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**JMo (& piglet)** · #1 8 Nov 2018

Yep, you can accuse me of hypocrisy in starting a 'speculation' thread if you like - but following on from all the current EICMA madness, this little doozy popped up yesterday, and I want to be the one to put my hand up first and say - it looks friggin' awesome!

A little more info. here from ADVmoto:

https://adventuremotorcycle.com/news...cb125x-concept

Now sure it's just a 'concept' bike for the moment, and yes, only 125cc too... but look closely at the fit and finish on the components:

Yes, that level of detailing is the typical Honda way of course - but all the cast aluminium parts are production ready, and the other components are all current Honda parts-bin too... however, what is fundamentally important is that it would appear to have EXACTLY THE SAME FRAME as the new production CB300R which was launched at the show earlier this week:

THE SAME DAMN FRAME!!!

I'm willing to put money down that we see a a CB300X/CR300L 'Adventure/Rally' based on this platform in the next twelve months... (which is why Honda were content to leave the 250cc engine in the current 250L rally I suspect).

All you unicorn hunters who want a 'rally replica' style dual-sport/ADV bike under 150Kg, I think the gestation period has already started!

Thoughts?

Jenny x

**Mezo** · #2 8 Nov 2018

It's "only" 125cc because that's the biggest engine you are allowed on L plates in the UK. i think it looks fantastic.

Mezo.

**JMo (& piglet)** · #3 9 Nov 2018

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mezo

It's "only" 125cc because that's the biggest engine you are allowed on L plates in the UK. i think it looks fantastic.

Mezo.

Yes - and the whole of Europe that have the A1/A2 tiered licencing system.

Honda are putting a lot of effort into the 125cc class in general (particularly as certain Asian markets also demand 125s too) - the Grom, the Monkey, the SuperCub, plus their more full-size CBR125R and CB125R models...

Since the CB125R and CB300R version essentially share the same frame and other major cycle/body parts, there is no reason we won't also see A1 and A2 versions of the X model too if [WHEN!] it launches...

In fact I'm pretty much banking on it!

Jenny x

**JMo (& piglet)** · #4 9 Nov 2018

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cholo

seems they copied the tenere

Hee hee - it's certainly pretty similar - particularly from head-on:

Although ironically this is more likely to be available sooner than the Tenere 700, well, in the US at least... ;o)

Jx

**Numer0_6** · #5 11 Nov 2018

I love the concept, could be a great alternative to the crf250l indeed! would be awesome if it come available with 125 and 300cc versions ! Could be an awesome beginner bike or for some market really demanding on these types of displacements !

(But even with this eventually on the market, I would do the same choice of a husqy 701, which is less than 150kg dry... even if not adventure ready straight out of the box !)

**JMo (& piglet)** · #6 11 Nov 2018

Quote:

Originally Posted by Numer0_6

I love the concept, could be a great alternative to the crf250l indeed! would be awesome if it come available with 125 and 300cc versions ! Could be an awesome beginner bike or for some market really demanding on these types of displacements !

(But even with this eventually on the market, I would do the same choice of a husqy 701, which is less than 150kg dry... even if not adventure ready straight out of the box !)

Hi Numer0 - yes, if you're going by on-paper spec/top trumps, the current Husky 701/KTM 690 (new model) is very hard to beat... and all the time they are in production, are likely to be considered the sub 150Kg 'performance' off-road benchmark.

However, those bikes are considerably more expensive that this 125/300X is likely to be, and also have a towering seat-height in comparison. Historical fuel injection (and other) issues not withstanding, as you say - both the Austrian* uber-enduros are also going to require a degree of civilising before they are going to be as comfortable and painless to own too - especially if longer-distance multi-day travelling is your goal.

*They have the same parents ;o)

Personally I don't think it's particularly realistic to compare a 30hp 300cc 'adventure' bike with something that makes twice that power and was designed for a very different purpose (open class enduro/rally riding) - I'm just glad that there is an increasing range of options out there that ought to suit a wider range of ADV and travel riders?

Jx

**Numer0_6** · #7 11 Nov 2018

Quote:

Originally Posted by JMo (& piglet)

Hi Numer0 - yes, if you're going by on-paper spec/top trumps, the current Husky 701/KTM 690 (new model) is very hard to beat... and all the time they are in production, are likely to be considered the sub 150Kg 'performance' off-road benchmark.

However, those bikes are considerably more expensive that this 125/300X is likely to be, and also have a towering seat-height in comparison. Historical fuel injection (and other) issues not withstanding, as you say - both the Austrian* uber-enduros are also going to require a degree of civilising before they are going to be as comfortable and painless to own too - especially if longer-distance multi-day travelling is your goal.

