Thanks for your replies

I fully understand what you say but I just love shaft drive. I used to have a cx500 and really loved it. The reliability was second to none and it never let me down once. If I contrast that with chains, having to constantly adjust them, I prefer a shaft any day. plus why not take a spare shaft with me? I know people go on about the weight but don't think it's that much.

Out of interest did anyone ever make a smaller dual sport bike with shaft drive as most of the shaft drives in dual sport are around the 1000cc mark. I know Honda made the XLV750R but that's just too rare to consider for this trip. Call me strange but add a kickstart and that would be my dream!

Equally rare but probably less reliable, Guzzi did a shaft drive 750 D/S iirc (NTX750?). If we're looking at older stuff the original GoldWing was a shafty with a kick start and while I took mine round Morocco that's about as far south as I'd want to go on it. However, in three years of ownership I never once managed to get it to start on the kickstart. Likewise my current CCM604 - electric and kick but it never ever starts on the kickstart. I don't know how user friendly the kickstart on the R80 GS (probably my first choice with your criteria) is but there's not much point in having something if it doesn't work.

Re CX500s - I had a 650 which needed a fair bit of work - electrical mainly (alternator x2, reg/rec,) + cam chain, head gasket, exhaust baffles and brake hydraulics. It ended its days (with me anyway) after a valve broke and wrecked the left hand cylinder. All in about 25k miles. Mine may have been a Friday afternoon bike but that wasn't a good record. Just goes to show that people's experiences are different.

Take a spare shaft? Phew!

Ted? Paging *Touring Ted*!

How about this: BMW R80GS DAKAR STUNNING RESTORATION For Sale (1987) on Car And Classic UK [C674449] Nice, but probably a bit pricey for a trip through Africa. Or how about the current Guzzi V7 with knobblies and a decent set of rear shocks? You don't need a trail bike to do that trip.

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David 151 There you go!

The BMW R26 or R27 fits your list with the exception of the hydraulic clutch!
Not that I would recommend it.

247cc, 18HP, Shaft drive, kick start, single cylinder, carb easy to fix/clean

Hydraulic clutches are overrated imho, but a black bike will not show up the dirt as much either, if you're heading for the rough stuff (something that's very important, I believe). You could get a black Halfords shaker can to cover the white pin-stripe

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I have knobblies. There is the V7 thread I started here abouts. I never saw the point of changing shocks so can't comment. It does what an airhead would do but isn't 35 years old with a weak subframe and splined shaft. Given the original spec I imagine it has the wrong 35 year old reputation too.

I'm a big fan of just picking a bike and going where you like, but the V7 doesn't meet this crazy spec. No kick start and cable clutch. There is no way you'd start a V7 by kicker, the starter motor is like something off a dump truck and can still need 15 seconds cranking.

The list of Japanese 250's would be my choice. F650's have water pumps designed by sausage eating morons who dont know the difference between bearings and lipseals and leave you stranded 7.9 KM from Erfoud on a Tuesday.

Urals have shaft drive and Kick starters

Andy

The one thing Bertrand left off the list was taking off the tyre to swap an inner tube when you have a puncture in 40ºC shade temperature, but there's no shade and the sun is relentlessly beating down.

Of all the characteristics I would be looking for in a bike, tubeless tyres would be number one. The fallback, which I've implemented on my Spanish bike, is mousses.

Your insistence on kickstart and shaft drive is getting anal, you clearly aren't listening, so I'm not going to comment any more on this thread. Hope you understand.

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I have a Scottoiler fitted, and I'm about to adjust my chain the first time this year! That's not exactly constantly!

The CX series V-Twin Honda's were legendary. Great bikes with many couriers getting 200K miles out of them. Could it be a good travel bike? It could, but would be tough in certain off road conditions. If you stick to dirt roads and nothing too tough, it could be a good bike. You should consider one, even though its from another era, it could still work.

I fear your experience with Chains and chain drive bikes goes back to the Dark Ages. I never have to adjust my chain and routinely get 20K Plus miles out of one. The latest DID X Ring chains are quite remarkable ... nothing like the "bad old days". Different world mate.

