Dear all,

hope you are well!
It has been a while since I've last posted something here but for the past 5 weeks, I've been doing little but reading and researching the HUBB and bike forums. Basically doing my homework.

I'm about to jump on my biggest trip yet. A proper RTW covering the whole of Europe, Africa (down west, up east), Asia, Alaska to Ushuaia and, hopefully, 60.000 miles and 18 months later, back to London.

Now; my last very big trip was 9 years ago and I must admit I am a bit rusty, therefore, I am planning to leave in the Spring of 2018. Before then, I will take every opportunity to do long solo trips to get back in the groove.
My planning is moving at a very fast pace and I am confident I will overcome the biggest challenge of them all: TO LEAVE!


Having said all that, I am now at that magical, amazing, delicious moment when I will buy my bike and the contenders are:

-KTM990 2009 (finding lots with around 20.000 miles at £4.800)
-GS1200 2006 (finding some with around 40.000 miles at £5.000)
-F800GS 2010 (difficult to find, but have seen a few with 20.000 at £4.999.99)
-TIGER 800XC 2009 (quite a few with 20.000 miles at £4.800)

(basically, my budget is between £4000 and £5000 and would be lovely to get something at £4.250)


I have read enough stuff like "decide your bike depending on your route" or "how much off-road will you do".
All rubbish really since all these bikes are much more capable than me and we all know you could do this trip with almost any bike you choose. On top of that, I will be chasing as much tarmac as possible so, in theory, they can all do a fine job.
So I am coming from a mentality of allowing the bike to find me as much as I will find her (what I mean is my ultimate choice will depend on the opportunity I find when the money is in my hand. Which will be now, May 2017)


I love all these bikes almost equally (usually love the most the one I am looking at any given moment) so the heart-part of things is definitely covered.
At the moment I'm SO IN LOVE with the KTM990 despite its huge proportions. Plenty of great bikes for sale in the UK at the moment...
The GS1200 is the safest choice(?) and demands least maintenance on long distances with its driveshaft. Not too difficult to find but finding a good one might not be so easy.
The F800GS is the most sensible choice. Cheapest insurance, best MPG, although not too many available at the moment.
Then there is the Tiger with its silky smooth engine and awesome power... Plenty available out there.

Here comes my question then:
How many miles would you consider too many miles on each of these bikes? I'm no expert in mechanics and always feel like bikes can go forever depending on how well they've been maintained. So, for the sake of the argument and to make matters as simple as possible, let's pretend all of these bikes are in good condition for their age, have full-service history and are sensibly presented.

Appreciate everyone's contribution. I know most of you are far more qualified than me (especially regarding mechanics) so BIG THANKS! Any tips on specificities, and what to look for (engine-wise) are also very much welcomed!

IT'S BIKE TIME!!!!!!!!!

In my opinion it is not about mileage but maintainance and how previous owners have looked after them, I would sooner have any of these bikes that had been well looked after for 50,000 miles than abused for 5,000. As you like all of them and they are all perfectly capable I would be suggest buying one for its condition and history rather than which model it is, especially if it and its previous owner has a personal recommendation from someone you trust.

I've gone off these heavier bikes myself, so I won't comment on choice specifically, but I will comment on the value or otherwise of the shaft drive.

I don't get the 'less maintenance' argument with a shaft. Yes, you don't need to oil it but that's about it for advantages. Replace your chain and sprocket before you go and it'll probably last even if you rarely oil it.

In the unlikely event something goes wrong with it it's the kind of tech that can be fixed anywhere in the world. I'm sure a good mechanic anywhere in the world is perfectly capable of understanding a BMW shaft drive system but does he have the spares or experience to work on it? Not likely.

If you're concerned about failure you only need three fairly compact parts to carry a whole spare system. You won't be carrying a spare shaft drive unit in even the biggest panniers, I suspect. Even if you did I guess they're pretty tricky to install, compared to two sprockets and a chain.

Throw in weight as well... I just don't see the benefits.

I will say that I've had two 800 Tigers, done many miles on mixed terrain and they never missed a beat. Top heavy but hard to beat on tarmac, can be manhandled off road. If you buy a used 'original model' Tiger make sure the gear select pin problem has been seen to or your gearbox may die, affected the pre 2015 models. Also on the pre 2015 be aware that the idle set solenoid is not inside the engine like the new models so it can get gunked up and stick. Just needs a periodic clean and lube.

The 'bike is more capable than I am' argument is a false one though, it's not as simple as that - sure, put the Tiger in the hands of a pro and it can do vastly more impressive things than I ever could with it - but it's not about the mechanical and physical limits of the machine. It's rider and machine together, in unison - I've been able to do so much more on my little 701 Enduro than I ever dreamed I could on the Tiger and its still a hooligan on the tarmac. But there has been enough said about light bikes here, I won't bang on.

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[ Tim | History - NW Italy/French Rivera, Swiss Alps, Morocco | 2016 - Greece > Albania > Macedonia > Kosovo > Montenegro > Bosnia > Slovenia > Austria ]

GS1200 the safest choice???


regarding mileage it all depends how bike was ridden and maintained, just numbers won't tell much.
Also IMO chain driven bikes are safer fro such trip, if the shaft breaks you're done. Not so with chain.
Besides what's the problem with spraying chain with lube from time to time???

Please take my reply with a grain of salt, because my experience is limited, but I do own a 990 Adventure and have some thoughts that might help you.

I don't want to make this too much of a "which bike" or a "light vs. heavy" reply but I agree that a skilled rider can do a lot with a heavy bike.

The "it's 80% rider, 20% bike" rule is useful in explaining why any given bike can't overcome any given obstacle but it doesn't mean that for any given individual the ease of overcoming the obstacle only varies slightly from bike to bike. The less skilled you are, the less forgiving a large bike is and the less comfortable or enjoyable your trip can end up being. Yes, the bike may be capable but the less capable you are the more you will hate what you've signed yourself up for. This doesn't apply to tarmac riding of course!

