Of course everyone with a BMW, KTM or CCM bought it because of the snob appeal. Or wait, maybe some of them don't want a sub-250cc delivery bike?

I agree.
Soon the test rides will be taking place. Looking forward to impressions.

I don't think there is anything or anybody who is really neutral. I think it's humanly impossible.

The Swizz SHOULD make bikes. Some of the finest engineering in the world comes from there.

I would imagine the motorcycle equivalent of a Rolex and a cuckoo clock. It would be fabulous.

Yup.... My XR650L is 20 years old now. It's only done 15,000 miles but it's rusted and rotten. LOT's of restoration needed. Find me a twenty year old 'Ridden' bike that doesn't.

However, they're immensely easier and cheaper to fix and repair than anything modern.

__________________
Did some trips.
Rode some bikes.
Fix them for a living.
Can't say anymore.

2012 V-strom ; 2 hours maintenance this year, total cost something like £100 in chain lube, brake cleaner, oil and filters. Will be a dog at 8 years old, but SEP by then.

2004 Triumph Bonneville; 1 day off work argueing with/getting to and from the grease monkey about the MOT, eventually fixed with a £100 bribe where he then ****ed up a brake disc bolt playing with something that wasn't broken when taken in on old bike tax day. 2-hours fixing grease monkeys **** ups using taps, bolts and grease "borrowed" from work (boss smoothed with hours of unpaid overtime). New coil after twenty minute visit to M-62 hard shoulder, 1 hour and £100 fixing, 1 weeks riding lost due to worry about reliability. Same £100 in oil, filters etc. as the Wee.

The Wee is also doing 65 mpg not 45. Covers the depreciation when I sell it at 2 years 11 months old.

It's what you are used to (I'm better with PC diagnostics than carbs BTW, although when hardly anyone will sell me the PC kit its a PITA) and who you know for sure. Also what you are doing, the carnet on a £1300 Bonneville would be a lot cheaper than the Wee. Horses for courses and all that. The new doesn't break argument requires care in purchasing which is indeed a sad reflection on the industry.

I'd love a 250cc cargo bike BTW but they won't sell me one in the UK. The Enfield C5 Bullet is on the watch list for potential Wee replacements along with the CCM, Glee, CB500X and Husqvarna. This list is longer than the one I made in 2012 once I'd crossed off overpriced Triumphs and under developed F800's, so maybe things are going the way I at least want with some of the manufacturers.

Andy

That's servicing..... My bikes cost about £40 to service with oil and filters !!

I've had a 650 Strom. Good bike. Not the most fun to work on. Getting the plugs out is a PITA alone.


Like said, any bike with rusted fasteners and dry rubbers in harder to work on. some better than others though.

And price/prestigue has little to do with it.

__________________
Did some trips.
Rode some bikes.
Fix them for a living.
Can't say anymore.

....and i call my XT a road whale what was I thinking.

An't it great to have a choice, so what will I use to take me where ever I want? Here in OZ I am spoilt with over two dozen different bikes from all corners of the world! In Europe and the UK you have even greater choice

Get over it and get out and ride.

Ernesto from Uruguay (do a search on the forum) just did 18000 reliable K's around Australia on a Kimco 125, for which he bought for $2000 OZ new Just shows what you can do if you don't let your ego/bias get in the road of a good time.

Rod

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I once ruled the world, till mum told me it was only the garden!

Well I dont think you can say for all of us that its a question of "what will do it". If you are stubborn enough you can take a Goldwing across Mongolia. Whats the point proving it can be done? Thats ego. Why not be allowed to do what is actually fun for you?

Ultimately, like anything in life, its about happiness. Enjoyment. Pleasure. There is no greater currency. I dont want to take a Goldwing where I like to ride, cause it just wouldn't be fun for me. And I dont want to sit on Kymco 125 for 18,000 km of asphalt with 1-2 short stretches of light graded gravel roads across the "Great Australian Fu@k All", cause for me, its not fun - personally, nothing would bore me more.

Its unreasonable to imply if someone doesnt fancy riding a 125cc Kymco across the GAFA for 18,000 km its because his ego is in the way.

The "what will do it" or "any bike will do it" mentality is for people who dont care about the bike. The focus is travel. The bike is merely a means to get there.

