I don't know alot about trikes, but I would think that a sidecar is more stabile. Sidecars look cooler as well (-:

hmmm, well. I would guess that it is also cheaper to outfit a bike with a sidecar than to make it into a trike. With the sidecar you also have the advantage that you can take them apart afterwards and sell them individually or keep one and sell the other. I think that a trike is a one way road for a bike...


As far as I know pretty many people do it with sidecars and they are happy with them. If you chose a know reliable bike like an older BMW and put on an ural sidecar (very popular combo since the ural sidecar is very strong and cheap as well) then you have a really good balance between price, reliability and usability.

Some people have "hacked" BMW 1150 gs adventures. KLRs are popular as well. Motoguzzis are good too.

It pretty much depends on your financial situation.


Well unfortunately I am on my way home now. Just need to sell the bike and then its back to work for half a year.

I am pretty seriously contemplating a 5-6 month trans russia, mongolia + stans tour myself next year.

I would either go with an Ural or a CJ750 though. The CJ750 can be had with a BMW transplant (r75/r65 engine) and they are pretty cheap as well.

Good luck, with it!

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Peter Kongsbak
South East Asia, USA, Central and South America and Scandinavia.

Just a note,

The off-road (enduro / MX ) outfits I have seen are all fitted with a different set of forks. They have a cantilever arrangement and a rear type shock. I think they might be called "leading link" forks.

It might be worth investigating the reasons for this.

There is a bloke local to me who races an outfit. I'll try to get a pickie.

Have a look at these sidecar travelers sites for a vicarious taste

Around The World Again - Motorcycle Escape

HUBERT TRIP

The North cape by Dnepr

Sidecar to Tibet

Sidecars are a funny experience. Tedious in the wet and cold - like bikes - but great in the sun. If you are not in a hurry, have good weather and the rider is in decent physical shape, then they would be a fun two person travel option.

More enthusiasts' sites:

http://www.sidecars.org.uk/
Google Image Result for http://www.sidecar.freeuk.com/gl12.jpg
Leading Links
The United Sidecar Association - Side Car Book Page
Sidecar.com Forum : Category / Forum listings
http://www.threewheels-uk.com/

Why not?

Simon

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Simon Kennedy
Around the world 2000-2004, on a 1993 Honda Transalp

If you are going to be riding on any twin track dirt road then avoid the trike as your front wheel will be in the rough part of the track.The front suspension is called a leading link which basically turns you steering into a power steering setup as a normal front suspension on a sidecar is hard to turn.
In regards to the sidecar itself make sure that it has proper shock absorber suspension as this will be much better off road.Some units come out with rubber torsion bar suspension which is fine in the tar but not real good in the rough stuff.
Leading link front end.


A 1150 GS with Ural chair.


A mate is building his own for outback touring.


Similar to what I want to build for outback touring.


You can even take the mother in law for a ride.


Cheers
Andrew

All the above is good info. Trikes i'd avoid, it's like having a sidecar with no body on both sides, so you while you gain the stability you loose a lot of the carrying ability and all turns are "towards the chair". I followed a narrow Goldwing Trike to the Dragon and corners I'd be blatting through at 40-50, he was having to take at walking pace. He had no more luggage than a normal wing, so while he no doubt had his reasons for wanting something that didn't fall over, it didn't float my boat.

I should perhaps explain this better: A turn away from the chair transfers the weight onto the sidecar, so it's just like a car, too much speed you slide. With practice you can use the slide to your advantage, but at first snap the throttle shut and the chair will help you. A turn away from the sidecar lightens the sidecar wheel. Too fast and your nice stable outfit becomes a bike with a 700 kg pannier on one side . This is known as flying the chair and is huge fun unless you didn't practice and go straight on into the oncoming traffic .

Urals I can understand you avoiding. While they are perfect off road and the reverse gear has huge advanatges I know the 650's had components made of cheese and were assembled by drunken chimps (I threatened to put mine through the showroom window and got my cash back). The 750's are better but how better long term I don't know. The trick with a Ural is to only buy from totally first class experts who've fixed the problems and will support you.

The Ural chair is the most practical about and can be adapted to fit as on the BMW above, my Triumph and just about any bike with a proper frame. Oilhead BMW's get expensive as you need to buy lots to metalwork to add strength and rigidity to the bike. I had an R1100R, but wouldn't go that route again.

Unless you are totally minted, you'll need to ignore some of the advice you will get until you know about your own machine. Leading link forks are will reduce the steering loads, but you don't need them. I'm 5'7"/1.7m and not exactly fit (eat the wrong stuff, drink too much, rather partial to the odd cigar/pipe), but I can handle an 800 kg outfit on sand, mud, snow or the motorway for full days. Likewise, car tyres last longer but can introduce bad handling (my R1100R/Charnwood Meteor did lock to lock tank slappers at 85 mph ). The cost of new rims etc. will buy you a lot of old style bike tyres.

You could join us at SidecarsUK : The UK's Number One Sidecar Group for more info.

