby
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 13 Nov 2016
Registered Users
HUBB regular
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Posts: 21
Quote:
Originally Posted by xfiltrate View Post
Still interested in discovering if there is a Central American country that does not require minimum liability insurance for a foreign tourist's motorcycle/vehicle. Please, Tommytrojan - keep us advised if you find one.

All tourist auto/moto insurance policies have a clause stating that the insured vehicle must be "legal" indicating a valid TVIP for the country, a valid title and registration, plates etc. Not having any of these is cause for the insurance company not to pay liabilities or bail you out of jail. And, yes in the event of serious personal injury, death or substantial property damage the insurance companies do investigate - before paying liabilities, while you sit in a foreign jail.

I may be one of the very few posting here who has - while working for the IRC, actually visited foreigners in foreign jails because of vehicle accidents. It is not a pleasant experience!

Without valid insurance a foreign tourist could remain in jail for months, even years while waiting for a judge to decide fault. The local police, even federal police generally arrest everyone involved in a serious accident and let the insurance companies and a judge sort out fault. And, most people will more readily blame a foreigner than a neighbor.

Hiring a foreign attorney after an accident - without having valid insurance - is a nightmare.
Just as in every country it is very difficult to determine which attorney to trust . So, please do not risk riding a motorcycle in a foreign country without a valid TVIP, legal title, registration, plates, and valid insurance.

It has been my experience - that other than suggesting an "attorney," your embassy may not be of much assistance. The IRC is very under funded and understaffed but does try to keep tract of foreigners in foreign jails, a very difficult task as some arrests are never officially reported as required by international law.

xfiltrate
Thanks for the detailed info. That is important advise since until you need it you don't realize your are missing something. I'll keep you posted what I find on my way down there as far as insurance requirements are concerned. Also, even in the US, the legally required minimum is laughable. It might be advisable to get a more realistic coverage. According to my insurance agent an umbrella policy will give me world wide 'excess' coverage. I'll study the fine print and I hope that it will kick in where the 'official' liability ends. And I also hope I will never need to get to that point to actually need it.

Cheers,
Thomas
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 14 Nov 2016
Registered Users
Veteran HUBBer
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Wessex, UK
Posts: 2,136
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tommytrojan View Post
According to my insurance agent an umbrella policy will give me world wide 'excess' coverage.
I am not sure what this would cover you for but in the UK the excess is what you call the deductable in the US and might have no use or value at all without further local cover.
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 14 Nov 2016
Registered Users
Veteran HUBBer
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: NSW Australia - but never there
Posts: 1,235
Just to add to Xfiltrate's remarks regarding insurance, the number of overlanders and travellers getting around with shonky papers is quite high and while nobody seems to care too much when things go OK, we can be pretty sure the unsurance companies and police know exactly what to look for when things go wrong.

Quote:
One of the main benefits of the convention for motorists is the obligation on signatory countries to recognize the legality of vehicles from other signatory countries. The following requirements must be met when driving outside the country of registration:

Cars must display their registration number at the front and rear, even if legislation in the jurisdiction of registration does not require a front vehicle registration plate on cars. Motorcycles need display their registration number only at the rear. Registration numbers must be composed either of numerals or of numerals and letters. They must be displayed in capital Latin characters and Arabic numerals. In addition to this, the registration number may optionally be displayed in a different alphabet.
A distinguishing sign of the country of registration must be displayed on the rear of the vehicle. This sign may either be placed separately from the registration plate or may be incorporated into the vehicle registration plate. When the distinguishing sign is incorporated into the registration plate, it must also appear on the front registration plate of the vehicle.[citation needed] The physical requirements for the separate sign are defined in Annex 3 of the convention, which states that it must comprise black writing on a white oval background and that it must not form part of the vehicle's registration number. In practice, the requirement to display the white oval is mutually waived between some countries, for example between the European Union countries (where the white oval may be substituted by a blue strip on the Vehicle registration plates of Europe),[2] and between Canada, the United States, and Mexico (where the province, state or district of registration is usually embossed or surface-printed on the vehicle registration plate).
The vehicle must meet all technical requirements to be legal for road use in the country of registration. Any conflicting technical requirements (e.g., right-hand-drive or left-hand-drive) in the signatory country where the vehicle is being driven do not apply. [My note - this does NOT mean that operational requirements such as triangles, extinguishers, first aid, reflectors, reflective vest, speed limits, alcohol limits cannot be enforced. They can!]
The driver must carry the vehicle's registration certificate, and if the vehicle is not registered in the name of an occupant of the vehicle (e.g., a hire car), proof of the driver's right to be in possession of the vehicle.
This is from Wikipedia but you can read the whole convention is you need to check. Seems to me that it is clear from this that false or cancelled license plates don't comply and neither do forged or non-original document. Further, if there are any smog checks, MOTs or TUV or road safety checks that haven't been carried out, or vehicle declared non-operational or SORNed then the registration is invalid, the TIP that was issued is invalid and any insurance you get based on these invalid documents and false swearing is also invalid.

