Kelvination, I was just in Venado Tuerto trailing the Dakar. We might have been there the same time.

My understanding is that if your Argentine uncle is legally added as a co owner on the title of your legal Argentine registered motorcycle, that he has the right to secure a Temporary Export Permit for the motorcycle at any border of Argentina. Yes, he must do this in person.

After I became a permanent foreign resident of Argentina, I was permitted to export Elisa's legally registered Argentine motorcycle to Uruguay, because I am on the title as co owner. Elisa had not received her permanent foreign residence status.

I noticed that Buque Bus does not bother with the formality of a Temporary Export Permit for Argentine registered bikes, but other borders might.

Your uncle might be asked when he is returning the motorcycle to Argentina, and he might not, this is difficult to predict because some borders are more observant of this formality than others.

Once you leave Argentina, your Argentine title and your green card "tarjeta verde" plus your Mercosur or other insurance, should meet the standards for Temporary Vehicle Import Permits for all other South American countries.

Remember you will be required to return your Argentine registered motorcycle before the expiration date on the Temporary Export permit, this document may or may not be requested at the borders of other South American countries.

As you may have noticed, I am trying to keep all who read HUBB posts updated on this particular topic. I will add here, that I am advising you to the best of my ability, but I am not an official of Argentina. On other threads I have posted the actual laws and regulations pertinent to a wide range of topics, but this is not the case here. So, I do suggest you check with the aduana/customs/border officials to verify all that I suggest here. Laws and regulations are subject to periodic change. And, please if you find out anything different, post that information on this thread.

Looking forward to seeing you in Buenos Aires

Eat, Drink and Be Careful xfiltrate

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Discover how to legally Buy, Tour and Sell a motorcycle in Argentina

Hi
i am a new Zealander i have been in argentina for 2 months now living in San Antonio De Areco and have brought myself a honda XR250 tornado off a local bike dealer. the bike already has plates and i have been issued with a green card through a local lawyer. I dont speek spanish and am not sure what papers they have given me.
What i really want to do is ride it around south america but since learnt that it could be a problem getting out of argentina. do you have any advice on these problems?
Thanks nick

Hi Nick
Maybe you should has ask before doing paper transfers.....
Its logical to think that the former argie owner was looking to do the transfer ASAP.Its a responsabilty problem.Because he could have done with notary an authorization to you for exiting Argentina.Very easy.
But now its late.
I pointed this issue before here but was not propperly understood.
Don´t know how you can solve this matter now.
Have you been afected bu the floodings there?Terrible thing what?
Karl

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[quote=Vorteks;268402]Risks do exist, for both co owners. The american owner of the house where i m staying in Buenos Aires wanted to buy a boat for weekend exploring. For whatever legal reason, he couldnt buy one directly. He offered his gardener co ownership. The gardener prefered to sell and cash the boat than to keep a long term friendly relationship with his employer.

I m not saying that Argentines are dishonest by nature, but this is a harsh environment (3rd world salaries, 1rst world costs in B.As). Necessity sometimes forces people into betrayal.

I have no preference between shipping and a buy back deal. Both have similar costs and risks. You can also leave your bike in a friends place and it might "vanish" too. I m just trying to sum up both solutions advantages and drawbacks.

Hi Phillipe
Not only the comercial issues as you told, i pointed before the legal nigthmare of an accident or crime.
Imagine you are involved in serious accident,killing someone on the street.By law both parties are responsable(argie coowner and rider).You could/will drag the argie coowner into a legal problem. I would say that asking that favor to an allmost unkown person is to high.
I think that the most used way of importing your own bike and exiting it is still the best choice.
I would dare to rate it to 95% of the cases.Rest is rental and buying here and touring as suggested on the tred title.
Karl

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America is a nice continent,not a country.All people who lives in this continent are americans.Discover it in peace!

nickberkett, BCK_973 gives good advice, if the bike you recently purchased has Argentine plates, and if you bought it from a local dealer and were given a "green card" for the bike, it is Argentine registered, and you as a foreign tourist probably will not be permitted to ride the bike out of Argentina.

