Don't know anything about them, but what about the Aprillia MXV450? Only twin-cylinder small capacity trailbike I know of.

DL650 don't have much fairings, but it's essentially a road-bike with different suspension. Very little ground clearance and the engine is hard to work on (despite being open- e.g. twin-spark, but you have to remove/loosen the radiator to get to the one front plug). And valves are shim type, so not an easy adjustment if you're planning lots of miles.

AT's have lots of gizmos and unnecessary electronics. Generally they don't provide hassles, but to make it simpler for 'hardcore' touring, you could loose most of the fairings and unnecessary stuff, like trip-computer etc. Not that you need to work on them much, but if it bothers you. Engine is easy to work on: adjustable valves, fixed/electronic timing, etc. But never as simple/easy as a big-single like a Dominator or XR.

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Squily

The mxv sounds perfect but can't find one for sale. Seriously looks awesome though probably need to mod the seat and prob gear ratios. Would love to test ride one .

I might go with the at or ta and strip the fairing off if I find it bothers me. As you said though its one if those where its a pain to do but you don't do our often. If I ride it and don't like it I might just fold and buy a nice simple single. :/ anyway I'm going to a dealer with both today. Decisions decisions but getting to the point where I just need to buy something and be done.

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18 days to go..!

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Anyone know how the 650gs compares to an at in terms of comfort and simplicity?

Forgot all the twins are fi never mind.

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Helcat - I own and ride a carbureted '05 650 Transalp - but spent a whole day, mainly off-road, on a BMW G 650 GS last September.

The two bikes near mirror each in terms of general overall characteristics, such as power, weight, seat height, etceteras. The Transalp is ever-so slightly smoother to ride, as you would expect, it being a twin and'all.

At 5' 10" and 185 pounds the TA fits me perfectly. At 6' 5" you might be a bit cramped on one though.

Bottom line: I would never swap my wonderful, super-reliable 650 TA for the GS. Never-ever.

Incidentally, I don't know where you live, but if you're in the UK, then I should think you could pick-up a half-decent TA - around the same age as mine - for considerably less than GB£3,000 (possibly nearer £2K).

Good luck with your final choice.

Keith

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Right Way Round ...

A not so short walk across a bit of North Africa colours my judgement against rebadged Aprillias, Rotax chocolate fire guard design principles and Bavarian customer service. F650 singles are comfortable and efficient for as long as they work.

Google chaingang and check out the various F650 threads on here for a more balanced view. Personally if you want a single get a Japanese one.

F650 GS is FI BTW, carbs stopped ( pun intended) with the Funduro in 99-2000. (Strewth that makes me feel old. Don't think my zimmer frame would stand over dressed hiking in Morocco).

Andy

I have purchased and am the proud new owner of a (slightly scratched up) transalp 650. Rode it 2.5 hours home and a little trail with semi deep ruts and I'm real happy with it.

I looked at an Africa twin as well but felt I got way more for the money with the transalp albeit looking slightly less cool. It doesnt meet the simple criteria, well I think it half does but I'm hoping it will make it up to me in not needing anything doing.

Runs sweet and doesn't need anything though I will get started giving it a full service down to the tappets and carb balance just so I know what's what and where on it and so its in tip top shape. Also gonna put new tyres on it, reading around looks like K60s are a safe bet.

I'm thinking about getting the top box for it and I will strap my backpack on the back.

Fun begins..

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A damn fine choice!



K60s or Conti Escapes. Perfect!


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Right Way Round ...

Enjoy it

Andy

I sold it for a yam ttr Italy Turkey Greece Tunisia and Libya loving the little 250 single whod have known. Back in France going north the east heat is killing me right now.

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Sounds like you had some sort or revelation along the way? First you were headed to Morocco, then reversed down to Italy ... then Tunisia! Wow! Sounds like fun.

What happened to your Honda TransAlp? Why did you sell it?
Is your TTR 250 a new FI model or older Carb one? If a new one ... keep a fresh battery in it.

Lets see some pics!

