The Swiss have made Bikes. Motosacoche was one of the earliest bike manufacturers and supplied MAG engines to many other companies.
Universal made singles and post war, big flat twins.
Condor made a purpose built flat twin for the Swiss army, and more recently built their own version of the Ducati single for military use.

Also Egli-Vincent and Egli-Honda, Swiss frames, non-Swiss other stuff.

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TBS.com

Tigershell - and all the other harbingers of doom, I have gone down the road of modifying, repairing and rebuilding bikes, I have also used excellent new bikes (ktm 950 for instance - that never really let me down despite the doubters at the time) but why cant we all be happy that someone is really making an effort to build a bike that to all intensive purposes does not exist off the shelf since the ktm 640 adventure dissapeared - to fit a very small market - no one is forcing any of you to buy it but at least its an option if you so choose - why so many negatives and very few positives - maybe it has some compromises maybe it does not, But look overall a small lightweight bike with descent power output and a very good power to weight ratio, built not as a total trial bike but as something with some ability to cross over as a small adventure bike ( I know there are doubters that it can do it - but if a BMW 1200 or chinese/jap/italian step through 50cc moped can be traveled on then I am sure this bike can - like I say they can all travel to the shops or round the world but its just different choices some like brown horses others like cream ones and some like donkeys - does it really matter thats what makes everyone different - I am looking to buy the ccm simply because I like the look of it, I love the enthusiasm and openess of all the staff at the factory, i love the features they have put on it as standard, (three tanks, excellent suspension, a very good chassis good brakes a fairly well proven engine ( Fair enough set up and re mapped but originally from a short stroke enduro engine) you all knock the engine - why ? I cant comment I wont test ride one till 19 july - but I am sure KYMCO who actually make the engine are not as bad as many seem to make out ( check out the company profile I didnt read anything about making gearboxes out of cheese or gaskets from cardboard boxes) CCM have been using it for some time to get it to where they are with it at present. But I have little doubt that the kymco /BMW derived engine will certainly be of a reasonable build and quality standard and may i suggest as well made as many other engines on the market. Depending on the way CCM have set it up to run in this particular machine is still an unknown but they are at least open enough to offer test rides and are having a press examination of the bike as well as factory visits and days and so yes its an unknown but one with a huge sense of honesty , openess and confidence from the factory, the staff and the director who incidently you can actually pick up the phone to and speak to directly he has not chosen to hide behind a massive press machine. They have reached out and asked - what do you want and within reason and price they have tried to build something to fit. If the bike rides well and I feel it fits me and my needs I will leave my deposit in place if not I wont ( that is another option that was offered a refundable deposit on the strength of the bike being what they say). Oh bye the way I also ride an Indian Enfield (Infield) and yes it does a job - like your budget workhorses - but and there is a big BUT - the Infield is very slow, basic and uncomfortable in its own way a fun bike, of dubious build quality poor chassis and suspension but I am sure if my old bones could cope I could ride as far as i would on any other bike including the ccm - On the Infield it would take longer, I would need to stop and work on it a bit more and I may end up broken down with no spares back up but then again I do not think it would be my bike of choice any more than a 50cc chinese made workhorse as a machine to set off anywhere too distant to be honest. I will leave that to the eccentric madmen amongst us. On that note anyone heard from Birdy recently?

I look forward to that comprehensive review.
Presumably the test ride is in the Bolton area.

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Dave

The motor is a good one !! It will be up to CCM to work their tuning out. That will make or break it.

They will also probably change the cam....

CCM have a great opportunity here. I hope they don't f**k it up....


I don't think you can compare the motor with a Husky. Huskys were built for performance over reliability. They're race bikes.

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Did some trips.
Rode some bikes.
Fix them for a living.
Can't say anymore.

The motor is from the BMW G450 race bike that "God" David Knight spectacularly bombed with. Neither performance, nor reliability. Before and since he's won everything on a KTM and even on his own off the shelf Kawasaki shortly after he walked out of BMW. He'd probably win on a Kimco.

All the trail riders and "normal" racers in the UK didn't touch it. They stuck to their Suzukis, Hondas, Yamahas and KTMs. That's why it was discontinued.

I suppose CCM got a job-lot very cheaply?

I really do wish CCM well, but I fear they'll be flogging a dead horse, figuratively and literally.

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TBS.com

Those race bikes were surely tuned up ?????


And yeah... CCM don't do anything unless they get a cheap job lot.

DRZ400 engines and DR650 Engines was the norm for a long time.

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Did some trips.
Rode some bikes.
Fix them for a living.
Can't say anymore.

Ted have you done much work on these engines ? Speaking to CCM roughly what I have been told was CCM have changed the ignition map, lowered the red line and that the torque and mid range area of the motor are better tuned for this application, which with other changes you would think cam timing would be an area to hit straight away - That along with 5000 mile service periods suggests a far milder motor than the pure enduro motor it was based on. Problem is everyone is guessing and at this point till its released to the press they aint saying..
I know when I did all the work on my r80gs/ HPN project altering the piston, changing the gas flow, altering the ignition map and putting in a 296 cam, along with a heavier crank and a change in gear ratios changed the bike completely from a standard BMW gs engine, it had oodles more torque everywhere with a very fat flat torque curve and yes it ran out of speed and revs around 90 mph lower than a standard gs but was far far nicer to ride in every other area of the rev range for the application I used it - so I would assume to do this when buying new engines direct from the manufacturer it would be easy and cost effective to dial in a few new specs on the manufacture over a large order and would also change the whole character of the engine. It would seem madness spending all this money on a chassis/ bodywork suspension and build program to throw in a fiery peaky pure enduro race engine. As Chris reminds us CCM have made big mistakes in the past - I would think like most of us we try to learn from our mistakes NOTE: ( I have just learnt to remember not to start writing on here with a belly full of and neat sailor jerry rum and start to harp on about japan and whales. !!! In a pub it's all in the mists of the night before and forgotten the next day on hear well its still on here) jake.

Maybe you shouldn't make blanket statements either.
The TE610 was Husky's dualsport model, built for road duty with 3000 mile service intervals, improved alternator output to power accessories and lights

The power output from the 575cc motor is around what I'm hearing CCM is getting from the 450, although knowing both motors (in BMW trim anyway), the Husky is much less dependent on revs to make progress.

The 450 was fat more slanted to the dirt/race side of things than the 610, and in fact when BMW bought Husky, that motor was moved into some Husky 'race' models.

Maybe CCM / Kymco has done a lot more homework on this motor, improving stator output, service intervals, power band characteristics, setting up several years supply of parts and so on, but most of that will take at least 2 and maybe 5+ to prove out.

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