Come on, join the dark side, there's just nothing like having the road to yourself on a moonlit night because a bit of snow keeps the road rocket brigade indoors

Andy

Thanks Guys great help, I don't think I will go with the trike. Your comments and the price I have just been given for the conversion as put me off. I'm also thinking of selling the BMW and getting a bonnie. I can get a brand new bonnie straight out the box for the price of selling my 2nd hand BMW. A bit more basic, but at least its new and some how more fitting for a side car. In fact been looking at the 'watsonian-squire side cars and I can get that and the bonnie for the money for my bike. All new gear lucky me, I have turn 40 now maybe its time for the cloth cap flying jacket brigade.

http://www.scarabis.com/Photos/AndyNorway08/1270319.jpg

This vehicle may be a bit rough around the edges, but cost less than a grand!
damn good fun....

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Harley Davidsons,
The most effective way of turning petrol into noise without the side-effect of horsepower

Some trikes are well built and handle better than the same model solo bike in the corners. Plus with the auto tires you can put small truck tires on with snow tread and studs. Northwest Trikes

Drop me a private message with an e-mail address if you want pics of the set up on my Bonneville. A useful bit of off the shelf kit is a Watsonian bracket than converts the centre stand mount to a sidecar connection point.

I'm saying nothing about dress sense. I'm currently riding in a Drizabone long coat, Union Jack helmet, Army DR gloves made in 1953 and fake RAF goggles. I look like the tall doppy one in Dastardy and Muttley

Andy

OK. Great advice on here so far. Here are a few more points to consider. Firstly, I was of the same opinin as you initially about Urals. In fact I thought sidecars were crap.

However, having followed 2 sidecars in Argentina down some nasty tracks whilst I struggled with a two-fully loaded 1150GS, I saw what they could do. Then I moved to Estonia with more plans to travel. We want to see Kamchatka, but now we have a dog and I still pretty bad off-road!

So, with the dog, bad roads and nasty winter here an outfit seemed a whole lot better.

Initially I thought about sticking a chair on the R1100GS I also had but when I learnt about what needed to be changed I soon scrapped that idea. It would have cost more than a combo out of the showroom!

What do I have? I bought a secondhand 2007 Ural 2WD Sportman. The only thing sporty is the name, but it is great fun.

OK: points why you should not discount a Ural out-right.

They have been built with a sidecar in mind: the frame, all the bearings, spokes etc take the chair effect into account. Solos with a sidecar bolted on are a compromise as neither unit was designed to go with the other. Especially all the bearings in a solo that are chosen to withstand bike stresses, not the lateral stresses of a side car. Can't say if this is the case with Guzzis and their certification.

They are very solid. They are easy to work on. You plan to go to Mongolia and Russia? That is where they are built and spare parts are everywhere. Not so for a GS, Guzzi, Kwakas... Spares are not so easy, nor are tyres for these other bikes. Do-able, but not "walk to the nearest farm and get that gasket" easy...

Urals have, as standard: reverse gear, 2WD on some models (this is a scream in the loose stuff!!), interchangeable wheels (except the 2007 front) and interchangeable tyres: all the same. You get a spare wheel. Leading link forks as standard (the difference between power steering in a car and none). Integral steering damper for bumpy roads. I can get 4 tyres for it for about €220!

The 2007 Ural is an improvement in mechanical terms over the previous ones:
Brembo front brake
Nippon Denso generator
Domino switch gear
Jap electrics
Germany gearbox and pistons
Italian ignition
Keihin carbs
What looks like a K&N filter
Best tool kit I've ever seen OEM

This should address a great many of the problems they faced before.

What ever way you go I say enjoy you trip. However, before deciding check out Urals on Youtube and see what fun they are!!

Also look here:
The Timeless Ride Hubert Kriegel BMW Motorcycle Raid World Travel Sidecar Adventure Gespann
Jack and Luzimar's 2006 Ural Tourist
www.http://myural.com/index.htm

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Adventure: it's an experience, not a style!
(so ride what you like, but ride it somewhere new!)

Ain't nothing wrong with a Ural...!!!

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Ride the World!
2007 Ural Gear-Up
1984 BMW R65

I rode outfits for over 30 years, from an A10 Gold Flash BSA with Steib to a Pan European ST100/RX4 with full EZS kit, great fun, but expensive to run and all the disavantages of a bike coupled with all the disadvantages of a car, but fun. I now ride a trike (for the last 6 years), good (but not so much) fun, with all the disadvanteges of a bike coupled with all the disadvantegs of a car. The biggest thing a trike has over a sidecar is that the passenger on the back of the trike sees the same as the rider, the sidecar passenger see NOTHING to the side of the sidecar ('cos the passenger is lower and the bikes in the way). If you can do it on a solo, do it, if not and you are taking a passenger on what is after all a sightseeing trip, go for a trike. Trikes are also far easier to ride because they have a differential, sidecar outfits do not, therfore you have to 'learn' how to ride a sidecar, trikes are much easier and can have good luggage capacity, depends what you get. Whatever you do, enjoy.

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Graham & Elaine

GL1800 Motor Trike 2+2, one here, one there.

http://www.mayflowermcc.co.uk/butlers/

Anyone interested in the Watsonian centenary rally? Centenary

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'He who laughs last, was too slow to get the joke'
Never confuse the map with the journey.