 |
22 Oct 2009
|
 |
Contributing Member
Veteran HUBBer
|
|
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: the netherlands
Posts: 162
|
|
|
Carburetter overflowing/ not starting TT600R '03
hi all,
A couple of days ago the bike cut out on highway speed a couple of times, but after kicking it (the kickstarter i mean) it went on. I suspected and airlock: tankbag blocking fuelcap vent.
day before yesterday when crossing the border into Paraguay i noticed that my carb was leaking fuel. So i drained the carb and that seemed to work.
This morning i didn't start at all, so draining again. Didn't help. Took the old sparkplug out, was dry, which i think is weird after trying to start it for a few minutes. Put in an old spare sparkplug, checked if it worked first. No sign of life. Then the carb started overflowing again.
I have an inline fuelfilter.
Before i take the carb apart i really like to have some idea what might be the problem.
Oh, before all this happend i did a lot of bad washbordy roads through Bolivia a about two weeks ago. Bike worked fine after that till yesterday.
Can it be that due to vibrations etc. the carburettor bowl level changed?
Any info highly appreciated.
Sander
|
22 Oct 2009
|
|
Registered Users
Veteran HUBBer
|
|
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Dorset UK
Posts: 395
|
|
|
Sounds like sh*te in the carb - Probably a build up of dirt in the fuel tank - got shock up and into carb...
Check fuel filter isn't blocked up - Disconnect fuel line and run fuel thru filter to see if its flowing OK. My 04 RE runs OK, but the fuel flows quite slow out of the tap - without a filter.
It only takes a small bit of dirt to hold the fuel float valve open and make it leak/over flow! Carbs will need a good clean out - look for sediment in bottom of float bowl - it may have by-passed the filter?
|
22 Oct 2009
|
|
Contributing Member
Veteran HUBBer
|
|
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: the netherlands
Posts: 162
|
|
|
hi,
fuel is flowing ok. i took the carb off and opened the floater chamber. looks clean.
so....
i read in my manual that the floaterhight should be 27-29mm and there's an other figure 'swimmerstand' which translates as floateradjustment of 6-8mm.
How do i measure that?
thanks,
sander
|
22 Oct 2009
|
|
Registered Users
Veteran HUBBer
|
|
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Dorset UK
Posts: 395
|
|
Fuel level: 6.0 ~ 8.0 mm Under the edge of the carburetor body. Thats when you measure the actual fuel level in the working carb as fitted on the bike, using a special adaptor with a clear tube - like a manometer.
|
23 Oct 2009
|
|
Registered Users
Veteran HUBBer
|
|
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Stockholm
Posts: 651
|
|
|
float level
Sander,
The two values are different:
1. Floatheight 27 - 29 mm: measure with float bowl off, carb upside down, then distance between float bowl mating face and top of float must be 27 - 29 mm.
2. Fuel level 6 - 8 mm: as Pigford says, with running engine the fuel level above the float bowl mating face (carb installed of course) to be 6 - 8 mm.
The first one works for me.
While opening the float bowl, did you check the little filter on top of the float needle seat, better to remove anyway. When this is blocked it gives the symptoms as you described at first (stops at highway speeds, starts again etc)
Good luck
Auke
|
23 Oct 2009
|
|
Contributing Member
Veteran HUBBer
|
|
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: the netherlands
Posts: 162
|
|
|
Guys,
Thanks for the answers. i found the measuring method in a TTRE manual. Same carb.
Took the carb off - i think i found an almost non-violent way to do this ;-) - and it measured 25mm. Adjusted that and put the whole thing back together.
Inside of carb was clean.
So. The good news is: It stopped pissing nafta The bad thing is : It still doesn't start. I have a bit of action, more than before, but is doesn't fire upenough to catch on.
Played with/without choke and idle speed screw. Doesn't help.
Tomorrow i'll check valve clearance.
Airfilter is ok.
A bit more background: My TTR always had cold start problems in Hot and humid environments on sealevel like beaches in CA and Colombia/Ecuador or here in Iguazú. The last few months i spend in Equador, Peru, Bolivia and north chile/ north Argentina. So either dry, or on altitude or a combination. Always easy to start. What does that say about idle mixture?
Also, now i'm thinking of it, lately i give a wee bit of gas when starting. This developt over time, don't know when i developed this habbit.
Anyway, to be continued...
sander
|
23 Oct 2009
|
|
Registered Users
Veteran HUBBer
|
|
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Stockholm
Posts: 651
|
|
|
idle idle
Hi Sander,
Having cold start poblems in hot environments tells me that your idle mix setting is on the rich side (assume you use the choke for cold starts). (Humidity, unless under water, does not really matter). Remember that the 'factory idle mix setting' does not apply for older bikes: on my older Tenere the setting is 4,5 turns out and that works fine. Same for all other XT and the like that I know.
I'd recommend you try to start it with different settings: 3, 4, 5, 6 turns out; do not be shy ... BTW; the further out, the richer the mix.