Safe riding ... How's the leg room on your TTR?

I did the transalp was great at blasting down the motorway at 85 but as soon as I was out of England I realised that wasn't what I wanted to do.

It was also heavy and being clumsy I nearly dropped it a couple times, and realised what it'd be like in the dirt.. then the clutch started slipping and the choke was playing up small problems but I took it as a sign and sold it upfront for a loss and bought a ttr 250 with the plastic tank and carb.

I love the ttr. I can basically pick it up clean off the ground its that light.

I know its everything I said I didn't want small engine single but turns out its perfect. Its awesome off road.

The leg room is great. Its higher than the transalp by quite a bit. Seat was not comfy but got this air pillow which is dreamy. Don't ride for long distances non stop in general anyway.

I've got some great pics but I've been posting them all back to the UK on memory cards. I'm going to do a ride report at some point when I can get more organised. Been posting letters to myself as well kind of journals to jog my memory.

I never really had much of a plan, and once I was in Italy I just didn't want to leave so kept going until I was in the deep south. I'd have liked to work my way across to morocco but it didn't work out.

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I think the AM world is still missing a bike like helboy originally hinted at. Like an F650GS but smaller cc and size, like a GS500/CB500 but more compact and more scrambley format + efi; less lumpy than a big single, more power reserve than a small single.
Sometimes on my current big single I wished I'd kept the old GS500R and refined it a bit. I realise now I was more on the money than I thought.
I know we now have the CB500X - hope to try one one of these days but small-wheeled and seems a bit plasticy for our sort of game (I thought that too of a TA when they first came out though never actually owned one.) I would not be put off at all by efi. Give me that over carbs any day.

Slim, compact efi 500 parallel twin - water-cooled I suppose - 18R/19F tubeless and light! And if you're offering, make it a 270° engine for that V-twin feel. Had a go on a SuperTen the other day - very nice engine for a land raft.

Perhaps the Chinese will come up with something - or maybe they already have under six different names?

Ch

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Morocco Overland 4 (2025) • Trans Morocco Trail

Great summary Helcat! Good to see you discovered what many have. Small singles are great ... and the more into the 3rd world you get I'm betting the happier you'll be on your TTR. Off road will actually be FUN ... not fearful!

Looking forward to pics and a report when you get caught up!
Safe Riding All Round!

GS500 Suzuki is basically undiscovered here in USA. Not sure what it would take to convert one to a decent travel bike ...the engine is a Gem. But being an OLD design (like many Suzuki power plants) it's no feather weight but stone strong and reliable.

But sadly, the new Honda 500 series (there's 3 models based on same engine) is very heavy for what it is ... and down a bit on power with fuel economy not all that great for 2014. Not sure where Honda think they're going with these bikes. (maybe export to Asia/India?)

Still, that Suzuki GS500 motor sat in a more dual sport chassis could be interesting. IMO, in stock form none of the current parallel twins would be ideal for traveler bikes, unless doing all ON ROAD. If rough off road is on the menu', not good: Cast wheels, skinny forks, cheap, very short travel suspension. The motors are good, chassis, not so much: little ground clearance, not designed to take off road abuse.

I had a Suzuki GS500 test bike a couple years ago. It's made in Spain, even sporting Spanish made brake systems and suspension. First Japanese bike I ever saw without either Nissin, Tokico, or Sumitomo on the wheels! Same with suspension ... not KYB or Showa ... but a Spanish (??) company I never heard of ... or was it a Chinese company? (No one at Suzuki would tell me)

All that said ... the little bike was great overall. Only knock, a bit weak right off the bottom. Needed to REV way up to make power, so rock crawling or pulling through deep sand might be a challenge?

I prefer a 21" X 17" tire/wheel combo. Common sizes, not too hard to find.
A 21" front is a pleasure off road and not bad at all on a twisty road. Also, plenty of knobby tires in those sizes. 18" rear are actually rare in much of the world.

Maybe a DR650 chassis with a GS500 motor grafted in there?

My GS500F test bike ... a hoot on twisty roads!