Buying my first ADV bike this year. I really like the Africa Twin(even though I haven't ridden one), but they're too hard to get ahold of,so I'm kinda giving up on that idea. I rode a 800GS around Costa Rica last year and loved everything about the bike, so i thought I had my mind made up. But Today, I was at the bike shop and the guy really sold me on the value of the Tiger800. Now I'm rethinking the BMW. THOUGHTS? TIPS? IDEAS?

This reply starts with a question (or 2 actually). Which model of the Tiger are you considering, the street version or the more offroad XC series? and what type of riding are you considering?

If you are looking for a more off road style bike, and intend to do a lot of off road, the GS will probably serve you better, because it has a smoother power delivery and suspension set up is a doddle. If you are intending to spend most of your time on the tarmac, I'd plump for the Tiger 800 standard bike. I found the GS 800 a bit clumsy on the road and it doesn't handle very nicely with the big front wheel ( It doesn't turn in very well). The Tiger XC also has a very big front wheel and the same wonderful powerful triple engine, but it isn't as economical on the petrol as the Beemer. The Triumph is much more comfortable in standard form, but change the Beemer seat for something less resembling the side of a concrete block, and it's just as good over long distances.

I thought long and hard about these two when I bought my bike. I liked the Triumph for it's engine, but I eventually chose an F 650 twin ( 800cc) for road riding. ( I'm not very tall at 174cms, so it fitted me perfectly). 70+MPG, and the most important thing for me is the under seat fuel tank and side filler. ( same on the GS 800 series). It saves all the aggro of taking the tank bag off when you need to fill up. ( small thing but one you appreciate almost immediately.)

One other thing I've noticed too after 50,000 kilometers is the condition of my BMW compared to the Triumph. I have a local French friend who has a Tiger 800 bought at nearly the same time as mine, and after a similar mileage and riding the paintwork on his Tiger is dull and tired. My BMW just needs a wash and it's still gleaming, so I think the overall finish is probably better.

Difficult decision as either would be a good choice!.

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Great review there Pongo! I've only test ridden both 800GS and Tiger 800. But owners of the Tiger ... and most reviewers agree ... that the new Honda Africa Twin is better than BOTH off road.

On road, not sure. But off road the new Honda is quite good according to reviews and owners comments. I've only test ridden Honda on road ... liked it a lot ... but Tiger is still my fav bike for ON ROAD use.

The F800GS is better off road than the Tiger 800, in my brief experience on both. But I much prefer the Tiger 800 overall. But it's true the BMW will hold up better and will age well. The Tiger? Not so much. So BEST Fit and Finish for the BMW.

If off road is something you want to do seriously on a loaded up travel bike ... I would buy the Honda. It's better in many ways.

The GS-A is nothing more than an overweight F800GS. A few useful things but adds a lot of weight to an already overweight bike. The Tiger is no better. HEAVY.

The Honda is no light weight but rides much lighter than either BMW or Tiger, IMO ... and in the opinions of many who've ridden all three bikes Back to Back. DO test ride the Honda, then decide.

If your travel is mostly tarmac, I'd get a nice used Tiger at a bargain price. The BMW F800 is also a great bike ... no bad choices here really, but to me the Honda trumps them all.
Good luck, safe riding!

If you can, I would go with the AT even if that means a little wait.

I agree with much of the above. For purely on road, I'd probably go for the Triumph. Off road, the F8. I really did love my F8 and travelling with it was great. The fuel economy was excellent! The problems come when it comes to servicing costs; ouch.

The order in which I'd buy the bikes you mention, just for the bikes themselves, are AT, F8 and then the Triumph.

I've had two Tiger 800s, both XC models, both have been fantastic bikes. The engine is truly fabulous, smooth and powerful for road use. It does demand a little more gas off road which makes it tricky to handle. It carries luggage well, has ample power two up and with an aftermarket windscreen is comfortable all day long. It's moderately capable off road but very top heavy, so somewhat awkward to use in rough stuff. Fine enough on gravel roads.

I've had a few weeks of an F800 when the Tiger was in for a warranty repair and I didn't like it. The engine is lame by comparison, for street use, and not notably better off road. The weight is easier to handle off road. It felt like the Tiger's budget brother, to me.

I've not used the others mentioned so can't comment. I would float the inevitable question though - what do you really want the bike for? If you want a good street bike which can do it all and handle occasional, light offroad duty these are truly superb bikes. Any of the three (or the AT) will suit you well, test ride and decide.