Auke
|
24 Oct 2009
|
|
Contributing Member
Veteran HUBBer
|
|
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: the netherlands
Posts: 162
|
|
hi Auke,
i never touched the idle mix screw, so i might give it a try. BTW. 'she' kicks back when starting on choke on sealevel and tropical environments.
i don't know sh*t about carbs and mixture and such, but on altitude it starts fine with choke. and on altitude, mixture is rich due to less oxygen in the air, right? So how can it be too rich on sealevel? If it works allraight on altitude, i expect it to be too lean on sealevel. Or does my logic fail here? :confused1:
Quite eager to understand this stuff actually... please elaborate!
One good thing about kickstart only bikes, you do need to understand more about the technicalities!  
thanks,
sander.
|
25 Oct 2009
|
|
Contributing Member
Veteran HUBBer
|
|
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: the netherlands
Posts: 162
|
|
|
well,
looked at valve clearance and that was ok.
Current symtoms: If i crank it a few times with choke and kick it without choke the bike fires up a little before it dies and doesn't get up to idle speed, if I give a bit of throttle it dies immediately.
Can this be the effect of a too low fuel level in the floater chamber? My guess would be that on idling the fuel consumption is so little that it doesn't affect running at idle speeds.
...still puzzled.
sander
Last edited by sanderd; 25 Oct 2009 at 22:11.
Reason: refine text
|
26 Oct 2009
|
|
Contributing Member
Veteran HUBBer
|
|
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: the netherlands
Posts: 162
|
|
Hi all,
just to let you know. it starts again. appantly adjusting the floaterhight with the carb. upsidedown doesn't do the trick, since the floater compresses the valve a bit. Adjusted it again holding the carb on 45 degrees. seems to work, it fired up nicely and i have idle again and it revs nicely.
ergo, too low fuel level in the floater bowl affects starting and idle too.
will take it out for a spin tomorrow and see how it holds up.... 
thanks for all the responses!
sander
|
26 Oct 2009
|
|
Contributing Member
Veteran HUBBer
|
|
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: the netherlands
Posts: 162
|
|
|
not quite ok...
yes, it does start, but has a very high idle. if i rev it a little i see smoke from the exhaust and i sputters when i let go of the throttle. sounds like too rich mixture right?
how does that relate to a wrong fuel level in the floaterbowl?
to be continued...
sander
|
26 Oct 2009
|
|
Registered Users
Veteran HUBBer
|
|
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Stockholm
Posts: 651
|
|
|
mix, lean and rich
Hi Sander,
Was busy in Pasto getting new crankshaft bearings ...
Quote:
Originally Posted by sanderd
hi Auke,
i never touched the idle mix screw, so i might give it a try. BTW. 'she' kicks back when starting on choke on sealevel and tropical environments.
*** kicking back: decompressor cable correctly set? all plugs in the ignition system nice & tight?
i don't know sh*t about carbs and mixture and such, but on altitude it starts fine with choke. and on altitude, mixture is rich due to less oxygen in the air, right? So how can it be too rich on sealevel? If it works allraight on altitude, i expect it to be too lean on sealevel. Or does my logic fail here? :confused1:
*** Two opposite effects: 1. hot intake air: engine sees a richer mixture; cool air; engine sees a leaner mixture - the engine only sees the gas that has been evaporated, for which the hotter air is a better agent obviously
2. going up from sealevel the air pressure decreases (according my GPS 770 mbar at 3000 m - that is almost 25% less!) which makes the mix indeed richer.
In general, effect 2 is stronger, while effect 1 compensates, depending on temperature.
Quite eager to understand this stuff actually... please elaborate!
One good thing about kickstart only bikes, you do need to understand more about the technicalities!
*** Seems to me you have now 'adjusted the idle mix by adjusting the float level. Nothing wrong with that, but would recommend to also adjust the idle mix with the appropriate screw - makes a world of difference in starting.
thanks,
sander. |
Good luck!
Auke
|
26 Oct 2009
|
|
Contributing Member
Veteran HUBBer
|
|
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: the netherlands
Posts: 162
|
|
|
yeah well.... it starts getting annoying to be honest.
it runs, but the idle needs to be high and feels sort of weak. like i'm back on 4000m again. on sealevel i'm used to more powerful thumps from the exhaust. if i leave it idling it cuts out al of the sudden, with a 'pffsst' sound.
still confused.....
yesterday an german couple with their two kids showed up on their old airheads. guy was a bike mechanic. will talk to him too.
will go fiddle with the idle screw.
good luck with the bearings!
sander
|
28 Oct 2009
|
 |
Registered Users
HUBB regular
|
|
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Hemyock,UK
Posts: 36
|
|
|
Hey Sander, carb rubbers haven't gone have they? Mine was doing similar things with Knackered rubbers.........
|
|
Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 Registered Users and/or Members and 1 guests)
|
|
|
Posting Rules
|
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
HTML code is Off
|
|
|
|
Check the RAW segments; Grant, your HU host is on every month!