The weight of shaft drive can be figured. And it's not just the shaft that breaks: bearings, U joints, splines, housings ... and of course the shaft itself. Probably about 5 to 7 kgs. more than chain set up all in.

I wonder what was the last time you rode a bike and what that bike was. Really, any bike can tour, so take your pick. But when you said "get off the beaten path", that changes things and sort of eliminates some bikes. Consider your skills and strength. Learn from others who've gone before you.

BMW and Guzzi both made "smaller" dual sports ... but I would not really classify either as "dual sport" by modern standards as they'd both hammer you in tough conditions. You'll pay in BLOOD, SWEAT AND TEARS!

All part of the fun, right?

I really think you need to drop the fixation on shaft drive and kick start and instead listen to what others are saying.

It's never a good idea to undertake a trip of this scale without some smaller trips as a shakedown, so take a flight into Marrakech, hire a local bike and seek out some tough stuff for a week to give you an idea of what you might be facing.

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and enlarges the world in which you live," Irving Mather (1892-1966)

Does anyone know anything about the BMW R65GS

It seems to be an R65 engine fitted into a R80G/S chassis. From what I can tell most of the R65GS were restricted to 27HP for the German market for young riders. Saying that I do believe a number of unrestricted 50hp model were produced.

If I went for one of the unrestricted 50hp models would this be a good choice? Parts for the R65 engine seem easy to come by as well as the R80 GS chassis.

Out of interest does anyone know if the R65GS ever came with a kickstart? I know the normal R65 did.


Thanks for all your comments. As for Tims suggestion I think I will fly out to Marrakech and play around for a few weeks. I don't envisage embarking on the proper trip until August next year, so have quite a bit of time.

+1

1. and don't forget to get a dose of Montezuma's revenge from a dodgy dish
2. add a few days of really bad sleep sharing a room with a mosquito- yes, it only takes one...& don't wash for awhile to enter the discomfort zone.
3. Load the bike with the weight of luggage you are proposing to take with you to get the real feel
4. Go into the 'tough stuff' on hot days...
5. now drop the bike, preferably on your shin causing some pain (but no breaks!)
6. lift the bike back up and then then try using the kick start....
7. repeat a few times....

Then tell me you're happy to travel with a big heavy shaft driven bike and I'll show you a pink porcupine who can play the saxophone

Travel is about enjoying the trip- everything you can do to prepare for that is time well spent. Do take on board what suggestions are being offered especially from those who have been there and gained their experience on the ground. They are offering it to you so that you may have a more enjoyable trip with fewer regrets!

Caveat:
I take no responsibility whatsoever for the dangerous and daft advice in the numbered list above- Don't do it -however it is 'food for thought'.

People are going on about the weight, but looking at the BMW R80gs paris dakar it seems relatively comparable to some of the bikes posted by mollydog. According to this website its dry weight is 160kg

BMW R80GS Paris Dakar

Plus if I went for this bike I get a kickstart and shaftdrive.

Why not go for R80gs? Do I really want something much smaller as I am a big chap myself at nearly 22 stone!

David, You can go with ANY vehicle- it is your choice.

There is a great deal of collective information centralised on this site from people who have travelled all over the world. Many have learned the hard / costly way too.
I would suggest you take the time to read about other peoples' choices and reasons for these then draw your own conclusions.

Filtering the information on the hubb should help you decide on what equipment/vehicle/etc work best in a particular environment. This knowledge should enable you to make better informed decisions and hopefully save you time or money or grief or all three!
Whatever you choose, have a fabulous trip.

p.s
Ask Tiffany about her R80 GS when she or her girlfriend had to fly back to the UK from Iran I think it was, when her bms'gearbox broke and no parts were to be had.

I looked on Tiffany's site and she describes her bike as:

"The amazing bike which has carried me and various friends around the world. I have complete faith in her to get me through or out of any situation, whether it is the horrendous mud in Ethiopia or being pursued by angry Mafia in Nicaragua"

That's a shame about the gearbox, but seems a bit extreme to have to fly home. Why not keep spare parts in your garage at home in case anything happens, then a friend can pack them for you and send DHL anywhere in the world?