I am an intermediate rider and am trying my best to be able to handle a large bike as well as an average rider can handle a small one, but I'm doing this for the challenge and not to make my life easier. I am also planning an African trip and am keeping going with a smaller bike an option if I don't feel my skill level is appropriate for the 990. Having said that I do plan to take in as much dirt as I can on that trip, and won't be chasing tarmac as a rule.

To the chain comments above, it's true that a chain is easier to fix but bear in mind the 990 runs a 525 chain rather than the much more common 520. They generally use a rivet rather than a clip link. To my mind the chain vs. shaft thing isn't worth taking into consideration on a trip like you're planning, based on probability of failure, maintenance required and ease to repair. I'd make the decision elsewhere and accept the drive system that comes with the bike.

Finally, regarding mileage, having gotten to know this bike and the body of knowledge around it they are not shy of high mileage. I would imagine that would hold for the other three brands, too. Of course there's no way to really, really know the history of the bike if it's dealer-serviced with a good history and doesn't appear to be abused there's no problem starting with a 20k mile bike and going from there. You should be fine doing your trip without splitting the engine cases.

My bike was purchased with the same mileage and I am planning to check and/or replace bearings, filters and a couple of known/common fault points before I go, but I'm confident I'll be able to take this motor well over 100,000 kms with by-the-book maintenance and nothing more.

For the record, the 990 probably has the worst fuel consumption of the lot unless you actively ride conservatively. It's consumption is very good until you start twisting your wrist and grinning. If you're having any sort of emotional response you're probably burning a lot of fuel!

Although it's true to say "a bike well looked after will do the mileage you're after" it's also true to say "the more mileage it's done and the more owners it's had the more opportunities it's had to incur damage and wear and tear you can't see".

You may consider stuff like gearbox rebuilds, frayed cables and collapsed wheel bearings as part of the adventure, I don't.

Thanks man, really appreciate your insight. The Tiger has always been my original choice. Have you heard of a guy named Rhys Lawrey? He was given a Tiger for his record-breaking RTW. Fair enough he had the support of the manufacturer and I bet had a few full services done according to Triumph along the way... but as far as he reported, not a single mechanical issue.




The KTM is such an awesome bike... I wonder if it won't be worth the "hassle" of man handling it when the going gets tough, for the sheer joy and majesty of its power and agility.
The fuel economy you mentioned, I'm very aware of that... I've seen reports of people getting 25mpg(!) on these things!!!!! FFS!!! I get more than that on my car!!
Still... how not to love the Beast?


Thanks for all your contributions!!!

Been a few RTW trips on the Tiger, there is a chap in the road at the moment - if you Google 'At The Handlebars' I think you'll find him. Then there was the chap who dropped his off a cliff and replaced the front end with bits off a Lada.

I don't recall major mechanical (as in failure, not gravity related) issues from either of those guys, can't be sure though.

The Forum at www.tiger800.co.uk is a wealth of knowledge on that bike in particular. I should add, as it wasn't clear, both the issues I mentioned have been fixed on the post 15my bikes.

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[ Tim | History - NW Italy/French Rivera, Swiss Alps, Morocco | 2016 - Greece > Albania > Macedonia > Kosovo > Montenegro > Bosnia > Slovenia > Austria ]

I remember one trip riding to eastern Poland where I was on a F650GS twin (essentially a F800GS) and my mate was on a R1150 GS Adventure. We always filled at the same time and each time we did the savings on my refuelling compared to my mate's paid for my evening meal.

Multiply that by 60,000 miles....

__________________
"For sheer delight there is nothing like altitude; it gives one the thrill of adventure
and enlarges the world in which you live," Irving Mather (1892-1966)

As you are sticking mostly to asphalt id personally take the Trumpet 800, the extra cylinder makes it a a lovely smooth ride on long paved roads. For me riding a 990 such a long way on paved roads is a waste, the 990 shines when the pavement ends, however at the end of the day pick the bike that 'does it' for you - don't have any regrets after your RTW that you 'took the wrong bike'

Good Luck!

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Cheers
Grif

'11 KTM 450 EXC
'09 Suzuki DR650
'00 Discovery Series 2 V8
'95 Defender 90 300 Tdi Overlander
http://gipperstravels.blogspot.ca

Hi,
I'm no RTW rider but I do own a gs800 adventure. I've found this bike extremely easy to ride. The mpg is very good. Most of my rides are on Tarmac and I can't fault it. I've read that the 21in front slows the cornering, rubbish. I don't like the position of the battery. Or the fact that there is no under seat storage, but apart from that

As far as you're riding caperbillities. Every day you will get better. And you're confidence will grow. After a week or month you won't be the rider that left home.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

If doing mostly packed dirt or asphalt, I would pick an early BMW GS 1200 from 2004-2005-2006 without servo brakes or ABS. Much lighter and simpler than previous models. No chain to maintain. Driveshafts are usually reliable and will last 200,000km. It gets you 5l/100km. Make sure it has been maintained.

That being said, I am a huge fan of the older Africa Twin as an ultra reliable bike that is very easy to fix. But they are getting collectible and pricey.

BTW if you intend to do some softer roads, you could also use a good old Suzuki DR650 SE. They are work horses.

So true. I've seen some high-mileage bikes that were well-maintained and looked close to new, and I've seen some neglected bikes that were falling apart after a couple of winters.

__________________
Bruce Clarke - 2020 Yamaha XV250

I met him the other day here in Sydney! We had a fun day practicing sand riding on the beach (me on the 990). Great guy and a very interesting looking bike, with a very interesting history.