Episodes below to listen to while you, err, pretend to do something or other...
2020 Edition of Chris Scott's Adventure Motorcycling Handbook.
"Ultimate global guide for red-blooded bikers planning overseas exploration. Covers choice & preparation of best bike, shipping overseas, baggage design, riding techniques, travel health, visas, documentation, safety and useful addresses." Recommended. (Grant)
Ripcord Rescue Travel Insurance™ combines into a single integrated program the best evacuation and rescue with the premier travel insurance coverages designed for adventurers.
Led by special operations veterans, Stanford Medicine affiliated physicians, paramedics and other travel experts, Ripcord is perfect for adventure seekers, climbers, skiers, sports enthusiasts, hunters, international travelers, humanitarian efforts, expeditions and more.
Ripcord travel protection is now available for ALL nationalities, and travel is covered on motorcycles of all sizes!
What others say about HU...
"This site is the BIBLE for international bike travelers." Greg, Australia
"Thank you! The web site, The travels, The insight, The inspiration, Everything, just thanks." Colin, UK
"My friend and I are planning a trip from Singapore to England... We found (the HU) site invaluable as an aid to planning and have based a lot of our purchases (bikes, riding gear, etc.) on what we have learned from this site." Phil, Australia
"I for one always had an adventurous spirit, but you and Susan lit the fire for my trip and I'll be forever grateful for what you two do to inspire others to just do it." Brent, USA
"Your website is a mecca of valuable information and the (video) series is informative, entertaining, and inspiring!" Jennifer, Canada
"Your worldwide organisation and events are the Go To places to for all serious touring and aspiring touring bikers." Trevor, South Africa
"This is the answer to all my questions." Haydn, Australia
"Keep going the excellent work you are doing for Horizons Unlimited - I love it!" Thomas, Germany
Lots more comments here!
Diaries of a compulsive traveller
by Graham Field
Book, eBook, Audiobook
"A compelling, honest, inspiring and entertaining writing style with a built-in feel-good factor" Get them NOW from the authors' website and Amazon.com, Amazon.ca, Amazon.co.uk.
Back Road Map Books and Backroad GPS Maps for all of Canada - a must have!
New to Horizons Unlimited?
New to motorcycle travelling? New to the HU site? Confused? Too many options? It's really very simple - just 4 easy steps!
Horizons Unlimited was founded in 1997 by Grant and Susan Johnson following their journey around the world on a BMW R80G/S.
Read more about Grant & Susan's story
Membership - help keep us going!
Horizons Unlimited is not a big multi-national company, just two people who love motorcycle travel and have grown what started as a hobby in 1997 into a full time job (usually 8-10 hours per day and 7 days a week) and a labour of love. To keep it going and a roof over our heads, we run events all over the world with the help of volunteers; we sell inspirational and informative DVDs; we have a few selected advertisers; and we make a small amount from memberships.
You don't have to be a Member to come to an HU meeting, access the website, or ask questions on the HUBB. What you get for your membership contribution is our sincere gratitude, good karma and knowing that you're helping to keep the motorcycle travel dream alive. Contributing Members and Gold Members do get additional features on the HUBB. Here's a list of all the Member benefits on the HUBB.
|
|
|
helps answer the question - Why Go? Inspirational stories by veteran travellers Greg Frazier (5 times RTW), Peter and Kay Forwood (193 countries), Tiffany Coates (Mongolia Mayhem) and Rene Cormier (University of Gravel Roads).
Get Ready! covers planning, paperwork, medical and many other topics! "Inspirational and Awesome!" See the trailer here!
What stuff do I need - riding gear, clothing, camping gear, first aid kit, tires, maps and GPS? What don't I need? How do I pack it all in? Lots of opinions from over 150 travellers!
break down language barriers, overcome culture shock, ship the bike and deal with breakdowns and emergencies."Just makes me want to pack up and go!" See the trailer here!
Grant demystifies the black art of Tire Changing and Repair to help you STAY on the road! "Very informative and practical." See the trailer here!
Ladies on the Loose! For the first time ever, a motorcycle travel DVD made for women, by women! These intrepid women share their tips to help you plan your own motorcycle adventure. They also answer the women-only questions, and entertain you with amazing tales from the road! Presented by Lois Pryce, veteran solo traveller through South America and Africa and author of 'Lois on the Loose', and 'Red Tape and White Knuckles.'
Cotton or synth sweat-wicking t-shirts with the cool Horizons Unlimited graphic on the front and a snappy slogan (changing every year) on the back.
Show your route on your panniers. Great conversation starter when you meet people on the road!
Motorcycle and travel books to inspire and inform you!
The definitive guide to planning your motorcycle adventure! This insanely ambitious 2-year project has produced an informative and entertaining 5-part, 18 hour video series. "The ultimate round the world rider's how-to!" MCN UK.
Linear Mode