So far Ecuador is the only country that specifically provides liability insurance for foreign cars legally in the country (although good luck in trying to get official confirmation that this is so), although supposedly Bolivia doesn't require liability insurance if you are in the country for less than 30 days and possibly Brazil has something similar but trouble is nobody has explained to me who carries the risk if you have a serious accident in those 30 days.

-------------------------

There have been some very long discussions on a couple of international travel facebook groups concerning the problem of having valid insurance back in the country of registration. Some places insist on bundling domestic liability insurance in with the registration - eg Holland, some states in Australia, British Columbia etc etc so of course most travellers baulk at paying insurance while they are out of the country. In others, lack of MOT and TUV and similar automatically void registration. I think Switzerland has strict regulations on how long you can be away before registration is cancelled and plates have to be returned. Anyway, the big cry is well, since our country makes it impossible for us to retain legal registration if we are away for more than x years, then obviously we are FORCED (by our own country) to travel illegally and take our chances. Of course this is just nonsense because there are always legal alternatives INCLUDING of course just staying home, or where possible, buying a local vehicle legally and then selling it.
__________________
Tony
Click here for Travel Photos & Travel Map
Reply With Quote
  #21  
Old 14 Nov 2016
HUBB Advertiser
Veteran HUBBer
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Buenos Aires, Argentina
Posts: 957
An After Thought....

Thanks Tony LEE,

* In after thought....In response to those wanting more detailed information, please see the recent post from Tony LEE and know when I was responsible for welfare checks on foreign inmates in foreign jails - of the many I interviewed, none, not one, was "well" and none had been treated "Fair !!!" So there was no "welfare" to speak of, just men and women - locked away and desperate, and my reports described some real horrors, unimaginable to those who frivolously ignore the risk to their freedom, by not taking the time to purchase valid vehicle/moto insurance and verifying all vehicle/moto documents are legal.

Do not provide your insurance company a reason to avoid paying your liabilities and your attorney and never give any government a reason to deny you freedom.

xfiltrate
Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 Registered Users and/or Members and 1 guests)
 

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Balkans Insurance - Here's the story, with details & sample documents PanEuropean Trip Paperwork 30 8 Jul 2023 07:19
World Nomad's Travel Insurance JSerpa Trip Paperwork 9 8 Jun 2014 01:55
travel Insurance Public Liability and vehicle insurance vertical_c Trip Paperwork 8 19 Jan 2014 10:49
Travel Insurance policy includes 3rd party liability baz870 Trip Paperwork 4 9 Sep 2013 21:47
Liability Insurance to be Required on Mexican Federal Highways MikeMike Central America and Mexico 2 28 May 2013 05:35

 
 

Announcements

Thinking about traveling? Not sure about the whole thing? Watch the HU Achievable Dream Video Trailers and then get ALL the information you need to get inspired and learn how to travel anywhere in the world!

Have YOU ever wondered who has ridden around the world? We did too - and now here's the list of Circumnavigators!
Check it out now
, and add your information if we didn't find you.

Next HU Eventscalendar

25 years of HU Events
Be sure to join us for this huge milestone!

ALL Dates subject to change.

