Hi everyone,

I'm planning a RTW trip starting in the spring from the UK, heading to Vladivostok via for a ferry to Japan, and then freighting the bike to cross North America starting on the west coast, perhaps as much as 20k miles total. I will be taking very few highways (mostly B roads), and doing some dirt and gravel, but nothing seriously gnarly or off road.

I'm looking for bike recommendations, nothing too huge and heavy, so 650cc and below.

My bike budget is about £3000, including some of the usual overland mods I might need to do, so this means I'll be having to buy a bike with a fair few miles on it. I'm not really worried about performance, just reliability. The problem is as I'm sure a lot of you know is many of the usual ADV / RTW bikes used in the rest of the world are really rare / have not been sold in the UK for ages.

Here are the ones I've come up with so far, unfortunately many / all of them are really rare and expensive in the UK now.

Suzuki DRZ400 (probably an S OR SM only since it has to be legal in the US)
Suzuki DR650 or DR650SE
Honda NX650 Dominator
Honda XR400
Honda XR650L
Suzuki Freewind XF650 (very rare)
BMW F650 Dakar (Reliable enough? Don't want to start any fights...)
Yamaha XT600E

What would you do with £3k for a RTW bike bought in the UK?

Thanks for any and all advice and help you can offer.

Cheers!
Mark

Hi Mark,

From your itinerary : Europe, Russia, Japan and North America…. You could probably stick to tarmac all the way. In that case any bike will do!

Or will you take the scenic route via Central Asia (Kazakhstan/Uzbekistan/Tajikistan/Kyrgyzstan) ? Will you explore the magnificent Siberian Altai? Will you cross Mongolia? Again, spectacular country! But very tough if you do the northern route. A very light bike is a must.

Crossing Russia is not bad (but lots and lots of forest!) as long as you stay away from the federal highway. The federal highway is like staying in a motorway round and round for 2 or 3 weeks. Very boring, crazy drivers and you won’t discover the real Russia there. Russia’s back roads can be from very good to a complete nightmare!

If you want to stick to the back roads as much as possible, and have the option of keep going when the going gets tough, have you considered a CRF250? Popular in the UK.

I have travelled on anything from BMW650 (south America) , Versys 650 (Europe), ER-6N (Brazil – don’t ask!), Vietnam on a YBR125, Russia/Central Asia/Mongolia on a XT125 in 2014 and XT250 in 2016 (and a local DR200 in Siberia in 2015) . My next trip in Africa this summer I will continue with the XT250. They are very rare in the UK but the CRF250 is as good (I am vertically challenged so not for me!). You still can cruise at 60mph (which is more than enough on the back roads) and these are very light very reliable bikes.

All the bikes you listed (other than the BMW) are very desirable but very hard to find in the UK/Europe. And under £3000?

I would stay clear of any bike that requires a computer and expensive software to get a diagnostic. I learnt that lesson the very hard way and met many stranded travellers who had to end their trip and truck / ship their bikes home. Not fun.

Anyway, my 2 cents. (but please cross central Asia! You would miss so much if you don’t!)

__________________
Maria

www.franglais-riders.com

Hi Maria, thanks so much for your helpful reply!

I didn't add many details about my route to try and keep it short, but I was planning to go through Central Asia yes. The route I'm looking at would take me from Eastern Europe, to Turkey, Georgia, a bit of Russia, then Uzbekistan, Kyrgyzstan, Kazakhstan, the Altai region in Russia that you mentioned, then Mongolia and of course the final leg in Russia to Vladivostok. I will definitely avoid roads like the federal highway you mentioned when I can.

I have actually done a couple of overland trips (2000km through the Peruvian Andes and 9000km in a bunch of countries in Southern Africa) on Chinese(!) 250cc bikes. I prefer riding smaller bikes, it's just being overtaken by huge trucks on the small amounts of highway or A road stuff you have to do sometimes that really sucks. Plus I will be crossing North America at the end where roads are almost all tarmac and fairly fast, but I can deal with that.

I will definitely check out the CRF250L, I was thinking it's too new to be able to afford but it seems like there's some available that are within my budget. I wonder if there's some cheap mods I can do to it to get it to do 65mph with my gear? I'm only 145lbs myself, might be doable. There's also the CB500x, there are some examples with 15-20k miles on them within my budget I think. Any idea if it would be too low / weigh too much to manage going through Central Asia whilst avoiding highways? I'm fine on simple dirt and gravel but have no off road skills to speak of.

Thanks a lot for your help!
Mark

The choice of bike is always a huge compromise.
In one hand crossing the US (unless you plan the TAT in reverse and continental divide) you need speed and a good fast, comfy tourer is ideal.

In the other hand, when the trails get really hard, you may have to give up and turn back if your bike is too heavy or fragile.

So do you want a bike that is heavy, nice and perfectly ok 90% of the time, but give up on some places or roads.... some 5 or 10% of the trails....

Or will you take the little very light enduro bike, superb on tough roads, capable of going anywhere and crossing any river, but not too good or comfy on long straight roads..

There is no correct answer to that. I started with big bikes... and I went down to lighter smaller bikes. Same with my husband.