As mentioned, with an Argentine co owner - also issued a green card, the Argentine co owner could exit the bike from Argentina. Then, you would be legal to continue into the adjoining country and be issued a Temporary Vehicle Import Permit. Returning the bike to Argentina should not be a problem, legally.

Although, BCK_973 (Karl) is right again regarding the shared liability.... if you had a serious accident with personal injury, death or substantial property damage, your co owner could also be held responsible in a court of law.

*There might be a way to petition the aduana (customs) if you have a "domocillio" or residence certified by local police (2 day easy process) in Argentina to issue you a Temporary Vehicle Export Permit.

I was issued a Temporary Vehicle Export Permit at Paso de Hama - Andes crossing into Chile while still legally a foreign tourist in Argentina and while riding my legally owned Argentine registered bike. It could have been the border official was just being very kind to us, as Paso de Hama was very cold, and a long way from Buenos Aires.

I have not heard of any other foreign tourist being issued such a permit, but maybe no one asked???

If anyone knows more about Temporary Vehicle Export Permits issued to foreign tourists in Argentina, for the purpose of temporary export of their legally owned Argentine registered motorcycle,

PLEASE POST HERE.

There was a time limit on the Temporary Vehicle Export Permit which indicated when I was required by law, to return the bike to Argentina.

It might be worth a try? Hope this helps.

One other idea is to get a cell phone, advertise your bike, start taking offers, but explain that the bike will not be for sale until you finish your tour of Argentina, sell your bike in Argentina, then enter Chile, buy a bike there, tour Chile, sell the bike in Chile, go to the next country etc. etc. etc. If you are cleaver you might end up your tour of South America with more money than you spent on the bike you bought in Argentina.

Eat, Drink, and Be Careful xfiltrate

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Discover how to legally Buy, Tour and Sell a motorcycle in Argentina

An update, we are still touring. currently in Cafayate, Agentina.

Good news a foreign couple are buying 2 Hondas (new) in Buenos Aires.... I always like to report those who are buying Argentine registered bikes in Argentina. Buenas Rutas...

Eat, Drink and Be Careful

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Discover how to legally Buy, Tour and Sell a motorcycle in Argentina

I have my US bike here in Argentina and I plan have my brother ride it back up to the states. I plan to change the title over to his name so that when he crosses into Chile he can have start anew. Question: what exactly does one have to do when leaving Argentina? In other countries I merely handed the customs official my paperwork and that was it. I figure my brother could do the same and once in chile he will check in w his title on the bike. Am I missing something? Is it NOT that simple?

You will need to get your TVIP cancelled with your name on it, then he will need to be with the bike to get into the next border crossing and he will need a Title in his name, then he gets issued with a TVIP in his name, all pretty easy

Cheers
TS

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of course the other thing that no one has mentioned is the 75% tax on vehicles over 200cc....alternatively, one could buy my US registered Harley and ride where you like, with no passengers!

harleydan, not sure what bike purchase in Argentina... has a 75% tax?

Bikes, like the Hondas manufactured in Brazil, and purchased by foreign tourists in Argentina have very minimal tax, registration fees etc, not even close to 75% of cost of bike. The tax is between 5% and 10%, if the bike is purchased new or as described here with Zero Kilometers.

If you are referring to importing a foreign registered bike and registering it in Argentina your 75% import tariff sounds about right.*

*Each Argentine and Permanent Foreign Resident of Argentina, with DNI, is permitted to import one foreign registered vehicle.

As far as I know, foreign tourists are not permitted to register their foreign registered bikes in Argentina, even if they are willing to pay the import tariff.

If anyone knows more about this topic please post.

I am returned from my ride to Cafayate, Salta. Great trip. I learned much about the Argentina aduana during my trip. I had the very good fortune to meet a retired official of the aduana. He explained that, while I might be surprised that much of what the aduana does or does not do is, in fact, negotiable, there is good reason and tradition behind this fact.