Thats fine but dont kid yourself that its a view that speaks for all of us. Some us do like the riding as much as the travelling. For those of us that do, the choice of bike is of equal importance as the choice of route. For those of us who do find a lot of value in the actual riding, the choice of bike tends to be one in which you apply critical thought and rationality ... what bike will do what I want it to do? I would guess that a lot of guys who are looking at this bike are in that "rationalists" group when it comes to bike selection. Its not about ego. CCM is hardly a brand that you can boast about down at the next HUBB meet. Its not about size. The bike is half the weight of the 1200cc tanks. Its about rationality. Its a very light bike, with a modern brand name engine, excellent suspension, big fuel tanks and looks to have the potential not just to be go to far more remote places than the big adventure bikes, but to allow you have 20 times the fun doing it. For some of us, its about choosing a bike that is fun to throw around in the dirt at high speed. Whats wrong with that?

For that, for me, a Kymco scooter wont cut it, nor will any of the current 800cc and 1200cc bikes, nor will most of the Japanese 1980s vintage singles, like KLR650s, DR650s, etc ... thus, for some of us, this bike is potentially very interesting.

None of them are built for adventure travel. None of them are marketed for adventure travel. None of them are even available in Europe because the technology in them means they are a couple of generations behind modern emissions rules which means no carbs, no air cooling. Sure you can modify them to make them suitable, but then you can do that to any bike really ... which gets back to the old point, if any bike is an adventure bike, then there is no such thing as an adventure bike.

Besides, the performance of them reflects the fact that they are 2-3 decade old designs.

The topic was clearly referring to Adventure Bikes, as in on the dealers showroom floor adventure bikes.

The only bikes I would consider to be out of the box, purpose designed and marketed single cylinder adventure bikes in the last 2 decades are the KTM 620/640 adventure and the Yamaha Tenere.

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[QUOTE=colebatch;427923].

The "what will do it" or "any bike will do it" mentality is for people who dont care about the bike. The focus is travel. The bike is merely a means to get there.

Thats fine but dont kid yourself that its a view that speaks for all of us. Some us do like the riding as much as the travelling. For those of us that do, the choice of bike is of equal importance as the choice of route. For those of us who do find a lot of value in the actual riding, the choice of bike tends to be one in which you apply critical thought and rationality ... what bike will do what I want it to do? I would guess that a lot of guys who are looking at this bike are in that "rationalists" group when it comes to bike selection. Its not about ego. CCM is hardly a brand that you can boast about down at the next HUBB meet. Its not about size. The bike is half the weight of the 1200cc tanks. Its about rationality. Its a very light bike, with a modern brand name engine, excellent suspension, big fuel tanks and looks to have the potential not just to be go to far more remote places than the big adventure bikes, but to allow you have 20 times the fun doing it. For some of us, its about choosing a bike that is fun to throw around in the dirt at high speed. Whats wrong with that?

I cold not agree more with these statements - for me the daily ride is far more important than the destination and to enjoy that ride the bike must be something that meets your own particular needs at that time and for that riding. You summed it all up very well. Jake.

Seriously? What sort of service would you need that much to get between you and your dream bike? If you can't do any maintenance personally or can't receive parts in the post I could understand. I can't say I've ever needed a dealer mechanic ever I think. If anything, I actively try to stay away from them. I certainly don't get my parts from them. Even Yamaha charges ridiculous prices, like 65 bucks for a 18 dollar relay.

I agree with your point but I think he was arguing on the basis or reliability not anything will do the job.

The whole point of reliability is a difficult one I think. I've never had anything go wrong with the F650 Dakar, a loathed bike by a lot. And I have had issues with the still considered bomb proof completely rebuilt 3AJ Tenere. If it's new and well built it's likely to last a typical 25k km trip.

I totally agree with this, i only passed my bike test in April and i am currently on a bike trip and i am very new to this type of traveling however i soon found out i am a biker and not a traveler (however i am more interested in meeting people than i am at looking at old buildings) and i took a lot of time researching the bike to choose (DRZ400 with alot of mods) and if i was on a 125cc i think i would i gone crazy touched the bike and caught a flight back


However what i have come to the conclusion is from searching forums is that if there was no internet, facebook, blogs ect ect would these people that ride C90s, honda melodies ect ect long distances still do it if there was no audience to say "your are real crazy"

In other words if the tree falls in the forest and there was no one around to hear it fall would it still fall?

