Have I missed the new Honda Afica Twin in 2015 thread? Lots of internet rumours; patents filed etc. Anybody here know more details? Really a sub 200 kg , 1000cc "dirt oriented" bike? What's the story?

I've heard the rumors too ... and about the patents as well. If anything is really up we will probably know in November at the EICMA show in Milan.

If Honda has plans and are ready ... you may see some hint there. Maybe a prototype? or "concept" idea? Seems to be THE SHOW where the OEM's reveal new ideas for new bikes.

The Adventure bike market is changing so fast ... hard to predict. But I'm sure Honda have seen the success of both BMW and KTM have had in this segment and realize they too could easily compete by reviving an old idea.

But it will have to be very good ... not those crap 700's and VFR based pigs they've put out the last couple years. I think young Japanese retro Hipsters that cheated their way through engineering school must be running things at Honda now.
Shame. I hope they make a comeback ... but lately I see some bad product choices.

I can't go into detail, but I know for a fact that Honda is making a new Africa Twin. Prototypes have been built, but I don't know when mass production will start.
The designers at Honda know what adventure riders want, but there is no telling if that is what will eventually come off the production line. Hopefully corporate bigwigs don't demand they make just another so-called "adventure" bike with not much different from the European bikes already out there.

This is great news Chris ... I've seen "spy shots" somewhere, I believe in the UK tabloid MC press? Not always credible. But lets hope for the best. If Honda have a running prototype then we could see the new bike at the Milan show. Fingers crossed.

My bet is Honda will go UP Scale, al la R1200GS-L ($24,000 usd), KTM 1190
Adventure ($18,000 usd), Aprilia Capo Nord, Suzuki V-Strom, Yamaha 1200
Tenere', Guzzi Stelvio, Ducati Multistrada. Up scale is where the big profits are.

To compete Honda may have to go with a bigger more powerful motor to match the competition. Ducati Multi makes 135 HP, KTM ADV 123 HP, GS 111 HP, others between 87 and 110 HP. Big motor means big weight. The Wet weight of the fully equipped GS is 582 lbs. (264 kgs.), KTM 558 lbs. (253 kgs.).

Will Honda start over with an All New V twin? (RC51?) or will they go with the big VFR1200 motor? At 141 HP/80 ft. lbs., it's got the power but a heavy lump. I'll bet the V-Four gets the nod as Honda's R&D is already done. R&D on an ALL new motor is huge expense.

Honda's DCT (auto clutch) VFR1200 weighs 644 lbs. (292 kgs.) wet. I'd guess in ADV mode Honda's new Africa Twin would weigh in higher still. YIKES!

For my money, Honda should build a very light weight middle weight ADV Africa Twin. Use a very light 500cc to 700cc parallel twin. Keep it sparse and more like a Dakar racer than a Gold Wing with knobbies.
Will they do it? Nope. Honda have been reliably misreading the market consistently for the last ten years. The best bike they've made recently ... and it's a BIG HIT ... is the little Made In Thailand CRF250L. A top seller.
But Honda continue to put huge money into losers like the Rune, Fury and other abominations.

Talk on adv forum is a twin cylinder, but not a v-twin. And Honda Australia knows NOTHING!



Got a "nice" e-mail from them after forwarding a youtube interview link to them where Honda UK representative said: "its coming and people will not be disappointed"

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Squily

From what I heard, I'm pretty sure it will be 1000 cc.

I'd be betting some kind of NC700 variant maybe bored and stroked.
Fuel economy being pretty important to long distance folk.
Yamaha may have something to compete with this as well...

yea, good point. Rumors surrounding the Honda suggest a P-twin so the NC could be platform of choice. Honda have a 750 version of the NC700 ... gets something like 60 MPG. But only makes 54 HP.
It they bump out to 1000cc ... ? Who knows? My guess is it will weigh close to the Yamaha Super Tenere' 1200 ... just under 700 lbs. (around 300 kgs.)

But Yamaha seem to be way ahead of Honda in the small, light weight motor dept. lately, with their TWO stellar new engines ... one is the 800cc Triple in the FZ-09, the other the 700cc P-twin in the FZ-07. Both weigh in WET at right round 400 lbs. (181 kgs. ) and there are already rumors of Yam using the 700cc P-Twin in a smaller, lighter Mini-Super Tenere'.

The FZ-09 triple puts out 107 HP/62 ft. lbs. (claimed) The FZ-07 puts out 66 HP (dyno tested)/45 ft. lbs.

In USD the FZ-09 is just $8000, the FZ-07 $7000. These two bikes pretty much blow away ALL of the competition at every level and even though considered "low budget" entry level bikes ... they don't ride that way. Big time positive reviews world wide.

Both motors could make a decent ADV Travel bike ... if done right. But if Yamaha follow the guidelines of their SUPER over weight Tenere' 1200 ... then all for naught, IMHO.

I heard it will be a smaller engine, single cylinder and ultra lightweight.......
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I have never been so excited by a new bike...

However, I just know it will be a disappointment.

There is no real market for proper adventure bikes. There is a HUGE market for bloated, over weight , super expensive and over 'gadgeted' rolling sofa's with pretend knobblies. They are the big selling bikes. Honda want to make lots of money, not keep a few die-hards happy.

My guess it that it's going to be a 1200 rolling computer with a big tank, wide seat and weigh 250kg dry.. And cost more than any serious overlander could get a carnet for. Like Mollydog says, it will be like the big KTM's and BMW's. Great for posing and standing up on the pegs over a gravel driveway.


If they went head to head with the Triumph 800XC, then I'd be seriously impressed.

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Did some trips.
Rode some bikes.
Fix them for a living.
Can't say anymore.

Honda UK representative said: "its coming and people will not be disappointed"

I suspect if it turns out to be under 200kg and only 100bhp etc the MCN journos for one will be disappointed.

I can see their "mega road test" conclusions already - "After our comprehensive multi hour motorway test we think it's not bad for a littlun but it can't really live with the market leaders. The GS still leads the pack with the new for 2015 dayglo orange colour scheme adding a touch of class that last year's range lacked. There's still only one thoroughbred choice if you're loading up and heading off for distant horizons. By contrast the A.T. looks like it was designed by a committee consisting solely of accountants. Honda say "less is more" but we think it looks more like pennypinching and trying to trade off of the legendary status of the original Africa Twin".



For all that we can see the advantages of smaller and lighter, Honda still have to sell them and "top trumps" is a well trodden marketing route. Maybe they'll subsequently introduce a smaller one of the back of the behemoth a la 800 /1200 Triumph but naming it could be a problem - Africa Single doesn't quite do it and they've already plundered the Alps. The "Spain and no further Twin" maybe? The Corsica Twin has a certain ring about it but it sounds more like someone you'd hire to sort out your err ... business problems. Makes me pleased I don't work in marketing.

2016 honda africa twin - IndefinitelyWild have heard the official announcement will be made 9:30am at November 4th at EICMA

Prototype:





















If there will be a release it will probably look totally different but I think it's cool, like an old Super Tenere

Is the mud paint job standard, or an optional extra?

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