In the early days, when the Spanish were collecting tariffs on all goods coming into or going out of Argentina, Buenos Aries was like a pueblo, until the port was established and ships began unloading and loading cargo in Buenos Aires to avoid the ports controlled by the Spaniards.

In the early days...there was little or no industry in Buenos Aires at this time and little agriculture when compared to the colonized and developed north of Argentina.

So Buenos Aires was financed by the tariffs collected on the contraband goods that were imported and exported via the port. I call the goods, as did the aduana official, "contraband" simply because they were goods that would be taxed by the Spanish if they were imported or exported through Spanish controlled ports.

So, now I understand. The aduana has the great distinction and wonderful tradition of financing, what has become, one of the greatest cities in the world, the Capital Federal. Without the aduana, Buenos Aires would not be the world class city it is today. I finally got it!

Now when I speak with Argentines, I full well understand their point of view regarding the aduana.

Eat, Drink and Be Careful xfiltrate

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Discover how to legally Buy, Tour and Sell a motorcycle in Argentina

All this is completely WRONG. Each Argentinean is permitted to import one foreign registered vehicle ONLY if He/She is returning after been leaving out of the country as resident in other country.
Anyway must pay import taxes (75% or more) and prove that quit to the foreign residence and the vehicle belong to him for a certain time.

All others, normal resident natives or foreigners have forbidden to import any vehicle and register it, only formal importers legally registered in Customs and Tax offices can import ONLY brand new vehicles. Permanent import of any USED vehicle is completely prohibited.

Completely different matter is as a normal Traveller brings their own vehicle as a temporary import and signs a compromise to take it out of the country.

Apologize if I’m not copy exactly the words of the law. I know this for my wife experience working with customs every day.

That’s why so many people (included myself) says this thread is useless and complicate, is full of misunderstandings and completely wrong information…

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Javier...
Dakar Motos “ ”

Hi javkap, hope you enjoyed the Dakar. The Irish team finished, and I am in Spain now and will soon visit the Irish team in Ireland. We will lift a few pints, I suppose.

I understand and respect your position regarding my last post. But perhaps a review of the actual law might help you understand what I have posted on this thread. While I welcome your comments I do not agree that my last post "is completely wrong."

Here are two different descriptions (in English) of the importation laws for Argentine citizens, who have resided abroad... I was writing of "returning Argentine citizens", not all Argentine citizens, sorry , i omitted the word returning.... I should have clarified that.... and I was writing of foreigners with permanent foreign resident status, regarding the importation and nationalization of vehicles and motorcycles. I have verified what is written below with a reputable Argentine despachante very recently.


Yes, a returning Argentine, within certain time limits, can import one used foreign registered vehicle or motorcyle and so can each foreigner with permanent foreign resident status.

Thanks for your comments.


.. Cars and Motorcycles:
Returning Argentine citizens:
The importation of vehicles for Argentine citizens will be allowed if customer has been living
overseas/abroad for more than 1 year and they have not returned to Argentina for more than 60 days
within that period. (Customer will pay import taxes and duties).
Foreign citizens:
The importation of vehicles for foreign citizens, will be allowed if customer has obtained his
«permanent resident visa». (Customer will pay import taxes and duties).
Documents required for the definitive importation:
. Original certificate of residence issued by the Argentine Consulate. (Argentine returning citizens)
. Original title deed or certificate of vehicle from country or state of residence.
. Original invoice.
Foreigners with temporary visa:
If temporary visa is obtained, the vehicle may be imported temporarily. No duties or taxes would be
paid on such temporary import. The period under current regulations may be extended for an
additional period. If a permanent visa is granted, the vehicle may be nationalized, converting the
temporary import into a final importation. In such case it will pay import taxes and duties.
Documents required for the temporary importation:
. Original title deed or certificate of vehicle from country or state of residence
. Original invoice.
IMPORTANT: Only 1 (one) automobile or motorcycle can be imported by persons over 21 years old
persons. Original title deed or certificate and original invoice, must be at the name of consignee.