*They have the same parents ;o)

Personally I don't think it's particularly realistic to compare a 30hp 300cc 'adventure' bike with something that makes twice that power and was designed for a very different purpose (open class enduro/rally riding) - I'm just glad that there is an increasing range of options out there that ought to suit a wider range of ADV and travel riders?

Jx

Well, after all, you're right. it is not really to be compared with some rally machines, and the prices would be really different. The fact that the 701 is good for me and my long legs (and money and time spent civilizing it) doesn't mean it is what everyone needs... Eventhough I love this bike so much that I recommend it to everyone as soon as the occasion occurs...

but after all, to each his own!

Anyway, I hope those bikes come to production, to widen a bit more the possibilities spectrum of travel bike choice!It is always a good thing, and surely I'll go and give it a try at my local dealership if they ever have one.

**stuxtttr** · #8 16 Nov 2018

this bike could pave the way for some serious do it all machines, will be interesting to see how it fares against a ktm 390 adventure but I'd put my money on the honda.

It would be great to have a race series for these bikes similar to the adv class in some uk big bike rallys.

**Ian** · #9 16 Nov 2018

So, could that chassis also be used for a CB500 motor?

**JMo (& piglet)** · #10 16 Nov 2018

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ian

So, could that chassis also be used for a CB500 motor?

Unlikely (although anything can be made to fit if you try hard enough ;o)

The CB125/300R share the same frame, but that is because they were designed to be a small compact single-cylinder machine in the first place.

While the Rebel 500 and 300 also share the same frame, the frame itself was designed to accommodate the CB500 engine, and therefore there is a lot more free space around the 300cc single in that version.

If Honda do ever build a more focussed dual-sport/adventure bike around the CB500 engine (a Trans-Alp as it were, if not a full-on CRF500L/X), then the bike itself will have to be physically that bit larger to accommodate the engine, ancillaries and for the cycle parts to handle the extra power and torque of the larger engine etc. etc.

That is not to say it would not share a family resemblance to the concept bike above, but you're not going to see anything other than a single cylinder in the particular platform above.

Jx

**AdmirAlex** · #11 12 Dec 2018

A couple of days ago some friends invited me to put on an Acerbis tank for their CRF250L, which was quite fun. What impressed me was the toughness of the headstock bearings (?). The area where the forks connect to the frame. Its really beefy.

Since the potential cb300x intrigues me i checked the cb300r's frame and would like to ask you what your oppinion is on that matter. Does the frame look suitable for adventure/rtw/offroad use?

By the way, how does the rear shock system work precisely?

greetings

**JMo (& piglet)** · #12 13 Dec 2018

Quote:

Originally Posted by AdmirAlex

A couple of days ago some friends invited me to put on an Acerbis tank for their CRF250L, which was quite fun. What impressed me was the toughness of the headstock bearings (?). The area where the forks connect to the frame. Its really beefy.

Since the potential cb300x intrigues me i checked the cb300r's frame and would like to ask you what your oppinion is on that matter. Does the frame look suitable for adventure/rtw/offroad use?

By the way, how does the rear shock system work precisely?

greetings

Hi AdmirAlex - I'm sure if Honda do release this bike in an ADV/trail-bike role, they'll be confident the frame is plenty strong enough, or modify it so it is...

Certainly looking at your picture above, there seems to be plenty of bracing between the frame rails and the headstock already, and I can tell you with some* confidence...

*I say 'some', I mean 'complete' of course ;o)

...that the stock CB500X frame is also more than strong enough to handle some serious abuse if required to do so:

With regard to the rear shock in your illustration - it is simply a direct mount (ie. non-linkage) - in other words as the swing-arm rises, it compresses the shock directly in a linear motion... there is a degree of rate due to where the base of the shock is mounted compared to the swing-arm pivot, but essentially the ratio is fixed throughout the stroke - just like a lot of KTM enduro bikes and a number of street bikes too (the Ducati Monster and Scrambler come to mind, mainly because I like Ducati's ;o).

for info. Linkages can be used to increase [wheel] travel compared to a relatively short shock stroke (although this is rarely ideal, especially on a budget bike - as controlling small movements of a shock compared to longer ones is more difficult without really good damping circuits, which typically cost a lot more money), but more-often are used to provide a degree of rate change - typically so that as the shock compresses, the action gets progressively slower, reducing the chance of a heavy bottoming out.

Hope that helps...

Jenny x

**JMo (& piglet)** · #13 5 Jun 2019

Just to revive this thread, a link from a post on another forum earlier today - looks like Honda are protecting their 'IP' at least... does this mean we will subsequently see something 'pre production' at EICMA later this year?

https://www.morebikes.co.uk/58774/ho...-in-milan/amp/

Jx