In Russia and Central Asia, and away from motorways in europe, a 250 is fine.
(You can check out my rides reports across Russia etc... through my website - follow links to them on trip pages - link in my signature) .

I actually have a CB500X ... great around Europe and motorways. My friends Anna and James have those same bikes and have been travelling around south and North America for a year and a half with no issues. Reliable bike, but I never tested out of tarmac. For that I have my XT.

__________________
Maria

www.franglais-riders.com

Hi Maria, thanks again

You're right - it's always a compromise. I think I would be okay doing the trip on a slightly bigger bike thinking about it, because I don't do any tracks or donkey trails etc. I'm always solo and my off road / mechanic skills aren't good enough to take me away from roads where there is at least a very small amount of other traffic.

I would definitely just take a 250 if it wasn't for the American leg of the trip. I think I could be happy doing it on a 650 or 250 really, so it just depends what bikes are for sale.

I checked out your website and read a bunch of your excellent ride reports. Your Southern Africa trip looks awesome, I did quite a similar route myself. I bought a Chinese 250 in Cape Town and rode to Bethlehem in the middle of SA to meet a friend, then did the big loop you can see below. I'm sure you'll have a great time. You can always PM me if you have any questions about the region.

Cheers,
Mark

There are as many answers to this question as there are bikes, and everyone will tell you what works for them, which may not be what works for you. So let me give you a few random thoughts of my own.

Anything newish bought in the UK is going to be packed with electronics I'm afraid, that's new vehicle emissions regs for you. On the plus side they are much more reliable than they used to be, and from what I've read about people breaking down in the middle of nowhere it's generally the mechanical or rotating bits that let them down.

Your budget suggests something older anyway, which may have fewer electrics. I always think carby engines lend themselves to backwoods riding but then FI systems are better at resetting themselves for altitude and octane rating.

As you say you expect to mostly avoid dirt roads you could go for something that isn't too dirt focused, so maybe a middleweight rather than small, light bike that could find itself getting breathless on a long road with full luggage and fuel load. Pretty much any of the ones in your list would do the job, but I'd say avoid anything that's a bit rare in case you do have to get parts for it. I'm inclined to say just look at what you can get in terms of price/VFM/availability - if it's already adventurised (big tank etc) that's an advantage as it's one less thing to buy. Might be as well to factor in a full engine overhaul..... they may run on for a long time but you're going a long way, and you don't want to be the one who's sitting on it when the fuse stops ticking.

I've owned nearly all of those bikes.

They're all reliable enough in their own way. The XR400 isn't a travel bike though. Assuming your're talking about the full on enduro. I'd forget that one unless you're a full on dirt rider.


You're budget isn't that high but it's totally doable. Condition is PARAMOUNT though.

You want the lowest mileage, best condition bike you can get. Most of the bikes you list are going to be over ten years old. You need to be careful not to buy a lemon.

The CRF250L is a good bike. It's new, reliable, economical and light enough. But you won't find one for under £3000. If you can stretch your budget id jump on one of those.

But addressing your list....


If you're talking solely about reliability though then out of that list the XT600E with the later 4PT engine is by far the most reliable complete package. If you can find a low mileage one. I rode one around South America and it was faultless. Even after some big crashes, it refused to ever not start. 65mph cruising speed when loaded.

A low mileage one just sold on ebay for £1600. Be aware that the suspension is awful though. I'd upgrade it with the money you have left over. It's not quick or particularly economical but totally dependable.


I rode a DRZ400S to Capetown from the UK. A great bike and very reliable if correctly prepped before you leave. It will truly do everything. A very popular dual sport bike for good reason. You need to pack light as it will struggle with loads. Expect 60mph top speed if you don't want to stress it.

The BMW 650's have a great engine. But you will need to carry spare waterpumps, reg/rect etc though. I'd ride a Dakar RTW tomorrow (But I am a BMW mechanic). They benefit from having great MPG and a highly cruising speed than the rest. You can do 80mph all day. Don't underestimate that on a RTW. The build quality is very plasticy too. So expect bits to drop off it. The 650GS is a LOW bike with short travel. Go for the Dakar. But they're holding good prices and I don't think they're worth what people want for them.


The NX650 Dominator is a good bike. Again, you will struggle to find a low mileage one in good condition. They are simple and reliable but their motors are not bomb proof. They can burn oil and if you don't watch it, you'll burn out your top end. The suspension is AWFUL from stock but £500 will transform it into a capable Overlander. I have a few of these.

XR650L. I also own one. It's the same engine as the NX650 but with a much better off-road suspension. Rare as hens teeth in Europe so you will pay a premium to own it. Expect to pay over £3000 for something 10-20 years old. Great bike if you can find a low mileage example. Again, you need to keep a close eye on it's oil level and pack a spare cam and followers. Again, a simple bike to work on and very robust.

Both will sit at 65mph all day.


DR650. You want the SE version with the alloy frame. The are rare in the UK but they do show up occasionally. They have the same motor as the freewind and work well on the road. The have a smooth balanced engine. A very popular dual sport in the USA for good reason. The freewind would do the job but it's a very budget bike and the suspension is for the road. It's very lumpy. It's got a good seat and fairing though. Why not !!