2025 Confirmed Events:

Virginia: April 24-27 2025
Queensland is back! May 2-4 2025
Germany Summer: May 29-June 1 2025
CanWest: July 10-13 2025
Switzerland: Date TBC
Ecuador: Date TBC
Romania: Date TBC
Austria: Sept. 11-14
California: September 18-21
France: September 19-21 2025
Germany Autumn: Oct 30-Nov 2 2025

Add yourself to the Updates List for each event!

Questions about an event? Ask here

See all event details

 
World's most listened to Adventure Motorbike Show!
Check the RAW segments; Grant, your HU host is on every month!
Episodes below to listen to while you, err, pretend to do something or other...

Adventurous Bikers – We've got all your Hygiene & Protection needs SORTED! Powdered Hair & Body Wash, Moisturising Cream Insect Repellent, and Moisturising Cream Sunscreen SPF50. ESSENTIAL | CONVENIENT | FUNCTIONAL.

2020 Edition of Chris Scott's Adventure Motorcycling Handbook.

2020 Edition of Chris Scott's Adventure Motorcycling Handbook.

"Ultimate global guide for red-blooded bikers planning overseas exploration. Covers choice & preparation of best bike, shipping overseas, baggage design, riding techniques, travel health, visas, documentation, safety and useful addresses." Recommended. (Grant)



Ripcord Rescue Travel Insurance.

Ripcord Rescue Travel Insurance™ combines into a single integrated program the best evacuation and rescue with the premier travel insurance coverages designed for adventurers.

Led by special operations veterans, Stanford Medicine affiliated physicians, paramedics and other travel experts, Ripcord is perfect for adventure seekers, climbers, skiers, sports enthusiasts, hunters, international travelers, humanitarian efforts, expeditions and more.

Ripcord travel protection is now available for ALL nationalities, and travel is covered on motorcycles of all sizes!


 

What others say about HU...

"This site is the BIBLE for international bike travelers." Greg, Australia

"Thank you! The web site, The travels, The insight, The inspiration, Everything, just thanks." Colin, UK

"My friend and I are planning a trip from Singapore to England... We found (the HU) site invaluable as an aid to planning and have based a lot of our purchases (bikes, riding gear, etc.) on what we have learned from this site." Phil, Australia

"I for one always had an adventurous spirit, but you and Susan lit the fire for my trip and I'll be forever grateful for what you two do to inspire others to just do it." Brent, USA

"Your website is a mecca of valuable information and the (video) series is informative, entertaining, and inspiring!" Jennifer, Canada

"Your worldwide organisation and events are the Go To places to for all serious touring and aspiring touring bikers." Trevor, South Africa

"This is the answer to all my questions." Haydn, Australia

"Keep going the excellent work you are doing for Horizons Unlimited - I love it!" Thomas, Germany

Lots more comments here!



Five books by Graham Field!

Diaries of a compulsive traveller
by Graham Field
Book, eBook, Audiobook

"A compelling, honest, inspiring and entertaining writing style with a built-in feel-good factor" Get them NOW from the authors' website and Amazon.com, Amazon.ca, Amazon.co.uk.



Back Road Map Books and Backroad GPS Maps for all of Canada - a must have!

New to Horizons Unlimited?

New to motorcycle travelling? New to the HU site? Confused? Too many options? It's really very simple - just 4 easy steps!

Horizons Unlimited was founded in 1997 by Grant and Susan Johnson following their journey around the world on a BMW R80G/S.

Susan and Grant Johnson Read more about Grant & Susan's story

Membership - help keep us going!

Horizons Unlimited is not a big multi-national company, just two people who love motorcycle travel and have grown what started as a hobby in 1997 into a full time job (usually 8-10 hours per day and 7 days a week) and a labour of love. To keep it going and a roof over our heads, we run events all over the world with the help of volunteers; we sell inspirational and informative DVDs; we have a few selected advertisers; and we make a small amount from memberships.

You don't have to be a Member to come to an HU meeting, access the website, or ask questions on the HUBB. What you get for your membership contribution is our sincere gratitude, good karma and knowing that you're helping to keep the motorcycle travel dream alive. Contributing Members and Gold Members do get additional features on the HUBB. Here's a list of all the Member benefits on the HUBB.




All times are GMT +1. The time now is 16:44.