If you want to really get off the black top and get into the wilderness get a KTM 690 or it's sexier Husqvarna brother. I traded my Tiger for one and I'm just as happy on the road, they're bloody quick and a stack of fun unless you are on the motorway. The Tiger, F800 and other big bikes are better on the motorway but it's still a motorway - it's not chalk and cheese, more like cheese and better cheese. If you are off road it's a different world, more like a motorised mountain bike. If it's your first ADV bike it'll make learning easier, falling less painful and life more fun. There is no other bike with the same hooligan power, light weight and all-road capability. Test ride one before you decide, I wish I'd done so earlier. The Tiger was my first adventure bike and it held me back from doing what I wanted to do, from going where I wanted to go. I went to Morocco and skipped riding the dunes because the skill and sheer gets you need to do that on a 220kg bike was beyond my newbie skills. My 701 Enduro I'd have taken out there in a heartbeat. I turned the Tiger around on a challenging road in Albania, same statement applies - I'd have kept going on the 701.

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[ Tim | History - NW Italy/French Rivera, Swiss Alps, Morocco | 2016 - Greece > Albania > Macedonia > Kosovo > Montenegro > Bosnia > Slovenia > Austria ]

WOW. Thank you all for the great replies.

I guess I forgot to state that I'm looking to ride basically 50/50 highway/offroad. You know, ride down the highway, find a cool trail, then go exploring.I'm hearing the options are almost endless here in the Calgary/southernAlberta/b.c/Montana area. I'm also super keen to ride to Alaska/Yukon, TCAT and eventually as far south as my money will take me.

Right now the 800GS is leading the way. I'm not super stoked on the GSA, I figure, if I ever need extra fuel, I'll just carry a can for that trip.

As far as the AT goes, I'm pretty excited about it, and don't discount it as a front runner. However, I'm not making any rash decisions until I actually ride one.

And the TigerXC, the verdicts still out, but it's not looking good.

for 50/50 I would not buy any bike with 21" front wheel and tubes, really.
F800GS is not good for off-road, weak and bad design of sub-frame mount,
very soft front suspension to name a few reasons, and I don't want to go into reliability/servicing issues here.

For 50/50 I would choose v-strom 650xt or even dl1000xt.

50/50 might be a bit of a stretch. Being a cruiser right now my riding is 100/0, so it's hard for me to accurately judge exactly how much off roading I'll be doing? Hopefully as much as possible, but I do have a day job and extended travel just isn't in the books just yet.

Some define 50/50 conditions differently. For me, it means that when you're riding the 50% dirt part ... well, anything can happen, especially in unfamiliar territory.

The OP uses the term "Exploring". To me this indicates he may end up on dirt tracks that can start out fine ... but after few km. can get nasty, muddy, rocky, and steep.... no way to make it on a Vstrom and maybe TOUGH on the GS, Tiger or even the AT.

You just can't always predict the condition of every remote back trail or even Forest Service Fire road ... so do research best you can and take your chances ... but if really exploring, a more dirt oriented bike would be my choice. YMMV.

Anytime the trail gets even slightly technical, a 21" front tire is a welcome addition over a 19" or 17" front. And frankly, even on tarmac the 21" is not bad with correct tires for pace and conditions. There really is no "down side" to a 21".

So, if your 50/50 means that the dirt part of the 50/50 may get technical and you don't want to have to constantly turn around at the first tough section ... then a more off road friendly bike could be the better choice.

This is why I finally sold my Vstrom ... bought a Suzuki DR650. But even on my DR650 (40 kg. lighter than Vstrom), I've run into plenty or situations where things got too tough for me ... I end up turning around.

I'm now looking at a 250cc bike ... WR250R. This is obviously weighted in the dirt part of the 50/50 equation ... but it's really quite good on the road too.
I will keep my DR650, a great all round bike that costs little to run.

If you're a new, Novice off road rider, then I'd suggest getting started on a 125cc or 250cc off road bike. This will be safer, more fun and your learning curve to go UP much faster on the smaller bikes. Most experts agree on this approach to proper evolution as a new off road rider.

Riding a BIG heavy bike in tough off road condition can be quite disheartening if you don't know how. Even dangerous. You WILL FALL OFF when starting out. Falling off on a 125 or 250 is far safer than a 500 lb. BMW ... not to mention damage to your pristine and expensive bike.

I'm going back to a 250 as I'm getting a bit older and weaker now, but I have a LONG history riding dirt bikes going back
40 years. Former AMA Enduro B rider (8 years).