Both will do 70mph all day.


But again, if I had £3000 I would save up another £1000 and buy a CRF250L for £3500 and spend £500 kitting it out.



Good luck

__________________
Did some trips.
Rode some bikes.
Fix them for a living.
Can't say anymore.

Hi Mark, I cannot recommend using the CB500 engine enough. I have just built your dream travel bike (CRF500L) but its not for sale. If you can source a cheap CB500X then your looking at a bomb proof travel bike that will need some touches made to overland it but them engines mate, amazing..!!

If weight is not an issue with you how about a bog standard K75s, you could have an awful lot of fun prepping one of those and soooo cheap to buy. Again you cant fault the engines on them, just personnel thoughts here, i'm sure you'll find the ideal bike for you.....

Thanks for your replies and input everyone, I appreciate it.

I seems like there are some CB500x and CRF250Ls for sale that are just about within my budget actually, with some miles on them.

I definitely wouldn't be able to afford a rally raid kit or any real upgrades for a CB500x though, it would end up being stock. There's some videos of people doing some dirt and gravel on one in stock form which is encouraging, but my guess is in the wet things might get really tough, especially with my limited skills. It's almost a 200kg bike, and I'm 145lbs / 65kg myself.

The CRF looks great apart from the power and small tank. I'm fine with touring on a smaller bike, but since the US is mostly paved and I won't be doing any trails, I can see myself getting overtaken a lot, not my favourite.

Des - that's a good point about getting a full overhaul / engine service beforehand. Any idea how much that would set me back from a moto mecahnic? I live in Canada normally and have a VFR800 there, which I haven't owned that long.

Thanks for that great breakdown Ted, since you've owned a bunch of these bikes I might PM you about certain bikes I spot online if that's okay. I can see there's a bunch of discussion online regarding the Dakar's reliability. Ted - do you think the stuff that often goes wrong with the Dakar is fairly easy to fix? Either for a novice with a manual or for an average mechanic (in like Mongolia, for example ).

I would take a DRZ, DR650 or an XT600E if I could get my hands on a good one I guess, or a Dakar happily if needs be.

Thanks for your input all, let me know if you see or hear of any suitable bikes on the wind, cheers.
Mark

Sure. No worries.

__________________
Did some trips.
Rode some bikes.
Fix them for a living.
Can't say anymore.

I would normally go along with Ted's (and Maria) idea of a CRF250L Honda for doing Russia, Mongolia ... but once in Alaska, USA the little Honda may wear you out.

All your bike choices are very good .... IF you can find one not worn out.
I'm a DR650SE guy (USA) but too hard to find one in UK and over priced.

But what about this beauty? Low miles, in your budget .. just a hair heavy but a GREAT travel bike I would bet!

http://www.horizonsunlimited.com/hub...dinburgh-93456

There was someone else here selling this model earlier. The one above looks like a VERY good deal, IMHO.

Hope you can follow through and let us know what you get ... and how it works out on the road.
PS: Do NOT buy the BMW ... trust me, you will regret it as a travel bike. Don't believe the hype.

The XT660R is a good call actually.

As is the XT660Z Tenere.


The Tenere is heavy for what it is though but ironically it's a better road bike than the R. The R is lighter and I think people prefer it on unpaved roads due to it's lighter weight.

When you consider that they're ten years newer than the Dakar for the same money, it seems crazy to pass it up.

That one in the link looks like the bike he needs..... I'd just get it bought

__________________
Did some trips.
Rode some bikes.
Fix them for a living.
Can't say anymore.

Hi guys, yeah that 660Z does look great actually. But I neglected to mention I'm a bit of a short arse with short legs in fact - 5'8-5'9 on a good day and a 29inch inseam. Doing a bit of googling it seems like the bike is pretty tall, although there is a 1.4inch / 35mm lower kit available here:

XT660R lowering links | Yamaha XT660R lowering kits | £49.95 + pp | LustRacing.co.uk

I'm tempted but I'm in Dorset and Edinburgh is a long way to go to find out the bike is too tall for me to ride home. I'll send the owner a message and see how tall they are and how they get on with it

I will definitely let you know what I do in the end and how I get on with the trip. I'm 5-6 weeks out from leaving and will be applying for my 6 month Multiple Entry Russian Business Visa next week...

Thanks again.

I rode the DRZ400 (SM but with E wheels) from UK to Nepal, and around NZ.

I've since ridden a CRF250L round Thailand, and my OH has the 250 rally.

I'd say there isn't a great difference in power between the drz and the crf when it cuts to the chase, the CRF is geared much better and doesn't buzz its tits off unlike the DRZ. If I had the choice of bike again for my half rtw i'd go for the CRF hands down. More reliable, less buzzy, longer servicing intervals, easier to obtain parts worldwide, more comfortable seat.

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https://fernsforays.wordpress.com/

Comfy seat...??? I have a "slightly modified" CRF with a standard seat and after an hours riding my Arse is ready for its own little vacation..!!

Have you or did you have a gel insert mod going on there Fern..????