ARGENTINE CUSTOMS REGULATIONS FOR IMPORTATION OF VEHICLES

DIPLOMATS are able to import used or new cars with a Diplomatic Franchise issued by the Ministry of Foreign Affairs.

RETURNING ARGENTINE CITIZENS may import used vehicles only, under the same rules that apply to Argentine citizens returning.

PERSONS WITH PERMANENT RESIDENT STATUS may import used vehicles only, under the same rules that apply to Argentine citizens returning.

PERSONS WITH TEMPORARY VISA may import used cars under temporary admission. The car is only allowed temporary admission for the same period the client has the Visa and can be renewed if the client renews the Visa. Before the visa expires, the vehicle must be removed from Argentina. VEHICLE MUST KEEP THE ORIGINAL PLATES.
General Requirements:

Car must enter Argentina within (6) six months after shipper/owner arrival.
Vehicle and its documentation must be under shipper's name.
Importation of new cars is subject to Ministry of Commerce regulations and is limited to certain types of vehicles. New vehicles can not be imported as part of the move


Documentation Required for Argentine Citizens and Foreign Citizens with Permanent Residence:

1) Owner’s original passport.

2) 2 Original B/L’s.

3) Complete car documentation including the property title under the name of the shipper.

Original purchase invoice.
Certificate of Residence issued by the Argentine Consulate at origin country ( for Argentine citizens returning only)
Note: All documents that are not issued in Spanish must be translated by an official Translator and certified by the Argentine College of Translators.


Duties / Taxes:

Approximately 80% of car CIF value for normal cars , 100% for diesel cars and 65% for motorcycles.

Argentine citizens returning can use this franchise (always paying taxes and duties) only once per lifetime and Customs will authorize just one for each adult member of the family.

Eat, Drink and Be Careful xfiltrate

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Discover how to legally Buy, Tour and Sell a motorcycle in Argentina

Note this thread will be watched. "Reasonableness" will be a required criteria!

If you get it, you know - if you're wondering "what the heck is he talking about" then no worries, it's all sorted!

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Grant Johnson
Seek, and ye shall find.
------------------------
Inspiring, Informing and Connecting travellers since 1997!
www.HorizonsUnlimited.com

I understand the problem - at the same time, there is a lot of good info and people do want to know. The thread has had a LOT of readers!

Perhaps you could do a post that encapulates the basics that ARE known and confirmed?

And I could always delete the posts that are misleading / wrong / irrelevant. If you and xfiltrate give me a list I'll look at it. And I know you two will disagree, so will keep that well in mind!

__________________
Grant Johnson
Seek, and ye shall find.
------------------------
Inspiring, Informing and Connecting travellers since 1997!
www.HorizonsUnlimited.com

I have to say here, that when I wanted to sell my bike, this was the first thread I came to, but found it the most confusing peice of writing I have ever read. What a normal traveller wants to know is how to buy and sell a bike down there in SA. NOT all of them care to buy a new bike, but most of them wish to ride that bike beyond that countries border.

All they want to know is the process in buying a used bike that someone else wants to sell. In fact, a buyer and seller normally find eachother quite easy via this website.

This has nothing to do with the import export laws of new bikes. All they need to know is the precise process involved in 'doing' the paperwork that is needed for the bike to enter the country in one bikers name, and leave with another bikers name.

If I had followed the information supplied by the OP, then I would never have been able to sell my bike down there, because all my questions were answered with more involved hard to read answere, which was really hard to understand when you have limited internet access.

So, I guess what this forum needs is a thread that outlines the EXACT processes needed for the deal to go through, even though there are some grey areas involved.

But, is that allowed on this site, or will there be legal issues if the method is mentioned here?

Cheers
TravellingStrom

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