Mr Mollydog speaks the truth. If you've no substantial experience off road these big beats will not just be hard to handle, they'll actively hold you back from learning. They are genuinely triumphs of marketing and asthetics, not of practicality.

Although personally I couldn't handle covering distance on an 250, I need some power to make me smile. I'd strongly encourage you to try some of the bikes in the sub 150kg weight range.

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[ Tim | History - NW Italy/French Rivera, Swiss Alps, Morocco | 2016 - Greece > Albania > Macedonia > Kosovo > Montenegro > Bosnia > Slovenia > Austria ]

That's really bold statement and couldn't be father from the true.
The biggest downside of 21" are tubes, next is handling. If there would be no problem on tarmac with 21" front wheel MotoGP would use them instead of 17"

Don't believe the advertising hype of the GS800 and Tiger800, they are both heavy bikes, add the usual Touratech catalogue bash plates, protection and racks etc, luggage, water, food, camping gear (and some ) and they get very heavy. Unless you are young, tall, strong with a long inseam and can pick up a loaded 500+ lb. bike on your own on a remote sandy trail after you've dropped it for the 20th time that day in 35 degree heat while wearing full riding gear, then look for something lighter.
If you don't have much dirt riding experience, keep your cruiser for road riding for the time being - and buy a lightly used Yamaha WR250R to learn on. I know a few people that have sold their cruisers, bought a big 'Adventure' bike and not enjoyed themselves when the going gets tough - or they have had a big accident trying to wrestle these big bikes. They normally end up selling their bikes and go back to cruisers, or it sits in the garage and never gets used.
As the guys have said, learn on a small bike - get a taste for riding dirt and see if its your 'bag'. After a while you may outgrow the WR250R and move up to a bigger bike, but I know a lot of people who are moving back from the bigger bikes and downsizing to the DR650, KTM690, CB500X, WR250R, CRF250L - For a reason.


These guys live in the Calgary area and do lots of trail riding, Trent and Daan ride 450's, Jordan and Rene ride WR250R's - if you want to get started riding dirt they know plenty of places to ride and are very helpful.


Wanduro — Explorations on a Motorcycle


.......and of course, make sure you get to the HUBB meet at Nakusp this Summer for lots of first hand experience...and a few

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Grif

'11 KTM 450 EXC
'09 Suzuki DR650
'00 Discovery Series 2 V8
'95 Defender 90 300 Tdi Overlander
http://gipperstravels.blogspot.ca

My XRV 750 Africa Twin has 21s (obviously) and I can honestly say that I have never felt that the size of the front wheel keeps me from taking turns how ever I want. I have had other ADV bikes with 19s and pushed them hard from time to time but, when you are touring you hardly push the bike to the limit.
I think that is not the idea for these bikes... specially in a long trip abroad.

As for the Original post, consider the CB500X with the Rally Raid Adventure kit.. from my experience, that motorcycle has everything you really need (good price, reliability, range, simple, lightweight and great suspension).

But, at the end, buy the bike that makes you tick.

cheers

Wow, old thread, sorry I missed this one.

You'll need to take my statement in context of what the conversation was about. We're talking 50/50 riding, so at least some dirt in the mix. So right away the 21" front is in the lead over 19 and 17 fronts.

Lots of bikes have tubes front & rear. YES ... it's PITA ass to do flats. But often the wheels are tougher than cast wheels, can be cheaper too.

I find handling on my current and former 21" equipped bikes has been remarkably good. You should come ride with us. On a recent twisty road ride
I out ran 5 better riders riding new KTM 1290s ... this on my 37 HP DR650 with a 21" front tire ... a knobby to boot! Granted it was all tight switchbacks most take at 20 mph. I can go double that speed on my DR. KTM guys can't hack it. But on any sort of smooth fast road ... they're GONE in an instant.
(160 HP) I owned 5 or 6 sports bikes before I ever owned a dual sport, lots of track days, schools, so i can ride a bit.

When I first started riding dual sport bikes 30 years ago I was stunned to discover just how good these 21" equipped "dirt bikes" handled. My first encounter was riding with Motorcyclist magazine staff. They were on FZ1000's,
Buell's, CBR600 and the like. On the very tight and dirty roads I kept pace easily on my old 1987 XL600R Honda.

Next, bring RAIN into the mix. Nothing works better on rainy roads than a dual sport with a 21" front. I can outrun many average riders on sports bike ... and I'm old and slow.

If you don't have good sporty roads where you live then you'll never know just how good these bikes can be. The Suzuki is simply a superb handler.