The short answer is yes of course they would. I've been riding small bikes long distances on and off for the last forty years - long before the internet, EnC or even Ted Simon for that matter. I've done it for loads of reasons - either it was all I could afford at the time, I liked a challenge or I just got bored with big bikes (and probably many others as well). The vast majority of those trips were not recorded, written up or even photographed as I didn't think it was anything out of the ordinary at the time.

It's only now that 1200cc bikes are regarded as "middleweights", the internet making everyone an author and the arrival of "charity guilt sponsorship" that stuff like LE-JOG on a moped is worthy of note. Loads more to say on the subject but as this is a thread on the merits or otherwise of a new CCM I'll just add that my 600cc CCM is currently languishing in the garage while I'm buzzing around on a 125.

I am sure a 4-stroke 125cc is a very capable bike, i recently meet a guy who has done alot of travelling on a large BMW, a Pushbike and was now on a XR125 which seemed very capable if you like lower speed however on a moped type bike i really cant see what would motivate someone to do it

I cant see why a bike less than 125cc would be fun when you could prob pick up 250cc to 350cc for near the same price.

Maybe it also depends on what type of riding you like? i always look for off road routes or bad roads tracks to take to remote areas as i find this interests me a lot more so i need a more capable bike like a DRZ which is very capable offroad and also if needed can sit at 120km on motorways if needed

I know many people like that dude on a post bike from Oz to UK have carried out such a trip but i think this story is different compared some other people today who choose a moped type bike for the "im crazy factor"

I think it is what makes you happy and we are all different and for me a bike 125cc or less on a long trip sounds like my idea of hell.... but hey its different horses for different courses right?

[QUOTE=motoreiter;427787]Of course everyone with a BMW, KTM or CCM bought it because of the snob appeal. Or wait, maybe some of them don't want a sub-250cc delivery bike?[/QUOTE

I also mentioned the 650s and the DRZ400...

Maybe the CCM has a better spec than the DRZ400, but which one would you trust for many years of service around the world?
The one with a one-off motor from a small manufacturer with likely limited testing and development infrastructure based off a discontinued BMW model, from a brand that will likely go in a completely different direction for motors this year? Or a tried and tested model from one of the big 4?

I wish CCM well, but I have no idea why they would have chosen that motor for an 'adventure' bike.


Don't knock the commercial bikes. They are built to take a beating in very harsh environments with minimal servicing. And carrying loads that would break most dualsport bikes.
I've seen some of these carrying 4 or more people and/or huge loads on some very sketchy roads in SE Asia. I think my record so far was 9 people on a 150, with 2 additional shocks welded in out back, and 8 or 10 foot planks down the side to serve as a passenger and load carrying platform.

I have a 125 dualsport that's built off a commercial platform, and it's been ridden hard on some bad roads / trails, carrying 340 to 440 lb of rider / passenger(s) and luggage.

Parts are generally available in SE Asia, South America and several other countries. Most parts can be found Europe and North America as well.


Sent from my A898 Duo using Tapatalk 4 Beta

First, I have no opinion on the CCM and doubt I'd buy one until there is more feedback about it. In any event though, it is good to have more choice, and I wish CCM success.

I don't doubt that many of the little bikes can take a beating. And its great if people like them and find them perfect for their needs. But that doesn't mean that someone who has chosen a different bike has done so for reasons of "snob appeal".

[QUOTE=tigershel;427801]I rode mine DRZ400 to capetown. It was far from perfect but then I knew the bike inside out and did a lot of EXPENSIVE preparation to make sure it got there. There is A LOT that can go wrong with a drz, and it does often.. BUT !! It's very easy and simple to fix.

The DRZ400 is a classic already. I fancy another one now I've sold mine. They will be a sort after and EXPENSIVE bike in another ten years. Everyone should get one stashed away while they're cheap and in nice condition.

__________________
Did some trips.
Rode some bikes.
Fix them for a living.
Can't say anymore.