I'm gonna let you road test the ccm adventure when they eventually get it to market Jake. After (if?) all the faults get ironed out, then I might consider it as a serious alternative to the bikes I already own (built by Honda, Suzuki, Triumph and BMW (rebadged Aprilia ). With these I also let others road test the make/model combos first.

Back to the vw/skoda analogy: vw had a proven track record of reliability when they took over the basket case skoda. Skoda were forced to build cars the vw way. I'm not convinced Austin Clews has a prior track record manufacturing a reliable motor vehicle. I wish him all the very best improving the damaged ccm reputation. I hope you don't get flogged a pup in the interim.

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I would LOVE to own a CCM. I really really would. I love that they're different and can aim at a smaller market with specific machines.

I'll let someone else be the test dummy though...

I might pick one up second hand in 18-24 months. See how they fair.

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Did some trips.
Rode some bikes.
Fix them for a living.
Can't say anymore.

I would have bought 2 if they wouldn't have an enduro engine in it.

As per at the Adv Overland Show (where there were two bikes on their display) it is still in prototype form and CCM continue to take feedback.
They said that they will be fitting only the 450cc BMW engine and they aim to have 10 of their bikes at the next annual show at the NEC, UK (last week of Nov http://www.motorcyclelive.co.uk/?gcl...FYdc3god3yEA3Q )

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Dave

I went to the Show last weekend on the Sunday Morning , I saw that AJP had various models on display but I didnt see CCM anywhere ? maybe they got bored by Sunday ? Great show mind really enjoyed it

At least if they sell any bikes before the NEC show it gives the new owner half a chance of getting them fixed! Jokes aside I found the only way to get the Factory to take any positive action was to attend the Show and sort things out on the Stand, They agreed to pick the bike up and return it to the Factory and keep it there until it was fixed. In the meantime I was without transport but at least the bike ran ok for a month or so until it broke down again !

I departed sunday morning before the day arrivals came in, to ride for most of those daylight hours.
CCM were quite near the AJP stand with two bikes under their tent - a few pitches along in the row and next to the gateway into the adjacent field = back to back with James Cargo shipping services if that rings a bell.

All of the bike stands were in that row of pitches with the exception of one or two dealers selling accessories.
During the Saturday night, the organiser of the show was a bit apologetic for the relatively small number of stands relating to 2 wheels and he is hoping to have more there next year.

http://www.adventureoverlandshow.com/
There were quite a few riders there from the Friday night with a special offer of 3 nights camping for £25 that included entry to the show on both Saturday and Sunday (but I had seen enough by Sunday am and the bike wanted to go riding).

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Dave

Yeah all rings a bell minus CCM, there was a bit of a gap and then some nice looking FAT tyred mountain bikes. My little lad wanted an ice cream so my attention may have been diverted but I would be suprised if I totally missed them, hey ho be interesting to see what they have at the Dirtbike show if I can fit in a couple of hours on the Thursday afternoon.

As for the show, pity there was not more two wheelers but its one of the first shows I have been to where nearly everything was interesting and after a couple of hours wandering there was still new stuff to look at.

Would it not have been better for CCM to have fitted the 650 lump in out of the X Challenge/Country as this engine has been proven

That's a heavy motor, which likely goes against what CCM is trying achieve

Husky already went this route with the TR, which was significantly heavier than the preceding TE.

In some ways the BMW 450 motor is an understandable choice.

It's relatively cheap.
It's got the BMW name to attract the monied / badge conscious punters
It's light.
It's not being used by any competitor to avoid price comparison.
The power is very reasonable for the purpose, and likely a power-up kit can be made available at a later stage (extra profit).

Pity about the lack of a bombproof reputation, but then CCM are already have to with that issue.

Maybe a better strategy would have been to start with a totally different name...


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Lots and lots of positives coming out from the NEC show about the CCM - yet its all gone very hushed on here. ( there is quite a bit on Advriders site) I did not get to the show but have spoke with a few people that did and they said CCM had designers and tech chaps on hand to answer questions and that they did in fact answer everything openly and honestly that they were asked about the bikes, further stated that the finished bikes were simply excellent in both quality and execution and attracted huge amounts of interest not to mention a lot of orders that were placed at the show. Anyone here go to the show maybe test any of the bikes at the show ? any thing further to add to this thread.

Positive feedback..

A few people need to go and do some RTW's on them now.

I wonder if CCM will give me one to ride to Magadan on

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Did some trips.
Rode some bikes.
Fix them for a living.
Can't say anymore.

Big ups to CCM for giving it a go ... I love that bike! But I fear they may not be able to hang on long enough to re-establish a solid reputation, bringing in new buyers sufficient to make ends meet. Several USA start ups tried and failed at producing dual sport /enduro bikes: Like Cannondale and ATK ... (going back to the 80's and 90's).

Both had promise (and some success) but neither could hang on long enough to make their bikes main stream nor improve them enough to compete on a world stage. Both were more competitively priced than the current CCM relative to comparable bikes. A $10,000 usd plus dirt bike is a hard sell.

CCM has the additional handicap of a "not so great" previous reputation (UK) to deal with. They are virtually unknown in the US. (perhaps a good thing?) What they may need is a big buck investor. Perhaps they can follow Erik Buell's path in his struggle to re-launch his Buell Race bike after being dumped by Harley-Davidson?

Lucky for Buell, he is now 49% owned by Indian giant Hero Moto (Hero Honda), one of top three MC manufacturers in the world. If you have $56,000 USD handy ... you can buy a Buell racer NOW!

IMHO, CCM would be a perfect match for Triumph. According to insiders at Triumph, they have been looking around for a path into lighter adventure/ dirt/Enduro bikes ... specifically singles. Could CCM be a match for them?


With Triumph's continuing success (and profits) ... seems this could be a good time to begin producing Enduro/Rally/Travel bikes. With Triumph's set up in Thailand, they could probably produce the bike there at around one third the cost of the UK with no loss in quality.

CCM's Kymco (Taiwan) motor (BMW designed) is a question. Kymco have outstanding quality ... so maybe continue the partnership with Kymco continuing to produce the lively 450? Or? Triumph have said they DID NOT want to invest in an "all new" motor ... so who knows?

Many confuse the Loncin, China made motors that BMW/Husky have used in X bikes, G650's, Husky Terra et al with the G450 Kymco motor used in the CCM bike. Kymco produce the BMW designed G450 motor (for BMW) used in the former BMW dirt bike. Who knows how much longer they will manufacture it
or when stocks will run out?

Kymco are a good company ... but Loncin are improving FAST. Loncin produce millions of bikes/scooters annually, along with 10 (or so) other major Chinese scooter/bike producers. Kymco also invented much of the CVT trans tech now used in cars, scooters and bikes.

Well if you look at the 690R (the 690 engine, not the 650..), KTM successfully produced a engine which does 10.000km service intervals, and kept the weight below 140km. And with the latest incarnation of the 690R it looks to be a very solid package. Ok, if one then adds a rally/enduro tower and tanks then it's probably an extra 20kg...

I don't think their choice had much to do with brand reputation, more price to keep the price down, as they will never be able to sell the number KTM, or anyone else does which means that they have to look at the grand picture of numbers which means that they have to choose to use some cheaper options than fx. KTM.

I am still looking forward to CCM handing out a bike to an overland traveler to let him/her have a go at it for a longer trip, and then see what happens (they might be able to convince Colebatch to take the honors). That is probably the only way they will be able to prove the quality of the bike.


Casper

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