Im talking about long distance motorbike travelling. Not about owning a motorbike in general....

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In the end everything will be fine. If its not fine its not the end....

So was I. We don't use small bikes for anything other than extended weekend trips, usually supported (enduro style riding).

Like I said- we move in different circles and each to his own

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Squily

Well - "small bikes" - I havent even mentioned that term at all. So I dont know why you brought that in? And weekendtrips are also not what Im talking about here.

As I said - never heard of an overlander going up in bike and equipment size (have you?) - but heaps of them (almost all) are downsizing. Which clearly indicates that most people in general think they will be better off with bigger bikes than ideally is the best. And thats a fact!

Anyhow - maybe get the thread back on track again....

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In the end everything will be fine. If its not fine its not the end....

Maybe it's semantics, but you said people go smaller. To me, any single cylinder is potentially a small bike. There's not much difference in weight between an XR600 and an XR350. So small bike to me is a trail bike. And this includes 'big' trailbikes like Tenere, KLR and DR's.

I did plenty of traveling on bikes ranging from 350-650cc (singles). I still have singles. If I have a choice for riding, I take one of the big bikes. And this is not just me, but most of my mates as well. Like I said- we move in different circles. Very few of my mates have gone bike to small bikes.

But regardless, this discussion is pointless. You have your opinion. My original point being- its your opinion and not facts. Maybe its based on your experience, but still an opinion. I have mine, based on my experience. We can have a pissing contest to see who's got the most experience, but what would the point in that be?

You made the statement before "Nobody wishes they brought more stuff and bigger bikes - everybody wishes they had less stuff and smaller/lighter bikes" and you ask again "never heard of an overlander going up in bike and equipment size (have you?) " and I stated (twice) my friends are different to yours because most of us prefer bigger bikes.

So just by that - you have heard people prefer bigger bikes, you just refuse to accept it. Pointless discussion.

As for your other comments about not being prepared, wishing for things you had. Again- your preference. Me and some other people prefer the motto 'better to have and not to need, than to need and not to have'

Each to his own, i.e. every person has/are entitles to their own opinion. And that's a fact!!

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Squily

Sarcasm and bigotry seldom make good advices and not in this case either.

I wish you could raise your head a bit above that minor circle of mates you keep on refering to - then you might get a bigger picture of the subject. Mollydog for example - earlier on in this thread says exactly the same as I do and he is a very experienced guy. And the same advices are given by world travellers from all over the world.

Choosing a bike to travel with will always be a compromise - reliability, size, weight, brand etc etc. Most experienced guys that have crossed a continent or two will tell you that you will seldom benefit from having a big and heavy bike when it comes to overland trips and that weight means almost EVERYTHING going offroad. Then its up to each and everyone to listen and make their choice.

Of the 3 bikes mentioned by TS - I have already pointed in a direction and said what I mean. And I can repeat it - relatively good bikes all of them but none are good off road bikes. Theyre at least 50-75 kilos too heavy.....

Each to their own of course - but it wont hurt listening to persons who have been there and done that.

Safe riding.

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In the end everything will be fine. If its not fine its not the end....

It wasn't meant as sarcasm or bigotry mate. My apologies.

Just some travel journals of 'big bike preference':

1. Oisin Hughes did his 1st journey through the America (PanAm highway north to south on both continents) an an 1150GS. When he finished, he did his next trip on a 1200GS through Europe/Asia (Dublin to New York).
2. Helge Pederson did 8 years on a R100. Then tried a 650GS for 2 months and went back to a big GS
3. Emilio Scotto did 457 000 miles & 279 countries on a Goldwing. If that was such a mistake, don't you think he would have changed his machine for something smaller? For the 1st few years, he had no sponsorships. In fact not even Honda wanted to sponsor him, so no bigotry in decision making

There are plenty of examples out there. It's not a matter of me and my "minor circle of friends". And if you put any faith into statistics, the large ADV motorcycles outsell the small/medium motorcycles by a sizeable margin. Accepted, all these people may not go offroad, or know what they are doing, but still, there are more people out there thinking big than there are thinking small.

I did not disagree with what you or Molly said about the concept of thinking of a lighter bike. What I've been disagreeing with is your 'statements' of 'facts', because they are not facts. Simply your opinions which I do respect.

I disagree with Mollydog on many things, including soft/hard luggage debate, but Mollydog didn't flog his recommendations/opinions as facts. Had he done so, I would have commented the same. I respect every person's opinion, but there is no 'right' or 'wrong' way to travel, and we're all different with personal preferences and needs.

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Squily

I think the three travellers you mention are the exception these days. I know you could add Ewan and Charlie to the list and there are probably dozens of people currently travelling on 1200GSs but even so the trend in Europe is towards smaller lighter bikes. There are currently several 650cc bikes available that are quite capable on the road and much easier to handle off road and as travelling light is the way to go we no longer need the overweight 'beast of burden'.

I havent said that there is a right or a wrong way to ride or to do things.
All I have said is that a lighter bike is easier and lighter to handle - and especially when and if going offroad.

And using statistics for what? Justin Beaver sells a lot of records and concert tickets - so he must be a fantastic artist??? McDonalds sells more food than any other restaurant chain - thus using your way of "proving" things it must be the best restaurant with the best and healthiest food around...

About your examples - that guy you claim did 279 countries. Quite strange that there arent more than some approx - 190 countries in the world. You must not belive in all exaggeration you hear....
And without checking facts - I do belive a 1200 GS is lighter than a 1150 GS.
Anyhow - you can also run a marathon in army boots - its possible and might even have some advantages. But I would prefer doing it in something more suitable. And then we are back to the question of the TS of which bike is best suited for his needs. You can go around the world in anything you like of small and big bikes, 50 cc Vespas or 1800 cc Goldwings. But what are the best suited from an objective - or as objective as possible perspective?

Taking a big bike will actually limit one from going on some real off the beaten track. So why take a bike that limit your choices of where to go?
If youre only doing paved roads and a relatively smooth gravel road now and then - you can take any bike, big or small. But if youre heading where most people dont go - youre much better of with a lighter bike. These are facts wheter you like it or not. If youre a hell of a skilled rider you can get quite far with a big bike too - but most people are not. And especially thinking about persons who ask for advice and are uncertain about what bike to take.

There are as you say no right or no wrong way or wrong bike. But there are choices that makes it easier for an unexperienced rider.

Heres some reading from Walter Colbatch of the choiche of an adventure bike. He has been riding The Road of Bones and BAM in Siberia several times and is a quite experienced guy. I think the classic observation is in there somewhere where they met different guys doing those very hardcore offroad roads in Siberia. They met guys with Superteneres and GS/GSAs and they came through these roads with their bikes in the back of a truck. They just couldnt get through those roads on those huge bikes. Then they met some guys on single cylindered 650s - and those guys said that it was freaking hard but they were able ro get through after a lot of hard work. And at last they met some guys on 250s and they told that it was just awesome and completely fun....

http://www.sibirskyextreme.com/2013/...selection-101/

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In the end everything will be fine. If its not fine its not the end....